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Australia's myopia (Read 3110 times)
Captain Nemo
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #15 - Apr 1st, 2019 at 11:09pm
 
Speaking of crappy infrastructure ...

The Altona oil refinery (near Melbourne) is about 70 years old and there are, literally, lines in that plant than no one knows where they run and which valves do what.

Seriously, that place is a monumental environmental time-bomb.

One day it will go up with a bang.  Shocked
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #16 - Apr 2nd, 2019 at 6:20pm
 
Air Vice Marshal (retired) John Blackburn has written extensively on the subject from both a military and a civilian viewpoint. In a recent issue of the Australian Defence Magazine he said that ‘energy security is fundamental to our way of life; without it and without resilient supply chains our Defence Forces will not be able to operate’. Last October he told a Senate committee hearing that ‘Australia was the only country in the world that didn’t have either government-owned reserves, mandated industry minimums for fuel stocks, or the ability to control the market. All other developed countries have some of those things at least, and countries in the region here are increasing their fuel and oil stock holdings because of their concerns’.

He rightly castigates the federal government for being asleep at the wheel over this matter.  But it’s more than just the fact that successive Australian governments have since
2010
ignored their international obligation to maintain the barest minimum reserve of liquid fuels
. It’s the reckless mindset that those governments reveal by the fact that throughout those years they were willing to risk the safety of every Australian that they had pledged an oath to serve and protect. What would have happened to the Australian public had – as was suggested by Liberal Senator Jim Molan – another Middle East war broken out last July in the wake of US airstrikes on Russian targets in Syria? Molan supposed that the oil-fields could have been put out of action for months. What would former PM Malcolm Turnbull have done then, apart from retire to his New York apartment?


2010 - Gillard. Then Rudd, then Abbott, Turnbull, Morrison.  Both sides are asleep.




Australia’s fuel security is far more precarious than we might realise. Not only do we not have the internationally mandated 90-day stockpile, but the ongoing closure of Australia’s refineries means we are on track to be 100% reliant on imported petroleum by 2030.

Australian refineries import roughly 83% of the crude oil they process from more than 17 countries, mainly in Asia (40%), but also Africa (18%) and the Middle East (17%). We are a significant oil producer, but export 75% of our crude production, with the largest recipients being Indonesia and Singapore.

At the same time, the importance of importing refined petroleum from overseas is only increasing as our local production declines.
http://theconversation.com/australia-imports-almost-all-of-its-oil-and-there-are...

It is one, very stark, example of how Australia ignores its own national interests for no obvious reasons. I suspect it has a lot to do with wanting to be 'nice' and enabling of our Asian neighbours.

But it's still myopic and stupid. Singapore refines over 50% of our petroleum supplies - Singapore which imports a lot of the crude from us to refine and sell back.

Crazy. Dumb.



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Brian Ross
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #17 - Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm
 
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #18 - Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:11pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm:
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Well they sure didn't blow billions by relaxing our borders like Labor did.
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Frank
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #19 - Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:36pm
 
It's bipartisan stupid.
It did start with Howard and was continued by Rudd/Gillard/Rudd and not corrected by Abbott/Turnbull/Morrison.


It's a national disgrace, indicative of a national malaise.
That malaise is about policy confidence. self-confidence, a shared and accepted national sense of self. A country that understands itself can assert itself. Australia is a country that refuses to understand itself, invites every undermining, inventing every new way of self-fragmentation, every doubting of its own values.
Australia has been successfully white-anted because nobody today can say what it is to be an Australian without being immediately challenged.

This country, like Canada, the US, UK, most of Europe, has been successfully fvked up by multiculturalists, race-baiters, grievance-mongers.

When all the Western institutions are swept away we will have the naked aggression of tribal, identitarian war because there will be no higher civilistation to stand in its way.






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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #20 - Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:09pm
 
Which is why it is utmost important for Australia to start changing its energy dependance from petrolium to renewables.  Then none of this would be an issue.   If the big cities are electrified, including interstate rail ways.  Then, all we need is perhaps half of strategic reserves.  Or if we are desperate, in times of crisis, we can rebuild our oil refinery capacity - but be able to put the economy back with lesser effort. 

The problem is that we need to hold on to people with the right skills.  I mean after the last refineries closed, how many technician are still left in Australia knows how to operate + maintain, and rebuild a refinary?
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #21 - Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:43pm
 
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:11pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm:
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Well they sure didn't blow billions by relaxing our borders like Labor did.


Nope, they blew billions by continuing to punish people by locking them up in overseas Gulags, Hammer.   I hear they are closing again, only months after re-openning it to much fanfare the Gulag on Christmas Island.  It was buried in the Budget.  Funny that, hey?  Imagine them spending millions just to make a political point against the opposition, which wasn't actually necessary.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


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Brian Ross
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #22 - Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:47pm
 
Frank wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:36pm:
It's bipartisan stupid.
It did start with Howard and was continued by Rudd/Gillard/Rudd and not corrected by Abbott/Turnbull/Morrison.


It's a national disgrace, indicative of a national malaise.
That malaise is about policy confidence. self-confidence, a shared and accepted national sense of self. A country that understands itself can assert itself. Australia is a country that refuses to understand itself, invites every undermining, inventing every new way of self-fragmentation, every doubting of its own values.
Australia has been successfully white-anted because nobody today can say what it is to be an Australian without being immediately challenged.

This country, like Canada, the US, UK, most of Europe, has been successfully fvked up by multiculturalists, race-baiters, grievance-mongers.

When all the Western institutions are swept away we will have the naked aggression of tribal, identitarian war because there will be no higher civilistation to stand in its way.


Sounds like it is something you're looking forward to, Soren.  You got your AR-15, your bunker, your provisions all prepared for that day?   You takin' survival courses?  You learnin' how to live off der land?

Run along, with your fantasies, Soren.   You are one sick individual.  You don't want to live in a modern, liberal, democratic society at all.  You just want to live in your fascist land where you and your like are Übermensch compared to all the Untermensch who will carry out your commands, obey your superior will.    Roll Eyes
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Frank
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #23 - Apr 4th, 2019 at 6:02pm
 
tickleandrose wrote on Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:09pm:
Which is why it is utmost important for Australia to start changing its energy dependance from petrolium to renewables.  Then none of this would be an issue.   If the big cities are electrified, including interstate rail ways.  Then, all we need is perhaps half of strategic reserves.  Or if we are desperate, in times of crisis, we can rebuild our oil refinery capacity - but be able to put the economy back with lesser effort. 

The problem is that we need to hold on to people with the right skills.  I mean after the last refineries closed, how many technician are still left in Australia knows how to operate + maintain, and rebuild a refinary? 

Absolutely.

But not by crippling the energy supply and affordability during that transition period.

THAT'S the big issue, not whether we should switch from finite to infinite energy supplies.

Australia's rivers should be dammed and efficient coal or gas power should be maintained to ensure cheap and reliable electricity. Let those who want to and can afford pay more for renewables do so. that will put money into their development.

Australia's share in global man-made CO2 is vanishingly small and utterly insignificant. Virtue signalling with no impact on global CO2 levels is vain and foolish.

( I don't actually accept that anthropogenic CO2 is a significant factor in any climate variation.)

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Frank
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #24 - Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:08pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:43pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:11pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm:
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Well they sure didn't blow billions by relaxing our borders like Labor did.


Nope, they blew billions by continuing to punish people by locking them up in overseas Gulags, Hammer.   I hear they are closing again, only months after re-openning it to much fanfare the Gulag on Christmas Island.  It was buried in the Budget.  Funny that, hey?  Imagine them spending millions just to make a political point against the opposition, which wasn't actually necessary.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes



It's called follow through.

They were told not to get on people smugglers' boats because they would not get to settle in Australia.  They ignored it. Australia did what it said it would do. Dweadful, isn't it. old pissy.
And so now you complain because you are a spoiled brat at heart, revolting against any attempt to instruct and improve you.

You arwe Bwianesque,  Bwian.



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Brian Ross
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #25 - Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:49pm
 
Frank wrote on Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:43pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:11pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm:
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Well they sure didn't blow billions by relaxing our borders like Labor did.


Nope, they blew billions by continuing to punish people by locking them up in overseas Gulags, Hammer.   I hear they are closing again, only months after re-openning it to much fanfare the Gulag on Christmas Island.  It was buried in the Budget.  Funny that, hey?  Imagine them spending millions just to make a political point against the opposition, which wasn't actually necessary.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


It's called follow through.

They were told not to get on people smugglers' boats because they would not get to settle in Australia.  They ignored it. Australia did what it said it would do. Dweadful, isn't it. old pissy.
And so now you complain because you are a spoiled brat at heart, revolting against any attempt to instruct and improve you.

You arwe Bwianesque,  Bwian.



No one was getting on Smugglers' boats, Soren.  It was all a means to scaring voters who have come to hate innocent Asylum Seekers simply 'cause they arrive by boat.   No mention of the tens of thousands of Asylum Seekers who have arrived by plane in the last two years, Soren.  Funny how the government and il Duce' overlook those people.   They just want to scare voters to vote for them, nothing more and you're a prime candidate for that, right?   Roll Eyes

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Frank
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #26 - Apr 5th, 2019 at 7:29pm
 
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:49pm:
Frank wrote on Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:43pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:11pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm:
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Well they sure didn't blow billions by relaxing our borders like Labor did.


Nope, they blew billions by continuing to punish people by locking them up in overseas Gulags, Hammer.   I hear they are closing again, only months after re-openning it to much fanfare the Gulag on Christmas Island.  It was buried in the Budget.  Funny that, hey?  Imagine them spending millions just to make a political point against the opposition, which wasn't actually necessary.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


It's called follow through.

They were told not to get on people smugglers' boats because they would not get to settle in Australia.  They ignored it. Australia did what it said it would do. Dweadful, isn't it. old pissy.
And so now you complain because you are a spoiled brat at heart, revolting against any attempt to instruct and improve you.

You arwe Bwianesque,  Bwian.



No one was getting on Smugglers' boats, Soren.  It was all a means to scaring voters who have come to hate innocent Asylum Seekers simply 'cause they arrive by boat.   No mention of the tens of thousands of Asylum Seekers who have arrived by plane in the last two years, Soren.  Funny how the government and il Duce' overlook those people.   They just want to scare voters to vote for them, nothing more and you're a prime candidate for that, right?   Roll Eyes




Fifty thousand got on smugglers' boats, ijit.

Plane arrivals are KNOWN, they had a visa, they can be dealt with by proper process. A shite, broken process but that's by the choice of the Australian Government. Giving visa over-staying non-citizens access to the Australian legal system at taxpayer expense is the stupidest aspect of the whole drama. It is motivated and maintained by lilly-livered idiots like you, Bwian. It would be cheaper, neater, juster to deport them at $5,000 a pop than give them access to a legal system that cots hundreds of thousands of dollars in each case.

Clarity of purpose and resolve - that's what is missing and you are all for undermining any efforts in those directions.

Illegal boat arrivals break the law by showing up and continue to be unverifiable and doubtful. People flying to Indonesia from the Middle East on commercial flights and then trying to enter Australia illegally is not what this or any other country needs. Let the Indonesians have them if they are so wonderful. THEY let them into Indonesia legally, after all.





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Brian Ross
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #27 - Apr 5th, 2019 at 8:58pm
 
Frank wrote on Apr 5th, 2019 at 7:29pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:49pm:
Frank wrote on Apr 4th, 2019 at 7:08pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 3rd, 2019 at 2:43pm:
Mr Hammer wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:11pm:
Brian Ross wrote on Apr 2nd, 2019 at 8:10pm:
Blame the Tories, Soren, they were just as guilty as the ALP in this regard.   Abbott, Turnball, ScoMo they've been the last three in charge as Prime Minister.   They must bear the blame equally, even perhaps more so, afterall they are supposedly touted as the "better economic managers" than the ALP, now aren't they?   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

Well they sure didn't blow billions by relaxing our borders like Labor did.


Nope, they blew billions by continuing to punish people by locking them up in overseas Gulags, Hammer.   I hear they are closing again, only months after re-openning it to much fanfare the Gulag on Christmas Island.  It was buried in the Budget.  Funny that, hey?  Imagine them spending millions just to make a political point against the opposition, which wasn't actually necessary.  Tsk, tsk.   Roll Eyes


It's called follow through.

They were told not to get on people smugglers' boats because they would not get to settle in Australia.  They ignored it. Australia did what it said it would do. Dweadful, isn't it. old pissy.
And so now you complain because you are a spoiled brat at heart, revolting against any attempt to instruct and improve you.

You arwe Bwianesque,  Bwian.



No one was getting on Smugglers' boats, Soren.  It was all a means to scaring voters who have come to hate innocent Asylum Seekers simply 'cause they arrive by boat.   No mention of the tens of thousands of Asylum Seekers who have arrived by plane in the last two years, Soren.  Funny how the government and il Duce' overlook those people.   They just want to scare voters to vote for them, nothing more and you're a prime candidate for that, right?   Roll Eyes



Fifty thousand got on smugglers' boats, ijit.


Really?  And how long ago, Soren?  Was it yesterday?  Last week?  Last month?  Or was it over 5 years ago, Mmmm?

Quote:
Plane arrivals are KNOWN, they had a visa, they can be dealt with by proper process. A shite, broken process but that's by the choice of the Australian Government. Giving visa over-staying non-citizens access to the Australian legal system at taxpayer expense is the stupidest aspect of the whole drama. It is motivated and maintained by lilly-livered idiots like you, Bwian. It would be cheaper, neater, juster to deport them at $5,000 a pop than give them access to a legal system that cots hundreds of thousands of dollars in each case.


Immaterial, Soren.  They are Asylum Seekers.  Just like the boat arrivees, they make their presence known to the authorities in order to claim asylum.   Yet, il Duce and ScoMo remain silent about the increasing number.  Funny that, right?

Visa over-stayers are actually illegal immigrants, Soren.  Different category and your inability to differentiate just shows how foolish you are.   Visa overstayers are also increasing in number and guess what?  The majority are from the USA, UK and Europe.  All members of your supposedly "superior culture."  Still doesn't stop them from seeing a good deal and staying longer than their visas allow them to...   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Clarity of purpose and resolve - that's what is missing and you are all for undermining any efforts in those directions.


There is no clarity, there is no resolve, Soren.   ScoMo is running scared and the electorate getting ready their cricket bats to give the Tories a real walloping at the coming election.  He's frantically trying to appease the voters...   Roll Eyes

Quote:
Illegal boat arrivals break the law by showing up and continue to be unverifiable and doubtful. People flying to Indonesia from the Middle East on commercial flights and then trying to enter Australia illegally is not what this or any other country needs. Let the Indonesians have them if they are so wonderful. THEY let them into Indonesia legally, after all.


The Indonesians don't care.  They are not signatories to the UN Convention on Refugees, Soren.   The Australian Government has been paying the Indonesians to put the people smugglers out of business.    Roll Eyes
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« Last Edit: Apr 6th, 2019 at 4:58pm by Brian Ross »  

It seems that I have upset a Moderator and are forbidden from using posting to the general forum now. So much for Freedom of Speech. Tsk, tsk, tsk...   Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #28 - Apr 6th, 2019 at 7:34am
 
Australia produces 10 to 20% of it's own oil, and could probably increase that if it actually became important.

That's more than enough for the military, and you probably wouldn't want to fly to Bali in the middle of a war.
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Re: Australia's myopia
Reply #29 - Apr 6th, 2019 at 10:41am
 
Bias_2012 wrote on Mar 31st, 2019 at 8:22pm:
We could be self sufficient in fuel if we wanted to be, but the anti-Australia Libs and Labs would never allow that to happen, the rest of the world comes first with them

It'd be nice if this project could become fully Australian owned ...

$20 trillion shale oil find surrounding Coober Pedy 'can fuel Australia'

https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/20-trillion-shale-oil-find-surrounding-coobe...



Some projects just need to stay buried..... and shale oil is one of them.

It's dirtier than the dirtiest coal..... and dare I say on a par or worse than hydraulic fracked gas(CSG) extraction.

No use being self sufficient in our own country if we f#*k up our own environment doing it.
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