Australian Politics Forum - Cases high in Victoria and NSW.

Bias_2012 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 10766 Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #750 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:18pm Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:07pm: Am I? That graph is not relevant to Australia numpty. The ratio in Australia is much closer
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Bias_2012 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 10766 Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #751 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:19pm Flip
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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51474 Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #752 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:28pm All the figures I see are similar—a big overrepresentation from the unvaxxed.
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greggerypeccary Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 151362 Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #753 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:35pm Bias_2012 wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:18pm: Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:07pm: Am I? That graph is not relevant to Australia numpty. The ratio in Australia is much closer
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SadKangaroo

Gold Member

Online

Not sad, just paying attention
to how cooked it is

Posts: 22063
Meeanjin (Brisbane)

Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW.
Reply #754 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:40pm

Bobby. wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 11:44am:

SadKangaroo wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 11:24am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 11:11am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 10:58am:

Pages of speculation, even a million of them, do not constitute evidence. You have been told this a million times. No live viruses were used.

The virus likely came from the Wuhan wet market, what evidence there is points to that as the source. Just like a wet market in Arkansas or Alabama started the Spanish Flu.

You need to read those 42 pages first -

then explain why the Chinese didn't allow a full WHO inspection?
What were they hiding?

Sure, but you've just admitted to there being no evidence, there was no inspection.

It looks sus, yes, and it's a possibility, yes, but evidence means you have proof, for which you don't.

42 pages of theories, speculation and opinion is not proof.

The burden of proof, and the definition of evidence, you can't simply change these things because you believe it.

I know that's been normalised in a post Trump era, but in reality it doesn't work that way.

At the same time, a lack of proof doesn't mean that it isn't a bioweapon either.

That's another mistake people make, a lack of proof doesn't automatically "prove" the opposing view. At the same time, if someone asks for proof of a claim, it doesn't mean they subscribe to the opposing view either, it just means they want proof in order to change their opinions on the matter.

These are some of the most basic concepts of reality that seem to be cast aside all to easy by those who push misinformation and conspiracies, claiming that they're true, who then get all butthurt when you call them out for falling victim to the conspiracy...

So if a suspected murderer doesn't allow the police
to enter their house to look for the murder weapon and
to check out their computer and look
for any other evidence he should be set free -
and told - it's all OK -
we won't charge you with anything - you're innocent?

No, it means at that point in time, the lack of evidence means we don't know if he murdered the victim or not.

It's possible he did, but there is no evidence yet to support it.

The police could get a warrant if they have demonstrated to a judge that he is the likely killer and keep searching for the evidence to prove it.

At the same time, we can't in fact charge him on those grounds alone, because there is no evidence...

I don't get why you find this concept so difficult to understand.

Sadly, with China, if they don't want to allow anyone to enter their country to investigate, we're stuck at that stage of being without evidence, even if it looks possible that it was a lab leak.

Your problem is that you've taken the "it's possible to be a lab leak", then made an assumption that because they won't allow inspectors to check that not only was it a lab leak, but it was a deliberate bioweapon and the pages of your speculating about that, you now deem "evidence".

Even though by your own analogy above, you've proven that it is not in fact evidence.

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Bobby.

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Australian Politics

Posts: 118436
Melbourne
Gender: male

Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW.
Reply #755 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 4:47pm

SadKangaroo wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:40pm:

No, it means at that point in time, the lack of evidence means we don't know if he murdered the victim or not.

It's possible he did, but there is no evidence yet to support it.

The police could get a warrant if they have demonstrated to a judge that he is the likely killer and keep searching for the evidence to prove it.

At the same time, we can't in fact charge him on those grounds alone, because there is no evidence...

I don't get why you find this concept so difficult to understand.

Sadly, with China, if they don't want to allow anyone to enter their country to investigate, we're stuck at that stage of being without evidence, even if it looks possible that it was a lab leak.

Your problem is that you've taken the "it's possible to be a lab leak", then made an assumption that because they won't allow inspectors to check that not only was it a lab leak, but it was a deliberate bioweapon and the pages of your speculating about that, you now deem "evidence".

Even though by your own analogy above, you've proven that it is not in fact evidence.

The Chinese went further -
when ScoMo suggested that a full inquiry should take place
the Chinese increased tariffs on our produce
and weaponised trade deals in response.
The Chinese are nothing but criminal scum who
think that international doesn't apply to them.

https://www.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3107228/china-australia-relat...

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SadKangaroo Gold Member Online Not sad, just paying attention to how cooked it is Posts: 22063 Meeanjin (Brisbane)	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #756 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 9:55pm And you're entitled to that opinion. I'm not disputing it, I'm not supporting, I'm simply saying you have no evidence to support it, which is true.
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Bobby.

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Australian Politics

Posts: 118436
Melbourne
Gender: male

Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW.
Reply #757 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 9:58pm

SadKangaroo wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 9:55pm:

And you're entitled to that opinion.

I'm not disputing it, I'm not supporting, I'm simply saying you have no evidence to support it, which is true.

It's just as bad as the man caught leaving the scene
of a murder with a smoking gun.
That's no evidence either - is it?

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51474 Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #758 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 10:02pm Opinios, speculations, what-ifs are not evidence, not a “smoking gun.”
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Big Donger

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Australian Politics

Posts: 101713

Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW.
Reply #759 - Jan 31^st, 2022 at 11:49pm

SadKangaroo wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 11:24am:

Bobby. wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 11:11am:

Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 10:58am:

Pages of speculation, even a million of them, do not constitute evidence. You have been told this a million times. No live viruses were used.

The virus likely came from the Wuhan wet market, what evidence there is points to that as the source. Just like a wet market in Arkansas or Alabama started the Spanish Flu.

You need to read those 42 pages first -

then explain why the Chinese didn't allow a full WHO inspection?
What were they hiding?

Sure, but you've just admitted to there being no evidence, there was no inspection.

It looks sus, yes, and it's a possibility, yes, but evidence means you have proof, for which you don't.

42 pages of theories, speculation and opinion is not proof.

The burden of proof, and the definition of evidence, you can't simply change these things because you believe it.

I know that's been normalised in a post Trump era, but in reality it doesn't work that way.

At the same time, a lack of proof doesn't mean that it isn't a bioweapon either.

That's another mistake people make, a lack of proof doesn't automatically "prove" the opposing view. At the same time, if someone asks for proof of a claim, it doesn't mean they subscribe to the opposing view either, it just means they want proof in order to change their opinions on the matter.

These are some of the most basic concepts of reality that seem to be cast aside all to easy by those who push misinformation and conspiracies, claiming that they're true, who then get all butthurt when you call them out for falling victim to the conspiracy...

Exactly. We'll have to wait and see what happens, no?

Until then, he's guilty.

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Sprintcyclist Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 41433 Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #760 - Feb 1^st, 2022 at 12:24am greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 31^st, 2022 at 12:35pm: .................. https://i.redd.it/yy8vmap4pdc81.jpg very good graph
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Bobby. Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 118436 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #761 - Feb 1^st, 2022 at 8:22am Covid numbers today 1.2.22. NSW 30 dead 12,818 cases. Victoria 34 dead 11,311 cases. They are dropping like flies - poor buggers. https://covidlive.com.au/
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Bias_2012

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Australian Politics

Posts: 10766
Gender: male

Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW.
Reply #762 - Feb 1^st, 2022 at 10:02am

Bobby. wrote on Feb 1^st, 2022 at 8:22am:

Covid numbers today 1.2.22.

NSW 30 dead 12,818 cases.

Victoria 34 dead 11,311 cases.

They are dropping like flies - poor buggers.

https://covidlive.com.au/

Nearly half of those dead would have been vaccinated - politicians are too embarrassed to talk about it any longer, they've moved on to election campaigning, Covid is taking a back seat, getting elected is much more important

I'll bet they don't talk about the sub-continent guy who dumped his wife in a bath of acidic chemicals, killing her, in North Parramatta ... "Multicultural Enrichment" I think it's called

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Jovial Monk

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Posts: 51474
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Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW.
Reply #763 - Feb 1^st, 2022 at 10:26am

Unless 95% of the seriously ill or deaths are among the vaccinated then the vaxx is doing its work. With comorbidities etc yes some of the double vaxxed plus booster will die.

Let us assume 95% are double vaxxed:

1. If the vaccines did not work and caused serious ill health/deaths then you would expect the number of seriously ill to be ≥ 95% of the seriously ill;

2. If the number of deaths etc from the vaxx are negligible but the vaxx did not work then you would expect the number of seriously ill to be ≈ 95% of the seriously ill;

3. If the number of serious side effects is negligible, which it is, and the vaccines work, which they do, then you would expect the number of seriously ill to be less than 95% of the seriously ill which is the case.

Basically, if the number of double vaxxed and seriously ill are 50% of the total number of seriously ill then you have a sixteen times better chance of not being seriously ill or dead from COVID.

If politicians do not dwell on the number of double vaccinated among those seriously ill it is because idiots would assume the vaxx don’t work and the antivaxx movement gains momentum.

As to people ‘dropping like flies” it is a simile done to death. HM die each day in NSW & Vic? What proportion of deaths are due to COVID?

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« Last Edit: Feb 1^st, 2022 at 10:33am by Jovial Monk »

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Big Donger Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 101713	Re: Cases high in Victoria and NSW. Reply #764 - Feb 1^st, 2022 at 10:30am We'll have to wait and see about that, Monk. Until then, Fauci and Pfizer invented covid with the Chinese to get back Mr Trump. They then got Dominion to switch the votes in the erection. It's quite common, it happens all the time.
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