Australian Politics Forum - Abbott's Speech

lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21742 Gender:	Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad. Reply #135 - Oct 19^th, 2017 at 10:00pm Dnarever wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 9:57pm: Yes and unlike you he would know. That may be; but it is only weeks since other climate scientists admitted they were running hot. Now if even the climate scientists can't agree, what hope do we have?
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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21742 Gender:	Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad. Reply #136 - Oct 19^th, 2017 at 10:02pm *
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Grendel

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #137 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 9:55am

philperth2010 wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 9:04am:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 8:54pm:

philperth2010 wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 4:32pm:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 3:03pm:

philperth2010 wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 10:36am:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 9:52am:

philperth2010 wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 9:05am:

Abbott' rant confirmed what every thinking person already knew....That his pretence to believe and act on global warming was all a ruse to make him electable....Now his priority is to tear down the Turnbull Government in the hope of a biblical return to the top job....Tell him he is dreaming!!!

Roll Eyes

Given I actually posted the entire speech Phil you still cant come up with anything concrete to criticise from it... tsk tsk, tsk....

I have an opinion and will not be dictated too by your bias....I have already stated Abbott is a liar either when he said he believed in global warming or a liar now he claims it is crap....The bloke is a liar and has no moral conviction IMO!!!

Roll Eyes

I'm not biased I don't particularly like Abbott, I don't hate him either. YOU have personal issues about someone you don't know and let them colour your opinion.
I want you to post something factual about his speech.

He is a liar....How hard is that for you to understand???

Roll Eyes

This is what Julie Bishop said about Tony Abbott's speech....

Quote:

“The views he expressed recently are different to those he expressed as prime minister when he supported the Paris agreement, and in fact set a nationally determined targets and the renewable energy target was established under then Prime Minister Abbott,” she said. “So, it’s up to him to explain the differences between his opinion then and his opinion now.”

I wouldn't put a lot of stock in what Bishop says. can you prove that she is right and make the statement less vague?
People like BS state when the facts change they change their mind don't they?
I'm pretty sure Abbott said he compromised his belief to keep the group together.

Now tell me where Abbott has been consistent mate???

I never said he was... but I wouldn't be posting biased Guardian pieces to back me up either. But he is very consistent in many things in his speech. In fact most of it.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/oct/12/tony-abbott-needs-to-expl...

Here is where scientists pick apart Abbott's speech....

https://www.desmogblog.com/2017/10/09/climate-scientists-attack-tony-abbott-misl...

Roll Eyes

Julie Bishop has pointed out the contradiction in Abbott's speech....Tell me where she is wrong???

Where is your evidence to prove global warming is not happening mate....Your opinion means nothing???

http://www.ucsusa.org/scientists-agree-global-warming-happening-humans-primary-c...

Huh

And yours does?

oh and where did I say global warming was not happening.
You climate zealots need to stop lying about what people actually say. Grin

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Grendel

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #138 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 9:57am

Well worth a repeat for PHIL...

lee wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 11:17am:

The Union of Concerned Scientists. Worried where their next meal ticket is coming from.

Then at the bottom Surveys that prove their assertions.

Oreskes 2004 100%/? I can't get 100% of any kind of people to agree to anything.

Soran & Zimmerman 2009 97% . Survey to 10,257 earth Scientists. 3,146 responded. This was whittled down to 79.
Question 1: “When compared with pre-1800s levels, do you think that mean global temperatures have generally risen, fallen, or remained relatively constant?” 76 of 79 (96.2%) answered “risen.”
Q2: “Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?” 75 of 77 (97.4%) answered “yes.”
The second question wasn't asked if people responded "relatively constant". That's why the respondees dropped from 79 to 77.
So 97% of 79 scientists. Not the 3,000 odd that responded.

Rather like Cook et al 97%. - "We analyze the evolution of the scientific consensus on anthropogenic global warming (AGW) in the peer-reviewed scientific literature, examining 11 944 climate abstracts from 1991–2011 matching the topics 'global climate change' or 'global warming'. We find that 66.4% of abstracts expressed no position on AGW, 32.6% endorsed AGW, 0.7% rejected AGW and 0.3% were uncertain about the cause of global warming. Among abstracts expressing a position on AGW, 97.1% endorsed the consensus position that humans are causing global warming."

97.1% of 32.6% does not equal 97% of climate scientists.

I could go on but you get the drift. Wink

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Grendel

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #139 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:00am

Dnarever wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 6:38pm:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 9:20pm:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 7:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 8:09am:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 17^th, 2017 at 8:29pm:

The first page of the speech was generic and not too bad if hard to associate with what we know about Abbott's actual performance.

The 5 following pages of climate rant would qualify as rubbish. Mostly misquoted and exaggerated facts wrapped in utter BS with just enough close to true to mask it a bit and make parts sound plausible if you didn't know Tony.

Time I will never get back.

Then it shouldn't be hard to post just 1 example should it?
You should seek help with your personal and political bias though. Cant help your judgement can it. Cheesy

Didn't I post a series of about 6 at close to the same time as this one ????

You just like to hear yourself type.

Yes I see - after posting this you made silly comments about some of them.

oh dear
i think you will find I posted replies at the time I read them.. and this last post i have just read and its now 1015pm here

The point is that here you claimed that there were none ????

Quote:

Then it shouldn't be hard to post just 1 example should it?

..

Nope doesn't say that there were none at all.
Stop lying.

You not only knew that I had posted examples but you had responded to them.

Quote:

and this last post i have just read and its now 1015pm here

At least you can tell the time ?? Not sure there is a point though.

I was probably in bed by then ?

Oh dear what I posted was the truth... you just have issues with the truth.

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Grendel

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #140 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:01am

Dnarever wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 7:10pm:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 9:44pm:

thecuriousmail wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 6:11pm:

Some of the posts here are astoundingly stupid.

you mean like this one?

Abbott has a messiah complex and would destroy the liberal party just to be leader. That is clear.

That is your opinion. I doubt very much he has a messiah complex.

It is also clear he is ideologically-driven.

Again your opinion... I have no doubt Abbott has drivers of his own that no true single ideology has.

Let's assume human caused climate change is real, and this becomes obvious and scientifically undeniable in 50 years (and after which time any effects could not substantially be ameliorated).

Big assumption.
Fact... there is no scientific consensus.

Because it is either true or not. As I say, let's assume for the sake of argument it is true.

Big assumption.
Yours.

If the liberal party adopts abbott's stance, and it is true, then the liberal party will be ridiculed and its future bleak electorally.

Why?
It is Abbotts opinion.
many people hold it.
many people totally deny climate change and global warming let alone AGW.

It will be the inept and irrelevant party of "climate change doubters who got us into this mess".

How so... they haven't adopted any policies so far you've stated Abbott has an opinion, nothing more. Opinions of backbenchers are a dime a dozen. You cant blame Abbott for that and certainly not the Libs or any other party.

Every time the liberal party put forward an argument the detractors would respond: as real as climate change says the liberals. Remember? Hahaha.
The liberal party would be a laughing stock with a compromised future.

No more than any party that have made mistakes in the past. In case you missed it party members change regularly.

That's a big gamble.

What is?

So, are abbott and ilk likely to be right and most climate scientists wrong?

there is no consensus.

Are you so confident in the affirmative that you happily risk the future of the liberal party?

Huh? Are you going to now ask the other case where AGW is in fact not a threat and warming etc is a natural phenomenon?

Is abbott and ilk so intelligent, so insightful, so likely to be right that you put the electoral future of the liberal party on their contrary opinion?

You forget all those other scientists that refute alarmist propaganda, or all those other intelligent people who also doubt the alarmism. Are you so sure they are wrong. What about all the billions spent to make no changes in climate. Changes that put our way of life in jeopardy for what will be no reason.

Remember, abbott is the drunk passed out on the floor of his office when he was supposed to be in Parliament. Abbott is competent?

Strawmen. passed out really...

Abbott, the ex seminarian, the professed Catholic, who rejects the pope's statements on climate change, but conveniently uses his religion in the SSM debate. Ideology trumps religion.

So the Pope is an expert? I thought he was a Catholic.

abbott, the man who knighted prince philip for his "services to australia", but then says he only did it to get up the nose of the lefty media. Ideology trumps good sense.

Don't recall that either...

Tony abbott and ilk are such geniuses that you without reservation back their stance??

You are a climate zealot and true believer in a theory that is as yet unproven.

If the liberal party gambles that abbott and co are right, but it turns out they were very wrong, then the liberal party will be the biggest loser. As successive generations battle the effects of climate change, the liberal party will be a staple of stand-up comedians for the rest of this century!
Couldn't happen to a more deserving group of people!

Ah there we have the hateful bias... Who'd a thunk it eh.

Debate the facts not your fantasy bias.

Gee posting in other peoples post makes a mess.

Quote:

Fact... there is no scientific consensus.

A view that has the consensus of 100% of oil companies and the scientists they employ.

Actually its a FACT and the TRUTH, something you are not only careless with but in denial about.
Stop wasting everyone's time.

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad. Reply #141 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:02am Dnarever wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 7:35pm: Abbott's Speech - The good the bad and the ugly. Thank you for your immature proof of bias
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Grendel

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #142 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:05am

The_Barnacle wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 9:06pm:

philperth2010 wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 9:04am:

Julie Bishop has pointed out the contradiction in Abbott's speech....Tell me where she is wrong???

Where is your evidence to prove global warming is not happening mate....Your opinion means nothing???

http://www.ucsusa.org/scientists-agree-global-warming-happening-humans-primary-c...

Huh

The worlds receding glaciers are irrefutable proof that the Earth is warming.
CO2 is a known greenhouse gas that causes warming
CO2 levels are rising as evidenced by readings at Mauna Loa
7 billion humans burning fossil fuels are emitting CO2

The evidence trail is right there.

Unfortunately you should comment on stuff I actually say not on stuff idiots say I say when I don't. Cheesy

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 78311 Gender:	Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad. Reply #143 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:17am stop trolling everyone goose. Abbott lied, it's been proven to you countless time. Pull your head out of your arse and stop being a nuisance
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Grendel

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #144 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 3:12pm

LOL says the TROLL who cant even prove its daytime let alone anything that Abbott said was a lie. Cheesy

I gave you all opportunities.
I provided the text.
Most of you think attacking the man is proof. Grin

When you are called on that you attack me. Well You actually attack everyone John, but hey we all know that here. Cheesy

Post a quote and prove it wrong.
I'm no Abbott fan, I might even agree with you. Roll Eyes

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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 78311 Gender:	Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad. Reply #145 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 4:13pm Grendel wrote on Oct 20^th, 2017 at 3:12pm: Post a quote and prove it wrong. did that already ... you didn't pull your head out of your arse long enough to read it. move on
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Dnarever

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #146 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 6:29pm

Grendel wrote on Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:02am:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 7:35pm:

Abbott's Speech - The good the bad and the ugly.

Thank you for your immature proof of bias Grin

You can find some good on an inaccurate, exaggerated misquoted and misinformed 6 page primary school standard rant about climate. It is not even a good joke.

Unfortunately when dealt spades you have to call spades.

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Dnarever

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #147 - Oct 20^th, 2017 at 6:33pm

Grendel wrote on Oct 20^th, 2017 at 10:00am:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 19^th, 2017 at 6:38pm:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 9:20pm:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 7:26pm:

Grendel wrote on Oct 18^th, 2017 at 8:09am:

Dnarever wrote on Oct 17^th, 2017 at 8:29pm:

The first page of the speech was generic and not too bad if hard to associate with what we know about Abbott's actual performance.

The 5 following pages of climate rant would qualify as rubbish. Mostly misquoted and exaggerated facts wrapped in utter BS with just enough close to true to mask it a bit and make parts sound plausible if you didn't know Tony.

Time I will never get back.

Then it shouldn't be hard to post just 1 example should it?
You should seek help with your personal and political bias though. Cant help your judgement can it. Cheesy

Didn't I post a series of about 6 at close to the same time as this one ????

You just like to hear yourself type.

Yes I see - after posting this you made silly comments about some of them.

oh dear
i think you will find I posted replies at the time I read them.. and this last post i have just read and its now 1015pm here

The point is that here you claimed that there were none ????

Quote:

Then it shouldn't be hard to post just 1 example should it?

..

Nope doesn't say that there were none at all.
Stop lying.

You not only knew that I had posted examples but you had responded to them.

Quote:

and this last post i have just read and its now 1015pm here

At least you can tell the time ?? Not sure there is a point though.

I was probably in bed by then ?

Oh dear what I posted was the truth... you just have issues with the truth.

I never said it wasn't true just that it meant nothing as far as I can see.

Nope doesn't say that there were none at all.
Stop lying.

You said I could have posted 1. I took that to mean you claimed I had posted less than 1. I can not interpret it any other way.

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philperth2010

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Re: Abbott's Speech - good or bad.
Reply #148 - Oct 21^st, 2017 at 6:12pm

Grendel wrote on Oct 20^th, 2017 at 9:55am: