Australian Politics Forum - Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....

Brian Ross

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #135 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 11:52am

Frank wrote on Nov 1^st, 2020 at 11:45am:

Not submitting to Islam's demand = 'islamophobia'.

No, it does not, Soren as well you know. "Islamopobia" is attacking Islam or Muslims universally and unnecessarily because you fear them. Time you grew up and faced the music of your own hatred. It is an exact mirror image of what you oppose. Islamists hate Christianity and the West just like you hate Islam and Muslims. You'd be perfectly happy if you only faced Islamists but you don't so you demonise the Muslims and their religion in order to justify your persecution of them. Rather like the Nazis did to the Jews. You are the new Nazis, just as the Islamists are... Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

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Yadda

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #136 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 12:45pm

Frank wrote on Nov 1^st, 2020 at 11:45am:

A Western country standing up for its own values after it is brutally attacked by Islam = Muslims are the victims again.

Not submitting to Islam's demand = 'islamophobia'.

IMAGE...

Abdul Nacer Ben Brika

Quote:

August 4, 2005
Australian Islamic leader defends jihad

"I am telling you that my religion doesn't tolerate other religion.

It doesn't tolerate," he said.

"The only one law which needs to spread, it can be here or anywhere else, is Islam."

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2005-08-04/australian-islamic-leader-defends-jihad/20...

.

frank,

As far as i can see, Emmanuel Macron has not taken any action yet, to protect the French social principles of

Liberte, Egalite, and Fraternite

, from those who are seeking to impose ISLAMIC values, in France !

And like all quibbling [or is that quisling] pollies, Macron has only publicly acknowledged that the enemy of France, are those 'awful' 'ISLAMIC extremists'.

Waiting for the day, for Macron to publicly acknowledge, that mainstream ISLAMIC teachings and doctrines are unacceptable in France.

But, he won't do it.

Ever.

'recant' is a French origin word isn't it, Frank ?

What about 'surrender' ?

What about 'appeasement' ?

"WWII French small arms for sale, never fired in combat and only dropped once."

contact; Commander in chief - Emmanuel Macron

.

Yadda said.....
http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1570367530/2#2
Quote:

MY ARGUMENT;
1/ Every moslem is a follower of ISLAM.

2/ And ISLAM is a philosophy which mandates that its followers must fight and kill people, who reject ISLAM, and the primacy of ISLAMIC law.

And, a new attack is going to occur whenever any individual moslem [living among us, in Australia] decides that 'now' is a good moment for him to prove his devotion to ISLAM and to Allah.

.

"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran.....should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on earth."

- CAIR Chairman Omar M. Ahmad, July 1998

And.....the aim of ISLAM in France, isn't for moslems, to enjoy equality with their French hosts !!

n.b.
The ISLAMIC texts below ARE NOT SOURCED FROM 'ISLAMIC extremists'.

The ISLAMIC texts below are sourced from mainstream ISLAM's 'most holy' and authoritative text, the inerrant Koran.

Dictionary;
inerrant = = incapable of being wrong.

And the mainstream ISLAMIC precepts sourced from within the inerrant Koran, encourage hatred and violence against 'disbelievers'.

"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. "
Koran 9.29

"Thou wilt not find any people who believe in Allah and the Last Day, loving those who resist Allah and His Messenger, even though they were their fathers or their sons, or their brothers, or their kindred...."
Koran 58.22

"O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers."
Koran 9.23

"....take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends....
......he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them."
Koran 5.51

"Fighting [against disbelievers] is prescribed for you, and [if] ye dislike it.....Allah knoweth, and ye know not."
Koran 2.216

"O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you, and let them find harshness in you, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him)."
Koran 9.123

"Allah hath purchased of the believers their persons and their goods; for theirs (in return) is the garden (of Paradise): they fight in His cause, and slay and are slain:...."
Koran 9.111

"Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves....."
Koran 48.29

"There is for you an excellent example (to follow) in Abraham and those with him, when they said to their people: "We are clear of you and of whatever ye worship besides Allah: we have rejected you, and there has arisen, between us and you, enmity and hatred for ever,- unless ye believe in Allah and Him alone"....."
Koran 60:4

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Johnnie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #137 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 5:01pm

The candles and flowers have been put in the recycle bin, Macron sent in a few extra cops and stopped talking about freedom of expression when the Muslims are around. He is now back in his chateau sipping on some champagne and munching on croissants.

The Muslims win this round with only three dead and one with her head cut cut off.

Plus the teacher.

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« Last Edit: Nov 1^st, 2020 at 5:33pm by Johnnie »

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Frank Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 50995 Gender:	Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of..... Reply #138 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 6:46pm Muslims cut off heads - and a week later they are even more of a victim than before their rampage!!! You have to be tinted to be murderous AND the victim. No golden haired blue eyed child would be afforded similar victim status after beheading his nanny. Crazy times.
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Brian Ross

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #139 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 7:38pm

Frank wrote on Nov 1^st, 2020 at 6:46pm:

Muslims cut off heads - and a week later they are even more of a victim than before their rampage!!! You have to be tinted to be murderous AND the victim. No golden haired blue eyed child would be afforded similar victim status after beheading his nanny.

Crazy times.

Must have been crowded in that church with 1.6 billion Muslims all wielding their scimitars, Soren. Real crowded, 'cause that is what you saying, all Muslims, even the ones on the other side of the world, the little kiddies, the old crones, every one of them committed this crime. Tsk, tsk. Such Islamophobia, such blanket condemnation of every person who is a Muslim, hey?

Grow up little man or the next time a Christian Terrorist commits their Terrorism, guess who wears the blame? Next time a secular Terrorist commits their Terrorism, guess who wears the blame? You and all your Islamophobe mates. Roll Eyes

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« Last Edit: Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 10:55am by Brian Ross »

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 50272 At my desk.	Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of..... Reply #140 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 7:42pm Brian is right. Most Muslims just stand back and say things like "tough titties, off with their heads".
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Valkie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #141 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 9:25pm

freediver wrote on Nov 1^st, 2020 at 7:42pm:

Brian is right. Most Muslims just stand back and say things like "tough titties, off with their heads".

Muzzos are the consummate cowards.

Until they have greater numbers they hide and claim victim status.

But when there are enough of them, they go full fanatic muzzo nutcase.

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I HAVE A DREAM
A WONDERFUL, PEACEFUL, BEAUTIFUL DREAM.
A DREAM OF A WORLD THAT HAS NEVER KNOWN ISLAM
A DREAM OF A WORLD FREE FROM THE HORRORS OF ISLAM.

SUCH A WONDERFUL DREAM
O HOW I WISH IT WERE TRU

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Johnnie Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 12485 Gender:	Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of..... Reply #142 - Nov 1^st, 2020 at 10:40pm At least there have been no beheadings here, lots of stabbings in the neck and people being run over but no beheadings.
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Bertie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #143 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 3:28pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 30^th, 2020 at 10:33pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 30^th, 2020 at 10:04pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 29^th, 2020 at 8:04pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 29^th, 2020 at 6:45pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:47pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:40pm:

Every Islamic extremist attack over the past five years has been shocking and disturbing. In France alone, around 250 people have been massacred by radical Islamists since 2015. But there is something especially horrific about the premeditated targeting of a teacher for doing his job – that is, encouraging his pupils to think critically. Parents of his pupils say he was a kind, enthusiastic teacher who always encouraged children to think about issues in depth. Sophie Vénétitay of the SNES-FSU teachers’ union was right to say that he was murdered for doing what good teachers are meant to do – ‘teach critical thought’. This attack targeted one man, but its aim was to terrorise an entire republic; to send a dire, Middle Ages-style warning to public servants that they will put themselves in danger if they dare, in the terrorist’s own words, to ‘belittle Muhammad’.

Again, it is in your own words, "one terrorist". Is it fair to target all Muslims because of what, "one terrorist" has done, Agatha? Really?

Really. What do all Muslims share with that 'one terrorist' of every day? Islam. That common link must be addressed. For you to insist that Islam, that single thing that binds all Islamic terrorists to all other Muslims, is the ONE thing that must not be invertered and dealt with is collaborationist and traitorous.

What does Breivik the Norwegian Terrorist share with all Right Wingers, Agatha? What about Brenton Harrison Tarrant? Belief in Right wing policies. Belief in that Xenophobia works. Should we treat all Right Wingers the same way?

Then we have Christian Terrorists like Mark Anthony Conditt, he liked to blow up churches. Funny that, should all Christians be judged the way he was? Roll Eyes

Quote:

You would never say anything remotely similar when looking at violence and political agitation by ANY other group. To your mind, ONLY Muslims can and do separate their ideology from their actions. Everyone else acts in accordance with them, except Muslims. You cannot possibly believe what you are advocating.

Christians often refuse to admit that Christian Terrorists exist. Moses, does. However, the evidence suggests otherwise. Time you realised that everything you accuse Muslims of, Christians have done and continue to do. Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

You are not honest about this. Everyone is aware that there is Islamic jihad, that Muslims kill innocent Westerners for triflings.

Au contraire, Agatha, I am being far more honest that you and your fellow Islamophobes. I learnt the lessons about persecution that the Holocaust taught, that you choose to ignore - you cannot apply blanket persecution and claim you were provoked into it. Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

Quote:

Westerners are trying to accommodate Muslims but it is never enough, Muslims demand more and more special treatment in Western countries that take them in. Muslim refugees kill the people who took them in.

Some do, most don't, Agatha. Until you can work out the differences between an Islamist and a Muslim, it looks like you're pretty well fooked.

Why are lying? Why do you choose to persecute innocent people who have committed no crime? They are just believers in a different religion, nothing more. You have no personal experience of ordinary, everyday, peaceful, moderate, law-abiding Muslims. Agatha you are hardly a judge on them. Run along, now. Go down the nearest Mosque and meet a few... Roll Eyes

It's not persecution to notice that Muslims kill people for trifles and then justify it simply by referring to their bruised feelings, as if Muslims' feelings were the final arbiters of freedom in Western countries and were sufficient explanations even for murders.

Beheading churchgoers, school teachers, cartoonists, rampaging through streets slashing and shooting for Islam is simply not on. There is no justification for it, there is no excuse for it. Noticing that it is happening and calling Muslims out over it is NOT PERSECUTION. But you try to make it out as if it was persecution - that is the big lie and dishonesty of your argument.
You are no different from the Muslims who trample on pictures of Macron for no better reason than for his defending his own country's values and citizens. Speaking up for your own Western country is now 'persecution' of Muslims.

How twisted and deeply disturbing.

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Brian Ross

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #144 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:33pm

Bertie wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 3:28pm:

It's not persecution to notice that Muslims kill people for trifles and then justify it simply by referring to their bruised feelings, as if Muslims' feelings were the final arbiters of freedom in Western countries and were sufficient explanations even for murders.

To you they are trifles but to many Muslims they are not. Christians used to kill heretics and apostates for "trifles", do you condemn them as well or do they get a get out of goal free card? Christians in India and Africa kill people for "trifles", do you condemn them as well? Roll Eyes

Quote:

Beheading churchgoers, school teachers, cartoonists, rampaging through streets slashing and shooting for Islam is simply not on. There is no justification for it, there is no excuse for it. Noticing that it is happening and calling Muslims out over it is NOT PERSECUTION.

Couldn't agree more, Agatha. Why do you condemn all those Muslims who don't do that? Tsk, tsk. Islamophobia. Roll Eyes

Quote:

But you try to make it out as if it was persecution - that is the big lie and dishonesty of your argument.

Looks like persecution, smells like persecution, to me, Agatha. Appears you just believe blanket condemnation of all Muslims will actually achieve anything other than more Muslims becoming Islamist after they get pissed off at you even more. What will that achieve, exactly? Mmmm? Roll Eyes

Quote:

You are no different from the Muslims who trample on pictures of Macron for no better reason than for his defending his own country's values and citizens. Speaking up for your own Western country is now 'persecution' of Muslims.

Wrong. Care to produce a statement, by myself with a link to it, where I had condemned Macron or any other leader for simply "defending his country's values and citizens?" Look forward to seeing you back your statements with evidence. Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

Quote:

How twisted and deeply disturbing.

Yes you are, Agatha. Deeply disturbing. Deeply twisted. Roll Eyes

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Bertie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #145 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:36pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:47pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:40pm:

Every Islamic extremist attack over the past five years has been shocking and disturbing. In France alone, around 250 people have been massacred by radical Islamists since 2015. But there is something especially horrific about the premeditated targeting of a teacher for doing his job – that is, encouraging his pupils to think critically. Parents of his pupils say he was a kind, enthusiastic teacher who always encouraged children to think about issues in depth. Sophie Vénétitay of the SNES-FSU teachers’ union was right to say that he was murdered for doing what good teachers are meant to do – ‘teach critical thought’. This attack targeted one man, but its aim was to terrorise an entire republic; to send a dire, Middle Ages-style warning to public servants that they will put themselves in danger if they dare, in the terrorist’s own words, to ‘belittle Muhammad’.

Again, it is in your own words, "one terrorist". Is it fair to target all Muslims because of what, "one terrorist" has done, Agatha? Really? I'd much rather that the Intelligence Services and the Police were targeting that, "one terrorists" and his supporters, rather than spending endless hours wasting their time following moderate, law-abiding, non-violent Muslims all over the countryside. Australia is unique, we have excellent counter-terrorism efforts, they spend their time on the Islamists who might cause problems, not on the moderate, law-abiding, non-violent Muslims. Roll Eyes

Who shares the mindset and the values and aims of Islamic terrorists. That is the point.

Enabling Islamic terrorism is making the crimes possible. Muslims are enabling and hiding and defending their jihadists.
If there were no quiet supporters, these Islamists could not exist, they would be eliminated by their own communities. But they aren't - they pop up everywhere, all the time.

I am not aware of a network of Brevikistas or Tarrantistas or McVeighistas or Unabomberistas being rounded up. They were really isolated actors.
Not so with Islamic jihadists. Islam and its societies are tribal and so there is always multiple arrests in connection to every Islamic attack.

Islamic teachings ARE a significant factor in Islamic terrorism. Islamic ideology IS a significant factor. Islam IS a factor. It is not islamophobia to recognise the obvious. It is unacceptable to wanting to ignore it as you do.

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Bertie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #146 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:47pm

Brian Ross wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:33pm:

Bertie wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 3:28pm:

It's not persecution to notice that Muslims kill people for trifles and then justify it simply by referring to their bruised feelings, as if Muslims' feelings were the final arbiters of freedom in Western countries and were sufficient explanations even for murders.

To you they are trifles but to many Muslims they are not.

They should get out of France and the West if they want to maintain their 'right' to kill people over cartoons and other trivia. I find it unbelievable that you are so invested in trying to find a way to justify and excuse murders for cartoons. It is truly abhorrent and stomach-turning.

You must be a Muslims or an isolated, lonely person who hasn't interacted with the world for years and has built a private fantasy world inhabited only by yourself (as others have been saying you are).

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Bertie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #147 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:49pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:31pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:09pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 24^th, 2020 at 10:38pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 24^th, 2020 at 9:25pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 24^th, 2020 at 7:20pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 24^th, 2020 at 3:58pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 24^th, 2020 at 3:26pm:

moses wrote on Oct 24^th, 2020 at 3:20pm:

Could you tell us where are the muslims, who are calling for the qur'an to be changed, in order to stop the global problem we face with fundamentalist muslims?

Or are you just lying again?

Nope. They, like Christians just reinterpret what their prophet(s) said, Moses. You completely ignore half of the Bible when it suits you. You know, the "Old Testament" that driving force of so many Christian Terrorists? Oh, dearie, dearie, me, caught out again, hey? Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

I have never seen a reinterpretation of the Koran, probably because, being eternal and unchangeable, no believing Muslim would ever think of updating it.

No updating is required. All that is required is a reinterpretation and a re-emphasis on the peaceful aspects of the writing, exactly as most Christians have done. Since WWII, Christians have forgotten the warrior aspects of their religion. In WWI, Germany had "Got mit uns" on the belt buckles of their troops, "God with us". Germany once referred to it's own troops as "huns" when they attacked China during the Boxer Rebellion. The French, the British, all preached about "warrior spirit" from the Pulpit quite happily. It is amazing how short sighted your memory is, Agatha... Roll Eyes

Quote:

The Bible, not having such restrictions, spawns reformations every other day.

Except in those believers who have read and understood the messages contained in the Old Testament, an integral part of every Bible. Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

There is no Muslim reinterpretation.
The Koran is not open to reinterpretation, being eternal and unchangeable, Allah's word from the beginning to all eternity.. How do you 'reinterpret' that?

Same thing happens amongst conservative Christians, Agatha. They're particularly fond of the King James version of the Bible, seeing it as "inspired by God." Personally, I prefer the King Charles version which was largely destroyed by Oliver Cromwell. Conservative Christians are so much like Conservative Muslims, it really isn't funny. They both seek harsh punishments for relatively minor crimes. Funny that, you could interchange them and not really notice all that difference. Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

I have never heard of a Christian beheading a Muslim school teacher. Nor have you.

Oh, I agree, Agatha, completely. How about Christians killing Muslims for well, being Muslims? Tsk, tsk. Roll Eyes

So you want to compare apples with kidney stones now?

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Bertie

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #148 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:59pm

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:31pm:

No, the point I am making is that the two are, "similar". You do understand the difference between, "identical" and "similar", don't you, Agatha. Use Google if you want... Roll Eyes

You look to me as someone scrambling and avoiding honesty. What is identical in Christianity and Islam? What is merely 'similar', for YOUR argument?

I don't need to Google what you may or may not mean. You should be able to articulate it.

And what's with the silly eye rolling? You are not withholding anything, 'hahaha' - you don't even articulate or defend your points. Quit the silly emoticons. Don't hint, articulate if it's in you. Eye-rolling is not an argument.i

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Brian Ross

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Re: Samuel Paty beheading, in the wake of.....
Reply #149 - Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 8:07pm

Bertie wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2020 at 5:36pm:

Brian Ross wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:47pm:

Bertie wrote on Oct 26^th, 2020 at 3:40pm:

Every Islamic extremist attack over the past five years has been shocking and disturbing. In France alone, around 250 people have been massacred by radical Islamists since 2015. But there is something especially horrific about the premeditated targeting of a teacher for doing his job – that is, encouraging his pupils to think critically. Parents of his pupils say he was a kind, enthusiastic teacher who always encouraged children to think about issues in depth. Sophie Vénétitay of the SNES-FSU teachers’ union was right to say that he was murdered for doing what good teachers are meant to do – ‘teach critical thought’. This attack targeted one man, but its aim was to terrorise an entire republic; to send a dire, Middle Ages-style warning to public servants that they will put themselves in danger if they dare, in the terrorist’s own words, to ‘belittle Muhammad’.

Again, it is in your own words, "one terrorist". Is it fair to target all Muslims because of what, "one terrorist" has done, Agatha? Really? I'd much rather that the Intelligence Services and the Police were targeting that, "one terrorists" and his supporters, rather than spending endless hours wasting their time following moderate, law-abiding, non-violent Muslims all over the countryside. Australia is unique, we have excellent counter-terrorism efforts, they spend their time on the Islamists who might cause problems, not on the moderate, law-abiding, non-violent Muslims. Roll Eyes

Who shares the mindset and the values and aims of Islamic terrorists. That is the point.

Enabling Islamic terrorism is making the crimes possible. Muslims are enabling and hiding and defending their jihadists.
If there were no quiet supporters, these Islamists could not exist, they would be eliminated by their own communities. But they aren't - they pop up everywhere, all the time.

I am not aware of a network of Brevikistas or Tarrantistas or McVeighistas or Unabomberistas being rounded up. They were really isolated actors.
Not so with Islamic jihadists. Islam and its societies are tribal and so there is always multiple arrests in connection to every Islamic attack.

Islamic teachings ARE a significant factor in Islamic terrorism. Islamic ideology IS a significant factor. Islam IS a factor. It is not islamophobia to recognise the obvious. It is unacceptable to wanting to ignore it as you do.

No one denies that, Agatha. What is being denied is that all Muslims use the same interpretation that some Muslims, referred to as "Islamists" do. It is like comparing Christian extremists, such as Opus Dei or the Family to ordinary Christians. Doesn't do the Christians any service. Speaking of Christian extremists, where is you condemnation of their acts, their Terrorism? Don't be like Moses and proclaim there is nothing Christian about the Terrorists who delight in blowing up Abortion Clinics, etc. They do exist and they are inspired by Christianity.

What you appear unable or unwilling in your Islamophobia to understand, Islamists invariably target ordinary, everyday, moderate Muslims first and foremost to try and frighten them into supporting their interpretation of Islam. The reason why they attack Westerners is doublefold. They seek to provoke Western armed response which invariably just targets Muslims, not Islamists to scare the Muslims into their fold. They also seek to kill or maim some unbelievers. Your attacks on Muslims are just doing what they want, do you realise that? Roll Eyes

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