https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/at-least-20-dead-in-shootout-betw...

The escalating border conflict between China and India has edged closer to war.

Early Tuesday morning, the two powers exchanged gunfire in a disputed Himalayan border region, leaving 20 Indian soldiers dead and reportedly killing or wounding at least 43 Chinese troops.

Officials say it is the first time in 45 years that the long-running border fight between the two nuclear powers has led to fatalities, leading diplomatic observers to warn that both nations must act quickly to stop the dispute spiralling out of control.

Members of the non-governmental organisation Madadgaar Parivar protest against the killing of Indian soldiers by Chinese troops, in Ahmedabad on June 16. Picture: AFP
Members of the non-governmental organisation Madadgaar Parivar protest against the killing of Indian soldiers by Chinese troops, in Ahmedabad on June 16. Picture: AFP
At the heart of the dispute is the mountainous and poorly marked border region between the two nations.

India believes that China has been illegally occupying territory on its side of the Line of Actual Control, or LAC. In May, China made a further push into what India says is it’s territory, sending at least 5,000 troops to dig in along the Pangong Tso lake which takes in one of China’s strategic approaches into India.

According to a spokesman for the Indian army three soldiers were initially killed but “17 Indian troops who were critically injured in the line of duty (taking) total that were killed in action to 20”.

Meanwhile, in keeping with its pattern of aggressive actions followed by heartfelt claims that Beijing is the victim, Chinese foreign ministry spokesman Zhao Lijian claimed that it was in fact India was the aggressor, “provoking and attacking Chinese personnel, resulting in serious physical confrontation between border forces on the two sides”.

India denied any such claims, with the Army stating that “India is very clear that all its activities are always within the Indian side of the LAC. We expect the same of the Chinese side.”

While Beijing has not released any of its own casualty figures from the incident, India TV News reports that intercepts from Chinese intelligence suggest China suffered 43 casualties including dead and seriously injured.

In 1962, the two nations fought the Sino-Indian War over the disputed territory, resulting in an Indian defeat, though not a final resolution of the issue between the two nations.

In 1975, the last time the border conflict led to fatalities, an Indian patrol was ambushed by Chinese troops in the Arunachal Pradesh region.

In response to the conflict, a spokesman for UN Secretary General Antonio Guterres urged both sides to undertake “maximum restraint” to “de-escalate the situation”.


why is it not declared a no go zone to all.?

I doubt either Country will escalate this.  That northern border has always been contentious.  And stick your no go zone up yer clacker.  They each stay their own side of the border.

Yellow Man of China, gotta show those Black Indians and White Russians who the 'Mass Production Man' is in Asia.

Blacks Mass Produce in Africa
Yellows Mass Produce in Asia
Blues Mass Produce in Europe
Reds Mass Produce in Namerica
Browns Mass Produce in Middle-East
Greens Mass Produce in Samerica
Greys Mass Produce in Oceania
Whites Mass Produce in Sahul (Oz)...
...we succeed here, where the Slavics failed via Russia's expansionism of the USSR.

Everyone has their place.
A Blue in Africa would be the Surgeon,
while a Blue in Oceania would be the Doctor. 

chimera wrote on Jun 17^th, 2020 at 2:17pm:

Everyone but the most stupid of CCP stooges guessed what the CCP would do to deflect culpability from the virus...

Hong Kong, the India border dispute, feint incursions into Taiwan (already done with incursions into Taiwanese airspace), the South China Sea...  The western provinces are also an option...

The CCP is a predictable hate machine... like Stalinism, like National Socialism.

The CCP didn't invent Stalinism or National Socialism... it's just aping them... like monkeys...

The dispute between India and China border along the Tibet region had been ongoing for well over 100 years.  It is very complicated, and not as simple and straight forward as you all believe here. 

On India's side, they believe in the McMahon line, which was the line drew by Ser Henry McMahon at the 1914 Simla convention between British and Tibetan respresentatives.  At the time, Tibet was sort in limbo, because it was just after the last Chinese Emperial Qing Dynasty, and the Chinese Nationalist government then havent not gotten to Tibet.  As such, even until now, both Chinese government: the CCP and also the Taiwain - government (the nationalist government of China at the time) do not support the McMahon line. 

On Chinese side, both CCP and Taiwan government supports the line of actual control.  Which is called the Macartney-Macdonald line, which was proposed to the Qing government by Sir Claude MacDonald - a British convoy to Beijing in 1899. 

The difference is the section of Aksai Chin proper on the East side to belong to the Chinese, and the west is part is fairly consistent with the McMahon's line. 

The 1962 India and Chinese war happened during a time of great interest.  The Russians and the US were locked in Cuban missile crisis, whilst the Russians and Chinese were having their own dispute.  As a result, the Russians aided India when the west would not.  And then of course, is the Tibetan uprising and India's call for Tibetan independence.  And the rest is history. 

After the invasion, the Chinese withdrew back to north of Line of actual control - after they were very close to Dehli.  And their frosty border disputes continued until this day. 

According to BBC, the current standoff started in recent months over a new road India built in Ladakh, along the line of Actual control which divides the sides.  China then responded by deploying troops, and building military infrastructures of its own in the disputed territory, bringing the two sides to clash. 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-53062484

So, there are complicating issues:
India wants the McMahon line.  But the CCP and Taiwan do not support it. 
And even the Tibetans does not support India's version, because, they believe India is taking away their territory of Askin Chin.   In fact they believe areas to the south of Askin Chin to be their territory as well.   

chimera wrote on Jun 18^th, 2020 at 12:32pm:


Well, it was a fight.  The Chinese wanted Tibet, after it was in limbo during world war 2 and the civil war that followed.   And wanted the original 1899 line of actual control. 

India wanted parts of Tibet, and wanted to have an independent Tibet to wedge the Chinese.

It is funny that both the line of Actual Control and McMahon line was drew and submitted by the British.  And it is examples like this dotted all over the world.  The British Empire will go in and colonize a place, draw a border that no one in the region agrees, and sow the seed for future conflict in the region.

chimera wrote on Jun 18^th, 2020 at 1:07pm:


India still wants the McMahon line, which the Chinese dispute.  And because the Chinese sort of won the 1962 war, the stalemate currently is at the actual line of control. 

And do not forget Tibet.  India supports independent Tibet movement.  So strategically, by having the border at McMahon line, the free Tibetans can potentially have more readily access to Tibet - via the new road that India built and can expand upon, and then using the roads that the Chinese built so far. 

India is no fool, they are playing the long game.  Their ambition is the McMahon line, which includes parts of Tibet and leave the rest to the Tibetans to duke out with the Chinese.   The Chinese of course, will not have a bar of that..

What is the correct estimation of India? China has a base in Sri Lanka and Pakistan and is starting in the Maldives. It walked over India in the war and voluntarily stepped back.
Its roads in the Himalayas are beyond India's standards and their economies and military spending are China's way. The Dalai Lama accepts Indian rule in Arunachal Pradesh so that's as good as India will get.  Any further adventures to expand are stubbornly foolish.