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Socialism (Read 26452 times)
Dnarever
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Re: Socialism
Reply #375 - Jul 28th, 2026 at 6:42pm
 
lee wrote on Jul 26th, 2026 at 12:58pm:


Where Capitalists have no worry about your money - they know that they already have it all.

In reality it is just a different branch of the same thing.
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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #376 - Jul 28th, 2026 at 7:43pm
 
Dnarever wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 6:42pm:
Where Capitalists have no worry about your money - they know that they already have it all.


Nope. I have my own bank account and it is in credit. Roll Eyes
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Dnarever
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Re: Socialism
Reply #377 - Jul 29th, 2026 at 3:42pm
 
lee wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 7:43pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 6:42pm:
Where Capitalists have no worry about your money - they know that they already have it all.


Nope. I have my own bank account and it is in credit. Roll Eyes


According to productivity increases you should have well more than doubled what you currently have and worked a 3 day week to get there. That difference is what turned millionairs into billionairs and soon trillionairs. They kept the lot - all of it while your share of your productivity remained stagnant for decades.
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« Last Edit: Jul 29th, 2026 at 3:52pm by Dnarever »  
 
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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #378 - Jul 29th, 2026 at 4:28pm
 
Dnarever wrote on Jul 29th, 2026 at 3:42pm:
According to productivity increases you should have well more than doubled what you currently have and worked a 3 day week to get there.



That all depends on what motivates you. I am more motivated with helping others than simply amassing money. Roll Eyes
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #379 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:37pm
 
lee wrote on Jul 29th, 2026 at 4:28pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 29th, 2026 at 3:42pm:
According to productivity increases you should have well more than doubled what you currently have and worked a 3 day week to get there.



That all depends on what motivates you. I am more motivated with helping others than simply amassing money. Roll Eyes


Your mistake: the dysfunctional economic system you support is the reason why others  need your help aka your charity.

In case you haven't heard, the desire for change in the current system is the reason why ON and other non-mainstream parties are winning in the polls.

 


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« Last Edit: Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:42pm by thegreatdivide »  
 
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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #380 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:49pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:37pm:
Your mistake: the dysfunctional economic system you support is the reason why others  need your help aka your charity.



Ah so that means the CCP directly support charity. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:37pm:
In case you haven't heard, the desire for change in the current system is the reason why ON and other non-mainstream parties are winning in the polls.



It isn't the change that is wanted, they want more of the same.  They want more in hand. Wink
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #381 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:59pm
 
lee wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 1:24pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 12:48pm:
But c-i-govts don't need your money, by definition: they need to avoid inflation while maximizing economic growth - and dealing with market failure....



And as I have said printing money devalues the money already in existence.


And you are merely proving you are incapable of reading or comprehending an argument put to you.

"Increasing the money supply does not always immediately or fully devalue a currency", because... etc etc - read the quote again.

Understand?

ie, when productivitiy increases eg assited with robots, then more money in the  economy will increase supply and living standards without causing inflation.

https://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1645944963/1485#1497
#1497

Quote:
That is the essence of inflation


No it isnt: Friedman's monetarist theory of inflation is incorrect; unresolved competition for available resources is the cause of inflaton.

   
Quote:
The more you devalue your money....


Erroneous premise: "prining money"  won't devalue the currency when productivity is increasing.



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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #382 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:09pm
 
lee wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 7:43pm:
Dnarever wrote on Jul 28th, 2026 at 6:42pm:
Where Capitalists have no worry about your money - they know that they already have it all.


Nope. I have my own bank account and it is in credit. Roll Eyes


Who cares.

Many  people are in chronic financial stress  in the current c-o-l crisis.

Which is why even people with jobs are seeking financial assistance and aid from charities.

Courtesy your dysfunctional  Neoclassical economics.

Deplorable.   


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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #383 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:24pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:09pm:
Who cares.




Because the statement was "they" already have it, which was obviously false. Cool

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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #384 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:29pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:59pm:
And you are merely proving you are incapable of reading or comprehending an argument put to you.

"Increasing the money supply does not always immediately or fully devalue a currency", because... etc etc - read the quote again.



Ah all those "IF's" that must come true before it is inflationary. So it doesn't need to happen immediately therefore it can be ignored? Oh it may also not fully devalue the currency? Isn't that still a devaluation?. Cool
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #385 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:31pm
 
lee wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:49pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:37pm:
Your mistake: the dysfunctional economic system you support is the reason why others  need your help aka your charity.


Ah so that means the CCP directly support charity. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin


Your error: the CCP doesn't support charity nor the dole; the CCP oversees continuous productivity gains ....but China IS running into problems maintaining full employment - now that Trump is rejecting WTO free-trade rules which resulted in the US's de-industrialization, courtesy of your delusional Neoclassical economics.

Quote:
It isn't the change that is wanted, they want more of the same.  They want more in hand. Wink


Your error (being a blind Neoclassical ideologue): people have always wanted a fair deal from government  ie wages capable of funding housing, education, health, and transport for families 

Woirkers have always had to bargain with bosses, but until recently the mainstream parties were able to attract centre L - R voters from the electorate.   

No longer the case, hence soc. Dems in the US and populist Right figures elsewhere are hoovering up the votes of the electorate.

The question is: can "don't rock the boat"  Burnham succeed where Starmer and the Conservatives before him failed. 
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #386 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:34pm
 
lee wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:24pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:09pm:
Who cares.



Because the statement was "they" already have it, which was obviously false. Cool



Your wealth is irrelevent to a discusioin about a functional  economy in which  can prosper.
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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #387 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:44pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:31pm:
the CCP doesn't support charity nor the dole; the CCP oversees continuous productivity gains ....but China IS running into problems maintaining full employment - now that Trump is rejecting WTO free-trade rules which resulted in the US's de-industrialization, courtesy of your delusional Neoclassical economics.



Tell that to the Uighurs about being paid for productivity gains. Grin Grin Grin Grin Grin


thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:31pm:
people have always wanted a fair deal from government  ie wages capable of funding housing, education, health, and transport for families 


Which is what I said. They want MORE. Cool

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:31pm:
Woirkers have always had to bargain with bosses, but until recently the mainstream parties were able to attract centre L - R voters from the electorate.   



Of course they have. Otherwise it would be communism where the worker controls everything. And we know how that went. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:31pm:
No longer the case, hence soc. Dems in the US and populist Right figures elsewhere are hoovering up the votes of the electorate.



The Soc Democrats are centre left, which partially explains their popularity. We will see how it transfers after government. Roll Eyes

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:31pm:
can "don't rock the boat"  Burnham succeed where Starmer and the Conservatives before him failed. 


Seeing as he still supports Nut Zero -NO.
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thegreatdivide
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Re: Socialism
Reply #388 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:45pm
 
lee wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:29pm:
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 3:59pm:
And you are merely proving you are incapable of reading or comprehending an argument put to you.

"Increasing the money supply does not always immediately or fully devalue a currency", because... etc etc - read the quote again.



Ah all those "IF's" that must come true before it is inflationary. So it doesn't need to happen immediately therefore it can be ignored? Oh it may also not fully devalue the currency? Isn't that still a devaluation?. Cool


It can be ignored if it doesn't happen immediately, eg if government spending its own money increases productive output; or  eg the c-i-government can reduce inflation by subcontracting the building industry (as required) to rebuild the nation's public-housing stock at no cost to taxpayers, thereby stabilizing/reducing house prices and lowering rents.

thus eliminating a major cause of inflation in the economy.


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lee
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Re: Socialism
Reply #389 - Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:48pm
 
thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:45pm:
It can be ignored if it doesn't happen immediately, eg if government spending its own money increases productive output; or  eg the c-i-government can reduce inflation by subcontracting the building industry (as required) to rebuild the nation's public-housing stock at no cost to taxpayers, thereby stabilizing/reducing house prices and lowering rents.


Nope. All; it does is kick the can down the road. Cool

How is Albo's reducing house prices going? People not in the market because of genuine fears that a fall in the market will lead to mortgages exceeding values. It has also not lowered rents. Cool

thegreatdivide wrote on Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:45pm:
thus eliminating a major cause of inflation in the economy.



Truly stupid. Grin Grin Grin Grin

From duck.ai "es—all else equal, increasing the money supply tends to devalue a currency because it raises the amount of money relative to goods and services.

Key intuition:

    More money chasing the same goods → prices tend to rise (inflation), so each unit of the currency buys less.
    If that inflation is higher than other countries, your currency often loses value in exchange rates (depreciation) because investors expect a weaker purchasing power going forward.

A useful way to phrase the relationship is:

    Money supply ↑ ⇒ expected inflation ↑ ⇒ purchasing power ↓ (and often exchange rate value ↓).

Caveat (still consistent with the statement): the effect depends on why money supply increases and whether the economy can expand output. If more money corresponds to more real production, inflation/devaluation may be smaller.

That of course does not line up with Australa's decreasing productivity. Cool
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« Last Edit: Aug 2nd, 2026 at 4:56pm by lee »  
 
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