Australian Politics Forum - Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere

Gordon

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Gordon
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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #30 - Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 1:00pm

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

You're as stupid as the day is long.

Nobody cares about you and the solar panels you've never own because you're too poor to own house with a roof to put them on and you'll never be able to afford an electric car Grin

Hydrogen offsets/stores renewable energy and it's being pushed by Australia's Chief Scientist. Are you more qualified than he?

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #31 - Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:13pm

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 1:00pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

You're as stupid as the day is long.

Nobody cares about you and the solar panels you've never own because you're too poor to own house with a roof to put them on and you'll never be able to afford an electric car Grin

Hydrogen offsets/stores renewable energy and it's being pushed by Australia's Chief Scientist. Are you more qualified than he?

So just because you want to take it up the arse at the hydrogen fool bowser doesn't mean everyone else does. You'd have to be totally stupid wouldn't you just so some liberal flunky gets to enjoy being a CEO of H2 Fools Incorporated Cheesy

LOL

Funny how you lot whinge about having to pay $$$ for a BEV but no complaints having to pay $$$ for a hydrogen electric vehicle. That's how you brain dead libbos really think. Bow down to the hydrogen fool CEO's and their hare brained hydrogen fool businesses Cheesy

LOL

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SadKangaroo

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Meeanjin (Brisbane)

Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #32 - Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

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SadKangaroo

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to how cooked it is

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Meeanjin (Brisbane)

Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #33 - Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:25pm

Personally, I'd like to see NASA develop the technology for sourcing hydrogen from ice on Mars using the lower solar availability for their manned missions there.

Once they have this technology perfected in such a way that it's reliable and robust enough for those conditions plus the trip there while at the same time mobile enough to get it there in the first place, that will eventually lead to the "rooftop solar" version of HFC for home use.

Yes, we're still faced with water issues, but we can work on more than one problem at a time.

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #34 - Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 8:52pm

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

What can't they do ???

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"If you take out Saddam, I guarantee you that it will have enormous positive reverberations on the region..." - Benjamin Netanyahu in 1995

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SadKangaroo

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Not sad, just paying attention
to how cooked it is

Posts: 22201
Meeanjin (Brisbane)

Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #35 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 7:30am

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 8:52pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

What can't they do ???

My regular commute, in the before time, was about a 300km round trip, 3 days a week, with 150km the other 2, but that's just to head office. I would regularly have to drive to the individual sites, often 5 in one day, from Byron Bay to Noosa. I can't rely on an EV to have that sort of range. Plus there is bugger al charging stations up this way, although it's getting better. But it is pretty amazing you can see where they are and how many stations are free when needed and have that factored into the nav etc.

I almost bought a Tesla last month, but I had to be practical. In the end, went for the hybrid Rav4.

But that's just a regular Joe's workweek. I'm talking commercial application, freight etc. Maybe one day, but there is that fine ratio of power needed to cart around the batteries vs what's left for the actual vehicle and its load, sort of like launching things into space where batteries efficiency needs to improve.

And it is.

But the argument used against HFC applies here, EV and current batteries are just not ready. Tesla are making great strides and they Truck looked great, but the specs just aren't there, yet.

But HFC has none of those problems but even then it is a replacement for standard fuels, not EV. They will always be side by side, if HFC ever gets off the ground, which like EVs, unless a billionaire comes in and starts trying to get the tech mainstream, there are too many vested interests and lobby groups in the way.

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Gordon

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Gordon
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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #36 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:48am

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:13pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 1:00pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

You're as stupid as the day is long.

Nobody cares about you and the solar panels you've never own because you're too poor to own house with a roof to put them on and you'll never be able to afford an electric car Grin

Hydrogen offsets/stores renewable energy and it's being pushed by Australia's Chief Scientist. Are you more qualified than he?

So just because you want to take it up the arse at the hydrogen fool bowser doesn't mean everyone else does. You'd have to be totally stupid wouldn't you just so some liberal flunky gets to enjoy being a CEO of H2 Fools Incorporated Cheesy

LOL

Funny how you lot whinge about having to pay $$$ for a BEV but no complaints having to pay $$$ for a hydrogen electric vehicle. That's how you brain dead libbos really think. Bow down to the hydrogen fool CEO's and their hare brained hydrogen fool businesses Cheesy

LOL

Wooosh. That was the sound of my point, and the point the smart scientists are making about hydrogen. Excess wind/solar gets sent to produce hydrogen. That hydrogen can be used to create electricity when wind/solar production lower than demand. The hydrogen can also be used to power vehicle if that ever takes off.

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Prime Minister for Canyons

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #37 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:51am

Gordon wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:48am:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:13pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 1:00pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

You're as stupid as the day is long.

Nobody cares about you and the solar panels you've never own because you're too poor to own house with a roof to put them on and you'll never be able to afford an electric car Grin

Hydrogen offsets/stores renewable energy and it's being pushed by Australia's Chief Scientist. Are you more qualified than he?

So just because you want to take it up the arse at the hydrogen fool bowser doesn't mean everyone else does. You'd have to be totally stupid wouldn't you just so some liberal flunky gets to enjoy being a CEO of H2 Fools Incorporated Cheesy

LOL

Funny how you lot whinge about having to pay $$$ for a BEV but no complaints having to pay $$$ for a hydrogen electric vehicle. That's how you brain dead libbos really think. Bow down to the hydrogen fool CEO's and their hare brained hydrogen fool businesses Cheesy

LOL

Wooosh. That was the sound of my point, and the point the smart scientists are making about hydrogen. Excess wind/solar gets sent to produce hydrogen. That hydrogen can be used to create electricity when wind/solar production lower than demand. The hydrogen can also be used to power vehicle if that ever takes off.

Sounds good.

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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

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Gordon

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Gordon
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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #38 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:59am

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 7:30am:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 8:52pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

What can't they do ???

My regular commute, in the before time, was about a 300km round trip, 3 days a week, with 150km the other 2, but that's just to head office. I would regularly have to drive to the individual sites, often 5 in one day, from Byron Bay to Noosa. I can't rely on an EV to have that sort of range. Plus there is bugger al charging stations up this way, although it's getting better. But it is pretty amazing you can see where they are and how many stations are free when needed and have that factored into the nav etc.

I almost bought a Tesla last month, but I had to be practical. In the end, went for the hybrid Rav4.

But that's just a regular Joe's workweek. I'm talking commercial application, freight etc. Maybe one day, but there is that fine ratio of power needed to cart around the batteries vs what's left for the actual vehicle and its load, sort of like launching things into space where batteries efficiency needs to improve.

And it is.

But the argument used against HFC applies here, EV and current batteries are just not ready. Tesla are making great strides and they Truck looked great, but the specs just aren't there, yet.

But HFC has none of those problems but even then it is a replacement for standard fuels, not EV. They will always be side by side, if HFC ever gets off the ground, which like EVs, unless a billionaire comes in and starts trying to get the tech mainstream, there are too many vested interests and lobby groups in the way.

Doing longer trips won't really give you optimal efficiency from your Hybrid tho. What a pity they didn't make a plug-in version you could get 50km of pure electric from.

I like the Rav but need something bigger so will look at a hybrid Kluger/Santa Fe in 2 or 3 years.

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #39 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 11:01am

Gordon wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:59am:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 7:30am:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 8:52pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

What can't they do ???

My regular commute, in the before time, was about a 300km round trip, 3 days a week, with 150km the other 2, but that's just to head office. I would regularly have to drive to the individual sites, often 5 in one day, from Byron Bay to Noosa. I can't rely on an EV to have that sort of range. Plus there is bugger al charging stations up this way, although it's getting better. But it is pretty amazing you can see where they are and how many stations are free when needed and have that factored into the nav etc.

I almost bought a Tesla last month, but I had to be practical. In the end, went for the hybrid Rav4.

But that's just a regular Joe's workweek. I'm talking commercial application, freight etc. Maybe one day, but there is that fine ratio of power needed to cart around the batteries vs what's left for the actual vehicle and its load, sort of like launching things into space where batteries efficiency needs to improve.

And it is.

But the argument used against HFC applies here, EV and current batteries are just not ready. Tesla are making great strides and they Truck looked great, but the specs just aren't there, yet.

But HFC has none of those problems but even then it is a replacement for standard fuels, not EV. They will always be side by side, if HFC ever gets off the ground, which like EVs, unless a billionaire comes in and starts trying to get the tech mainstream, there are too many vested interests and lobby groups in the way.

Doing longer trips won't really give you optimal efficiency from your Hybrid tho. What a pity they didn't make a plug-in version you could get 50km of pure electric from.

I like the Rav but need something bigger so will look at a hybrid Kluger/Santa Fe in 2 or 3 years.

They're talking about a hybrid Hilux. That might be good.

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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #40 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 11:21am

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 7:30am:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 8:52pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

What can't they do ???

My regular commute, in the before time, was about a 300km round trip, 3 days a week, with 150km the other 2, but that's just to head office. I would regularly have to drive to the individual sites, often 5 in one day, from Byron Bay to Noosa. I can't rely on an EV to have that sort of range. Plus there is bugger al charging stations up this way, although it's getting better. But it is pretty amazing you can see where they are and how many stations are free when needed and have that factored into the nav etc.

I almost bought a Tesla last month, but I had to be practical. In the end, went for the hybrid Rav4.

But that's just a regular Joe's workweek. I'm talking commercial application, freight etc. Maybe one day, but there is that fine ratio of power needed to cart around the batteries vs what's left for the actual vehicle and its load, sort of like launching things into space where batteries efficiency needs to improve.

And it is.

But the argument used against HFC applies here, EV and current batteries are just not ready. Tesla are making great strides and they Truck looked great, but the specs just aren't there, yet.

But HFC has none of those problems but even then it is a replacement for standard fuels, not EV. They will always be side by side, if HFC ever gets off the ground, which like EVs, unless a billionaire comes in and starts trying to get the tech mainstream, there are too many vested interests and lobby groups in the way.

You're talking rubbish of not being ready. Most people would make use of the technology as it is and not wait until their is some magical battery that charges itself from thin air.

In the US and Europe they have thousands of charging stations everywhere. I don't hear scumo and co talking about installing charging stations as part of their energy solution. Why ??

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #41 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 11:28am

Gordon wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:48am:

Wooosh. That was the sound of my point, and the point the smart scientists are making about hydrogen. Excess wind/solar gets sent to produce hydrogen. That hydrogen can be used to create electricity when wind/solar production lower than demand. The hydrogen can also be used to power vehicle if that ever takes off.

That sounds exactly like a description of a battery !! Why do I need to pay someone to store excess energy in hydrogen molecules when I can store it at home using my own battery chemistry and not have to pay for it ?? Better still some EV's have bi-directional charging so you can utilize the car as bulk storage for excess energy from rooftop solar and then later on use that energy at night Wink

And where are these hydrogen vehicles ? Still coming or anther 20 years off ??

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"If you take out Saddam, I guarantee you that it will have enormous positive reverberations on the region..." - Benjamin Netanyahu in 1995

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Prime Minister for Canyons

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #42 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 11:31am

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 11:28am:

Gordon wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:48am:

Wooosh. That was the sound of my point, and the point the smart scientists are making about hydrogen. Excess wind/solar gets sent to produce hydrogen. That hydrogen can be used to create electricity when wind/solar production lower than demand. The hydrogen can also be used to power vehicle if that ever takes off.

That sounds exactly like a description of a battery !! Why do I need to pay someone to store excess energy in hydrogen molecules when I can store it at home using my own battery chemistry and not have to pay for it ?? Better still some EV's have bi-directional charging so you can utilize the car as bulk storage for excess energy from rooftop solar and then later on use that energy at night Wink

And where are these hydrogen vehicles ? Still coming or anther 20 years off ??

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_hydrogen_internal_combustion_engine_vehicl...

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In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy)

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Prime Minister for Canyons Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 26906 Canberra Gender:	Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere Reply #43 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 11:33am https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Mirai https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyundai_Nexo
Back to top	In a time of universal deceit — telling the truth is a revolutionary act. No evidence whatsoever it can be attributed to George Orwell or Eric Arthur Blair (in fact the same guy) IP Logged

SadKangaroo

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Re: Hydrogen is creeping in everywhere
Reply #44 - Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 2:12pm

Gordon wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 10:59am:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 23^rd, 2020 at 7:30am:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 8:52pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 2:22pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:53pm:

Gordon wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:36pm:

SadKangaroo wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:33pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Sep 22^nd, 2020 at 12:22pm:

Robot wrote on Aug 27^th, 2020 at 7:38pm:

So these energy companies are generating electricity using wind turbines and then storing some of it in hydrogen, for later use.

Looks like renewable energy has solved it's intermittency problem.

Man, this has really owned the greenies!

Worse still they want to convert hydrocarbons into hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Why would anyone pay for hydrogen when they can charge up their battery electric car for nothing from rooftop solar Cheesy

LOL

Totally brain dead liberals as usual.

Hydrogen isn't a replacement for EV.

It's a replacement for traditional petroleum.

It's a replacement for coal and batteries. Hydrogen can be made by any source then used to create leccy. Apparently the tech to go from solar to hydrogen to leccy has just passed an efficiency milestone to make it viable.

That's totally brain dead !!

Why would i want to pay scumos cronies for their hydrogen rubbish when I can charge up a battery EV directly from rooftop solar ?? Doesn't make any sense to pay for others solar PV to generate hydrogen Cheesy

LOL

Let's be clear, EVs can't do what Petrol cars can now. We know this.

But, EV is still more efficient in terms of energy required to power, than HFC.

So HFC will be the future for anything, not just automotive, where the battery limitations are involved. So freight transportation, long drives etc.

But like EVs need electricity to charge their batteries, HFC requires electricity to produce the hydrogen.

We still need a clean way to create that electricity in large volumes.

We're at the point where being glued to a single technology is as bad as partisan politics.

We will need a mix of different technologies for different applications to overcome our current issues.

It's going to be a mix of Renewables, home renewables, Nuclear, Coal, Hydrogen "storage", HFC Cars and EVs.

What can't they do ???

My regular commute, in the before time, was about a 300km round trip, 3 days a week, with 150km the other 2, but that's just to head office. I would regularly have to drive to the individual sites, often 5 in one day, from Byron Bay to Noosa. I can't rely on an EV to have that sort of range. Plus there is bugger al charging stations up this way, although it's getting better. But it is pretty amazing you can see where they are and how many stations are free when needed and have that factored into the nav etc.

I almost bought a Tesla last month, but I had to be practical. In the end, went for the hybrid Rav4.

But that's just a regular Joe's workweek. I'm talking commercial application, freight etc. Maybe one day, but there is that fine ratio of power needed to cart around the batteries vs what's left for the actual vehicle and its load, sort of like launching things into space where batteries efficiency needs to improve.

And it is.

But the argument used against HFC applies here, EV and current batteries are just not ready. Tesla are making great strides and they Truck looked great, but the specs just aren't there, yet.

But HFC has none of those problems but even then it is a replacement for standard fuels, not EV. They will always be side by side, if HFC ever gets off the ground, which like EVs, unless a billionaire comes in and starts trying to get the tech mainstream, there are too many vested interests and lobby groups in the way.

Doing longer trips won't really give you optimal efficiency from your Hybrid tho. What a pity they didn't make a plug-in version you could get 50km of pure electric from.

I like the Rav but need something bigger so will look at a hybrid Kluger/Santa Fe in 2 or 3 years.

Yeah, they are all downfalls of it, but it's better than nothing.

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