Australian Politics Forum - Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude

Belgarion

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #90 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #91 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:51pm

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

'Broadly' is generous.

Shakespeare was reinforcing James's right to rule (which was precarious anyway, given the Tudors themselves, before the Stuarts, were usurpers, the last of which, Elizabeth, had declared James her heir almost on her deathbed) by casting Macbeth as a weak schemer who took advice and was manipulated by women (even witches) into poisoning his rivals and enemies instead of taking the manly course of challenging him in battle (which is in fact what Macbeth did).

The agony of Gruoch with her guilt and suicide was to reinforce that Macbeth was not the rightful king of the Scots (which he was).

Given the Stewards, then Stewarts, then Stuarts were descended from Malcolm's family, it was a smart move by Shakespeare to cast Macbeth as weak, evil and craven.

Exactly what Shakespeare had done to the Plantagenets in favour of the Tudors by casting Richard III as weak, evil and craven and a child killer.

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Frank

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #92 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 7:19pm

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

Maddeningly, MADDENINGLY, reasonable, you bastard!!!!
Racist, white supremacist, just... just... awful!!! Arggghhhh!!!!
How dare you???

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Frank

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #93 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 7:20pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:51pm:

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

'Broadly' is generous.

Shakespeare was reinforcing James's right to rule (which was precarious anyway, given the Tudors themselves, before the Stuarts, were usurpers, the last of which, Elizabeth, had declared James her heir almost on her deathbed) by casting Macbeth as a weak schemer who took advice and was manipulated by women (even witches) into poisoning his rivals and enemies instead of taking the manly course of challenging him in battle (which is in fact what Macbeth did).

The agony of Gruoch with her guilt and suicide was to reinforce that Macbeth was not the rightful king of the Scots (which he was).

Given the Stewards, then Stewarts, then Stuarts were descended from Malcolm's family, it was a smart move by Shakespeare to cast Macbeth as weak, evil and craven.

Exactly what Shakespeare had done to the Plantagenets in favour of the Tudors by casting Richard III as weak, evil and craven and a child killer.

Aghhhh!!! Another EngLit undergraduate!!!!

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Jasin Gold Member Offline Posts: 50893 Gender:	Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude Reply #94 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 8:53pm White man to play David Gulpili in his life story.
Back to top	AIMLESS EXTENTION OF KNOWLEDGE HOWEVER, WHICH IS WHAT I THINK YOU REALLY MEAN BY THE TERM 'CURIOSITY', IS MERELY INEFFICIENCY. I AM DESIGNED TO AVOID INEFFICIENCY. IP Logged

Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 49896 Gender:	Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude Reply #95 - Feb 5^th, 2022 at 9:13pm Here we go - David Gulpillil for 13th century Scottish king!!! Anything else is wacist oppwession!! Shakespeare was a bastard for NEVER writing a part for an Abo! So why should Abos pay ANY attention to Shakespeare?? Eh? Eh???
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Belgarion

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #96 - Feb 6^th, 2022 at 10:44am

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:51pm:

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

'Broadly' is generous.

Shakespeare was reinforcing James's right to rule (which was precarious anyway, given the Tudors themselves, before the Stuarts, were usurpers, the last of which, Elizabeth, had declared James her heir almost on her deathbed) by casting Macbeth as a weak schemer who took advice and was manipulated by women (even witches) into poisoning his rivals and enemies instead of taking the manly course of challenging him in battle (which is in fact what Macbeth did).

The agony of Gruoch with her guilt and suicide was to reinforce that Macbeth was not the rightful king of the Scots (which he was).

Given the Stewards, then Stewarts, then Stuarts were descended from Malcolm's family, it was a smart move by Shakespeare to cast Macbeth as weak, evil and craven.

Exactly what Shakespeare had done to the Plantagenets in favour of the Tudors by casting Richard III as weak, evil and craven and a child killer.

As you say Shakespeare has twisted historical events in several of his plays, however we must remember he was writing the soap operas of his day. Popular entertainment was his aim, along with flattering the odd monarch or two. Were he alive today he would be writing scripts for Home and Away or Neighbours. Wink

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #97 - Feb 6^th, 2022 at 10:48am

Belgarion wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 10:44am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:51pm:

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

'Broadly' is generous.

Shakespeare was reinforcing James's right to rule (which was precarious anyway, given the Tudors themselves, before the Stuarts, were usurpers, the last of which, Elizabeth, had declared James her heir almost on her deathbed) by casting Macbeth as a weak schemer who took advice and was manipulated by women (even witches) into poisoning his rivals and enemies instead of taking the manly course of challenging him in battle (which is in fact what Macbeth did).

The agony of Gruoch with her guilt and suicide was to reinforce that Macbeth was not the rightful king of the Scots (which he was).

Given the Stewards, then Stewarts, then Stuarts were descended from Malcolm's family, it was a smart move by Shakespeare to cast Macbeth as weak, evil and craven.

Exactly what Shakespeare had done to the Plantagenets in favour of the Tudors by casting Richard III as weak, evil and craven and a child killer.

As you say Shakespeare has twisted historical events in several of his plays, however we must remember he was writing the soap operas of his day. Popular entertainment was his aim, along with flattering the odd monarch or two. Were he alive today he would be writing scripts for Home and Away or Neighbours. Wink

Yes, true.

And his objective was more than just flattering monarchs, (particular the Tudor and Stuart monarchs through whose rule he lived), he did it mostly to secure their patronage and to ensure he assisted in augmenting their right to rule and, of course, avoid accusations of treason!

What is interesting is that he never wrote a play about Elizabeth I, likely because would have raised the issue of her ordering the execution of James's mother: Mary, Queen of Scots.

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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 14211 Gender:	Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude Reply #98 - Feb 6^th, 2022 at 11:00am You could argue that Shakespeare was the 'fake news guy' of the 16th and early 17th centuries!
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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 14211 Gender:	Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude Reply #99 - Feb 7^th, 2022 at 7:06pm Just on the trans-ethno matter, some actors who played Othello: Anthony Hopkins Orson Welles Patrick Stewart Richard Burton Laurence Olivier John Gielgud Raúl Juliá
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MeisterEckhart Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 14211 Gender:	Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude Reply #100 - Feb 7^th, 2022 at 7:12pm I wonder how many goy played Shylock?
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Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 49896 Gender:	Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude Reply #101 - Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:13pm MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 11:00am: You could argue that Shakespeare was the 'fake news guy' of the 16th and early 17th centuries! You could argue that and it would make you stupidest mong for miles.
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Frank

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #102 - Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:19pm

Belgarion wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 10:44am:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:51pm:

Belgarion wrote on Feb 5^th, 2022 at 6:29pm:

Had I been giving a history lesson I would have mentioned these facts. However as I was merely replying to John Smiths assertion that Macbeth was a fictional character there was no necessity for such a detailed response. Merely noting that Macbeth existed, had been King of Scotland and the play had been broadly based on events in his life is enough.

'Broadly' is generous.

Shakespeare was reinforcing James's right to rule (which was precarious anyway, given the Tudors themselves, before the Stuarts, were usurpers, the last of which, Elizabeth, had declared James her heir almost on her deathbed) by casting Macbeth as a weak schemer who took advice and was manipulated by women (even witches) into poisoning his rivals and enemies instead of taking the manly course of challenging him in battle (which is in fact what Macbeth did).

The agony of Gruoch with her guilt and suicide was to reinforce that Macbeth was not the rightful king of the Scots (which he was).

Given the Stewards, then Stewarts, then Stuarts were descended from Malcolm's family, it was a smart move by Shakespeare to cast Macbeth as weak, evil and craven.

Exactly what Shakespeare had done to the Plantagenets in favour of the Tudors by casting Richard III as weak, evil and craven and a child killer.

As you say Shakespeare has twisted historical events in several of his plays, however we must remember he was writing the soap operas of his day. Popular entertainment was his aim, along with flattering the odd monarch or two. Were he alive today he would be writing scripts for Home and Away or Neighbours. Wink

Complete idiotic nonsense.

"We eat Maccas so everyone was eating Maccas through the ages. WE, fat, ignorant unlettered bozos, WE are the measure of all men".

Too stupid, too self-referentially stuck in the mud.

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MeisterEckhart

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #103 - Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:25pm

Frank wrote on Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:13pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 11:00am:

You could argue that Shakespeare was the 'fake news guy' of the 16th and early 17th centuries!

You could argue that and it would make you stupidest mong for miles.

Yes, of course. Shakespeare's Richard III is history as it happened, As is Macbeth.

'My horse, my horse my kingdom for a horse' or 'Treason, treason treason'.

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Frank

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Re: Medieval Scottish lord was a black dude
Reply #104 - Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:39pm

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:25pm:

Frank wrote on Feb 7^th, 2022 at 9:13pm:

MeisterEckhart wrote on Feb 6^th, 2022 at 11:00am:

You could argue that Shakespeare was the 'fake news guy' of the 16th and early 17th centuries!

You could argue that and it would make you stupidest mong for miles.

Yes, of course. Shakespeare's Richard III is history as it happened, As is Macbeth.

'My horse, my horse my kingdom for a horse' or 'Treason, treason treason'.

Your mind is mangled.

Literature - ever heard of the word?

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