Australian Politics Forum - Electric cars are here to stay...

DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #150 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm

Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:18am:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:37pm:

lee wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:44am:

So it looks like if we closed down oil refineries and used the electricity to power cars instead we would be using less resources

So we should use intermittent electricity to power hospitals, as well as cars?

A typical greenie, shut down the refineries save money of putting fuel in cars.

Ignore the fact that pretty much everything we manufacture including electric cars relies on chemicals derived from long strands of hydrocarbons.

Then there is medicines, but fkk it we want to save money on not buy fuels

The capacity for any thought or intelligent reason is an absolute anathema with fkking socialists

and then when it all runs out one day after most of it has been blown out of a tail pipe or disposed of into landfill and the ocean as useless plastic garbage, then what do you do bighole ? run back to the caves or anticipate that day by looking for alternatives which you deadbeat libbos just don't want anyone else to look to hard for ??

Ha ha u 2 crack me up if you bully me into your point u think ill see your point of view..... the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle I really don't know what that has to do with both of your tirades.
But I do sense your fears and having to strike out at the unknown and u have me pity.
I'm not really sure if u know what a socialist is, but I don't think I've ever said I think we should all sell our vehicles and car pool or any other socialist idea's,
I do worry about poisons being poured into the air and I don't like the idea of giving the middle east boat loads of money and I don't like waste in general but socialist ??????

So when u guys can be civil and actually come up with civil thoughts i'll start listening

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DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #151 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:35pm

lee wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:44am:

So it looks like if we closed down oil refineries and used the electricity to power cars instead we would be using less resources

So we should use intermittent electricity to power hospitals, as well as cars?

Apples oranges Lee
relevance ?

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lee

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #152 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:43pm

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm:

the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle

Yeah
That's a Musk claim. I guess it must be true. Or not -

"Musk in which Musk makes a striking claim: “You have enough electricity to power all the cars in the country if you stop refining gasoline,” he asserts. “You take an average of 5 kilowatt hours to refine [one gallon of] gasoline, something like the [Tesla] Model S can go 20 miles on 5 kilowatt hours.”

It’s a claim that I’ve seen pop up frequently in recent weeks, often framed as an assertion that electric cars use less electricity than normal ones. There’s only one problem: It’s not true."

"This is consistent with refinery data. The Department of Energy estimates that refiners used 47 TWh of electricity in 2001 to produce refined products from 5.3 billion barrels of oil. Assuming that you get 42 gallons of refined products from each barrel of oil, this works out to about 0.2 kilowatt hours of electricity used for each gallon of gasoline produced."

https://www.cfr.org/blog/do-gasoline-based-cars-really-use-more-electricity-elec...

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DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #153 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:04pm

lee wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:43pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm:

the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle

Yeah
That's a Musk claim. I guess it must be true. Or not -

"Musk in which Musk makes a striking claim: “You have enough electricity to power all the cars in the country if you stop refining gasoline,” he asserts. “You take an average of 5 kilowatt hours to refine [one gallon of] gasoline, something like the [Tesla] Model S can go 20 miles on 5 kilowatt hours.”

It’s a claim that I’ve seen pop up frequently in recent weeks, often framed as an assertion that electric cars use less electricity than normal ones. There’s only one problem: It’s not true."

"This is consistent with refinery data. The Department of Energy estimates that refiners used 47 TWh of electricity in 2001 to produce refined products from 5.3 billion barrels of oil. Assuming that you get 42 gallons of refined products from each barrel of oil, this works out to about 0.2 kilowatt hours of electricity used for each gallon of gasoline produced."

org/blog/do-gasoline-based-cars-really-use-more-electricity-electric-vehicles-do

yes the article I first used mentioned those figures ( the high and the low figures) and then went in a lot more detail and showed a lot more arguments as well so yes well done you showed the most optimistic and less optimistic but the article did that too
What r u adding or actually saying ?

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BigOl64

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #154 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:31pm

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:18am:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:37pm:

lee wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:44am:

So it looks like if we closed down oil refineries and used the electricity to power cars instead we would be using less resources

So we should use intermittent electricity to power hospitals, as well as cars?

A typical greenie, shut down the refineries save money of putting fuel in cars.

Ignore the fact that pretty much everything we manufacture including electric cars relies on chemicals derived from long strands of hydrocarbons.

Then there is medicines, but fkk it we want to save money on not buy fuels

The capacity for any thought or intelligent reason is an absolute anathema with fkking socialists

and then when it all runs out one day after most of it has been blown out of a tail pipe or disposed of into landfill and the ocean as useless plastic garbage, then what do you do bighole ? run back to the caves or anticipate that day by looking for alternatives which you deadbeat libbos just don't want anyone else to look to hard for ??

Ha ha u 2 crack me up if you bully me into your point u think ill see your point of view..... the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle I really don't know what that has to do with both of your tirades.
But I do sense your fears and having to strike out at the unknown and u have me pity.
I'm not really sure if u know what a socialist is, but I don't think I've ever said I think we should all sell our vehicles and car pool or any other socialist idea's,
I do worry about poisons being poured into the air and I don't like the idea of giving the middle east boat loads of money and I don't like waste in general but socialist ??????

So when u guys can be civil and actually come up with civil thoughts i'll start listening

Maybe this place isn't for you and your feelings.

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21658 Gender:	Re: Electric cars are here to stay... Reply #155 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:00pm DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:04pm: What r u adding or actually saying ? Let's see Musk - "20 miles on 5KWh" So 0.2KWh = 20 x 0.2 / 5 = 0.8 of a mile. Now my electricity costs 24.067/ KWh. 0.2 KWh is less than 5 cents. Musk is a salesman. Nothing more.
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DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #156 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:01pm

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:31pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:18am:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:37pm:

lee wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:44am:

So it looks like if we closed down oil refineries and used the electricity to power cars instead we would be using less resources

So we should use intermittent electricity to power hospitals, as well as cars?

A typical greenie, shut down the refineries save money of putting fuel in cars.

Ignore the fact that pretty much everything we manufacture including electric cars relies on chemicals derived from long strands of hydrocarbons.

Then there is medicines, but fkk it we want to save money on not buy fuels

The capacity for any thought or intelligent reason is an absolute anathema with fkking socialists

and then when it all runs out one day after most of it has been blown out of a tail pipe or disposed of into landfill and the ocean as useless plastic garbage, then what do you do bighole ? run back to the caves or anticipate that day by looking for alternatives which you deadbeat libbos just don't want anyone else to look to hard for ??

Ha ha u 2 crack me up if you bully me into your point u think ill see your point of view..... the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle I really don't know what that has to do with both of your tirades.
But I do sense your fears and having to strike out at the unknown and u have me pity.
I'm not really sure if u know what a socialist is, but I don't think I've ever said I think we should all sell our vehicles and car pool or any other socialist idea's,
I do worry about poisons being poured into the air and I don't like the idea of giving the middle east boat loads of money and I don't like waste in general but socialist ??????

So when u guys can be civil and actually come up with civil thoughts i'll start listening

Maybe this place isn't for you and your feelings.

Maybe u should realize if u insult someone, even if your right they wont listen to u
Resorting to bullying might work on little kids but to me it just makes u seam sad
yes it does make me want to cry when I see ppl with so much fear in their life

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BigOl64

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #157 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:11pm

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:01pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:31pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:18am:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:37pm:

lee wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:44am:

So it looks like if we closed down oil refineries and used the electricity to power cars instead we would be using less resources

So we should use intermittent electricity to power hospitals, as well as cars?

A typical greenie, shut down the refineries save money of putting fuel in cars.

Ignore the fact that pretty much everything we manufacture including electric cars relies on chemicals derived from long strands of hydrocarbons.

Then there is medicines, but fkk it we want to save money on not buy fuels

The capacity for any thought or intelligent reason is an absolute anathema with fkking socialists

and then when it all runs out one day after most of it has been blown out of a tail pipe or disposed of into landfill and the ocean as useless plastic garbage, then what do you do bighole ? run back to the caves or anticipate that day by looking for alternatives which you deadbeat libbos just don't want anyone else to look to hard for ??

Ha ha u 2 crack me up if you bully me into your point u think ill see your point of view..... the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle I really don't know what that has to do with both of your tirades.
But I do sense your fears and having to strike out at the unknown and u have me pity.
I'm not really sure if u know what a socialist is, but I don't think I've ever said I think we should all sell our vehicles and car pool or any other socialist idea's,
I do worry about poisons being poured into the air and I don't like the idea of giving the middle east boat loads of money and I don't like waste in general but socialist ??????

So when u guys can be civil and actually come up with civil thoughts i'll start listening

Maybe this place isn't for you and your feelings.

Maybe u should realize if u insult someone, even if your right they wont listen to u
Resorting to bullying might work on little kids but to me it just makes u seam sad
yes it does make me want to cry when I see ppl with so much fear in their life

Maybe you're such an emotionally crippled human that you assume someone is being mean to you, when in reality they just don't care about your sensitivities and can't be bothered to dance around your feelings so you don't get hurt.

You could do something about that.

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DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #158 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:27pm

lee wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:00pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:04pm:

What r u adding or actually saying ?

Let's see Musk - "20 miles on 5KWh"
So 0.2KWh = 20 x 0.2 / 5 = 0.8 of a mile.

Now my electricity costs 24.067/ KWh. 0.2 KWh is less than 5 cents.
Musk is a salesman. Nothing more.

this is the article again

greentransportation_info/energy-transportation/gasoline-costs-6kwh.html
it figured that 6kwh or energy is used for every gallon of finished product from crude oil. not all is electricity, but again that's only one argument, the article has many arguments and in them all it shows it takes a lot of effort and released poisons just to get oil into fuels then a double wammy of burning up the fuel.

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DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #159 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:32pm

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:11pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:01pm:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 1:31pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:32pm:

Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 12:18am:

BigOl64 wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:37pm:

lee wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 12:28pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 14^th, 2018 at 7:44am:

So it looks like if we closed down oil refineries and used the electricity to power cars instead we would be using less resources

So we should use intermittent electricity to power hospitals, as well as cars?

A typical greenie, shut down the refineries save money of putting fuel in cars.

Ignore the fact that pretty much everything we manufacture including electric cars relies on chemicals derived from long strands of hydrocarbons.

Then there is medicines, but fkk it we want to save money on not buy fuels

The capacity for any thought or intelligent reason is an absolute anathema with fkking socialists

and then when it all runs out one day after most of it has been blown out of a tail pipe or disposed of into landfill and the ocean as useless plastic garbage, then what do you do bighole ? run back to the caves or anticipate that day by looking for alternatives which you deadbeat libbos just don't want anyone else to look to hard for ??

Ha ha u 2 crack me up if you bully me into your point u think ill see your point of view..... the article states it cost more in electricity to make petrol and diesel than it does to directly power a electric vehicle I really don't know what that has to do with both of your tirades.
But I do sense your fears and having to strike out at the unknown and u have me pity.
I'm not really sure if u know what a socialist is, but I don't think I've ever said I think we should all sell our vehicles and car pool or any other socialist idea's,
I do worry about poisons being poured into the air and I don't like the idea of giving the middle east boat loads of money and I don't like waste in general but socialist ??????

So when u guys can be civil and actually come up with civil thoughts i'll start listening

Maybe this place isn't for you and your feelings.

Maybe u should realize if u insult someone, even if your right they wont listen to u
Resorting to bullying might work on little kids but to me it just makes u seam sad
yes it does make me want to cry when I see ppl with so much fear in their life

Maybe you're such an emotionally crippled human that you assume someone is being mean to you, when in reality they just don't care about your sensitivities and can't be bothered to dance around your feelings so you don't get hurt.

You could do something about that.

So are u agreeing that electric cars r here to stay or not

So your telling me being rude, insulting and not caring about someone else is how to bring ppl to how u think ?
You must be a Master Debator

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lee

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #160 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:40pm

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:27pm:

it figured that 6kwh or energy is used for every gallon of finished product from crude oil. not all is electricity, but again that's only one argument, the article has many arguments and in them all it shows it takes a lot of effort

Yeah. On VERY rubbery figures. Wink

For ALL refinery products.

I'll leave you to Mass Debate. Wink

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DonDeeHippy

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #161 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:46pm

lee wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:40pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:27pm:

it figured that 6kwh or energy is used for every gallon of finished product from crude oil. not all is electricity, but again that's only one argument, the article has many arguments and in them all it shows it takes a lot of effort

Yeah. On VERY rubbery figures. Wink

For ALL refinery products.

I'll leave you to Mass Debate. Wink

I'm sure there was no rubber used Tongue

,but it mentions lots of lpg used to refine gas which I didn't know.

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Sir lastnail

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #162 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 4:35pm

lee wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:40pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:27pm:

it figured that 6kwh or energy is used for every gallon of finished product from crude oil. not all is electricity, but again that's only one argument, the article has many arguments and in them all it shows it takes a lot of effort

Yeah. On VERY rubbery figures. Wink

For ALL refinery products.

I'll leave you to Mass Debate. Wink

what about shipping the crude across the ocean using the most inefficient and polluting means of transport ?? Does that not count considering that people can generate FREE energy from their own rooftops and charge up their own EV's from it ?

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21658 Gender:	Re: Electric cars are here to stay... Reply #163 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 5:26pm Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 4:35pm: what about shipping the crude across the ocean using the most inefficient and polluting means of transport ?? Let us know when you build your first fleet of sailing vessels.
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TheFunPolice

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Re: Electric cars are here to stay...
Reply #164 - Apr 15^th, 2018 at 6:58pm

Sir lastnail wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 4:35pm:

lee wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:40pm:

DonDeeHippy wrote on Apr 15^th, 2018 at 2:27pm:

it figured that 6kwh or energy is used for every gallon of finished product from crude oil. not all is electricity, but again that's only one argument, the article has many arguments and in them all it shows it takes a lot of effort

Yeah. On VERY rubbery figures. Wink

For ALL refinery products.

I'll leave you to Mass Debate. Wink

what about shipping the crude across the ocean using the most inefficient and polluting means of transport ?? Does that not count considering that people can generate FREE energy from their own rooftops and charge up their own EV's from it ?

Well, I think that is the crux of the very point: I don't think renewable energy could ship crude across the world!

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