Australian Politics Forum - Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election

Grendel

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #30 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 19818 Gender:	Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election Reply #31 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 12:59pm: Non-union members receive all the benefits won by the Unions, without paying a cent in fees. Including the AWU's Cleanevent pay deal.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #32 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

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Grendel

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #33 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:27pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:38am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:35am:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:13am:

Its time wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:07am:

Utter crap, I wish it was no ticket no start

I would be happy with no ticket, no union-won benefits with freeloading by non-members banned by law.

It's quite reprehensible that unions negotiate conditions for their members and then non-members get to freeload by accepting the same conditions without paying for them. If that's acceptable, unions should have the right to levy negotiation fees on non-members who enjoy the benefits won by unions. These freeloaders can pay the fees, refuse the conditions or join the union.

That is a pathetic and discriminatory attitude Bam... tsk, tsk, tsk...

For starters not every workplace has union representation. Workers should be universally taken care of by government regulation.

The history of Unions and the people that run them and their politics isn't a particularly democratic, representative, or uncorrupt one.

And yet they all receive sick leave, annual leave, long service leave, meal breaks, etc.

All entitlements won by Unions.

Wakey wakey hand off snakey gwegg.
fair conditions and wages should be universally available for everyone dope.

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« Last Edit: Jul 11^th, 2018 at 11:38pm by Grendel »

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Grendel

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #34 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:28pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

Because they are a Union you idiot... Roll Eyes

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #35 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:32pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:28pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

Because they are a Union you idiot... Roll Eyes

Business unions are involved in politics.

All sorts of unions are.

Why is it that you only want workers' unions excluded from politics?

And, why can't you debate these things in a civil manner - why must every post have a personal insult?

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #36 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:34pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:27pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:38am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:35am:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:13am:

Its time wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:07am:

Utter crap, I wish it was no ticket no start

I would be happy with no ticket, no union-won benefits with freeloading by non-members banned by law.

It's quite reprehensible that unions negotiate conditions for their members and then non-members get to freeload by accepting the same conditions without paying for them. If that's acceptable, unions should have the right to levy negotiation fees on non-members who enjoy the benefits won by unions. These freeloaders can pay the fees, refuse the conditions or join the union.

That is a pathetic and discriminatory attitude Bam... tsk, tsk, tsk...

For starters not every workplace has union representation. Workers should be universally taken care of by government regulation.

The history of Unions and the people that run them and their politics isn't a particularly democratic, representative, or uncorrupt one.

And yet they all receive sick leave, annual leave, long service leave, meal breaks, etc.

All entitlements won by Unions.

Wakey wakey hand of snakey gwegg.
fair conditions and wages should be universally available for everyone dope.

The wages and conditions have been won by the Unions, thanks to the fee paying members.

How is it fair that non-union members benefit from their hard work?

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 19818 Gender:	Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election Reply #37 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:38pm greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:34pm: How is it fair that non-union members benefit from their hard work? Yeah. Bill the saviour of the AWU and cleaners' pay. He must have sweated blood bringing that to fruition.
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greggerypeccary

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #38 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:44pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:28pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

Because they are a Union you idiot... Roll Eyes

Why should that exclude them from being involved in politics?

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Bam

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #39 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 3:01pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

I'm not saying "you" are. That's a strawman.

However, some anti-union employers are quite militant with coercing or even sacking union members not being unusual. This anti-union militancy is encouraged by the Coalition government.
Flags and hard hat slogans banned under new building code

People should be free to choose to become members of any organisation they wish, without any coercion or dissuasion.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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Bam

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #40 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 3:05pm

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:28pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

Because they are a Union you idiot... Roll Eyes

Why shouldn't unions lobby political parties and governments to promote the interests of their members?

Businesses do it. Business unions do it. Farmer unions do it. Wealthy individuals do it. Independent organisations like the IPA or Getup! do it. Why not unions?

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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greggerypeccary

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #41 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 3:51pm

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 3:05pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:28pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

Because they are a Union you idiot... Roll Eyes

Why shouldn't unions lobby political parties and governments to promote the interests of their members?

Businesses do it. Business unions do it. Farmer unions do it. Wealthy individuals do it. Independent organisations like the IPA or Getup! do it. Why not unions?

I honestly can't think of a single reason why not.

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Its time

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #42 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 4:10pm

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 3:51pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 3:05pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:28pm:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 1:25pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:33am:

Grendel wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 10:30am:

I don't think Unions should have a political party.
I don't think Banks should.
I don't think Donut King should.
I don't think Businesses should.

Forcing people to join Unions even student Unions is wrong.

It is wrong to force or coerce people not to be members of any organisation. It should be free choice either way.

However, anyone who is not a member of an organisation is not entitled to enjoy the benefits of that membership.

LOL what the?
Just where am I or anyone forcing people not to join an organisation.
Unions should be unions not government. Not political. Same with my other examples. Roll Eyes

Why not political?

Because they are a Union you idiot... Roll Eyes

Why shouldn't unions lobby political parties and governments to promote the interests of their members?

Businesses do it. Business unions do it. Farmer unions do it. Wealthy individuals do it. Independent organisations like the IPA or Getup! do it. Why not unions?

I honestly can't think of a single reason why not.

Because it's detrimental to his argument Cheesy

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philperth2010

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #43 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 4:29pm

Personal tax cuts are usually delivered in the budget before an election and Turnbull does not have much more on his agenda he can get through the Senate....Turnbull also gave the States (especially WA) a generous Commonwealth top up to the G.S.T. and injected additional funds towards infrastructure projects....Turnbull will wait and see how the pork barrelling has worked before calling an election but the signals are this is an election budget???

Huh

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Bam

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Re: Mr Turnbull Why Not Call A General Election
Reply #44 - Jul 11^th, 2018 at 5:33pm

philperth2010 wrote on Jul 11^th, 2018 at 4:29pm:

Personal tax cuts are usually delivered in the budget before an election and Turnbull does not have much more on his agenda he can get through the Senate....Turnbull also gave the States (especially WA) a generous Commonwealth top up to the G.S.T. and injected additional funds towards infrastructure projects....Turnbull will wait and see how the pork barrelling has worked before calling an election but the signals are this is an election budget???

Huh

It has to be an election Budget. The next half-Senate election must be called before the next Budget.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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