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FGC, not FGM (Read 30420 times)
mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #15 - Mar 10th, 2017 at 12:39pm
 
Gordon wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 12:37pm:
mothra wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 12:32pm:
Gordon wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 12:18pm:
mothra wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 12:15pm:
Gordon wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 12:12pm:
mothra wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 11:49am:
Gordon wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 11:43am:
This is just typical of the regressive left. Expend all the effort dancing around the language of something while failing to address the actual issue.

Here's my solution for western countries.

All children deemed at risk of being subjected to FGM to have yearly examinations by a paediatrician. Failure by parents to comply would result in both parents being jailed for 10 years.

Any child found to have undergone FGM in Australia or overseas, both parents jailed for life no prospect of parole.




Nope. Regressive right.

Won;t even call it FGC when it's abundantly clear that is the more sensitive, incorperative and applicable terminology.

You don;t care about the women and the girls at all. Not in the slightest,

You just use this appalling act to push your own twisted agendas.


Mothra, why do you place the cultural sensitivities of those involved above ending the practice?

Additional to the above, parents of children U18 who've been subjected to FGM would be ineligible for immigration to any western country.

That would provide a disincentive to the practice.



B: Why should they be precluded from coming to Australia? Don't you want them to learn best practices and avail their daughters of the best medical care?


It would become common knowledge that if you cut your children there is no chance of a visa to a western country.

Carrot and stick



God you think simply.


You'd prioritise immigration for families with girls who've had FGM thus providing a perverse incentive for it 

Typical morally confused regressive left



Where exactly did i say i would prioritise them?

Are you that desperate for arguments that you need to make them up? Or are you really this thick?
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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #16 - Mar 10th, 2017 at 1:02pm
 
Why do we use the term female genital cutting and not female genital mutilation?


We are often asked why we use the term female genital cutting and not female genital mutilation. This blog, posted by our partner Tostan in February 2015, explains why:
FGC? FGM? Female circumcision? Why language matters in helping communities abandon harmful practices

This Friday, February 6, marks the United Nations (UN) International Day for the Abandonment of Female Genital Cutting (FGC). It’s a day to celebrate communities around the world that have decided to abandon this harmful practice, educate people about the work that still needs to be done, and engage partners globally to see millions of women and girls free from FGC.

Tostan has been deeply committed to enabling communities across West Africa to make positive social changes like abandoning FGC. We are frequently asked why we choose to use the term, “female genital cutting” instead of the more widely used, “female genital mutilation.” As we look forward to many conversations this Friday about FGC, we wanted to clarify our use of this language up front so that it doesn’t distract from the bigger picture: working together to end a harmful practice that damages millions of girls and women worldwide.

The terminology around this issue can be challenging. Three separate terms have been widely used to describe the practice: female circumcision, female genital mutilation, and female genital cutting. We avoid the term “circumcision,” as we believe it incorrectly implies a parallel between FGC and male circumcision.  But the fact is, all of these terms have their limitations and fall short of accurately describing this practice—which has four major (and infinite minor) variations in practice around the world. No one term is truly “accurate.”

But we must use words, and so among these options, Tostan has for over 13 years chosen the term female genital cutting based on what communities that are giving up the practice have told us: the term “cutting” allows them to accomplish more than the others because it is less judgmental and value-laden. As a result, the term is more effective for engaging groups in dialog around this practice, and eventually bringing about its end.

We want to be very, very clear about one thing: we do not use this term in an attempt to excuse or diminish the impact of the practice. Anyone who has taken the time to learn about Tostan and watched the testimonies given by Tostan’s local partners—Marietou Diarra, for example— knows that we are in no way hiding or excusing the real, significant consequences of this practice. Yet despite its serious health consequences, we have found that FGC itself is not done with vicious intent to “mutilate” a girl. Rather, parents who have their daughters cut want the best for them, and the practice is seen as a necessary step to enable her to be a fully accepted member of the community.

It seems counter-intuitive, but in our experience, if there is a dominant emotion involved in FGC, it is love—because not cutting your daughter risks her entire future. As explained by a former cutter-turned-Tostan advocate, Oureye Sall, in communities where FGC is practiced, an uncut girl is ostracized. Community members will not eat food cooked by a woman who is not cut, will not accept water from her, will not even sit with her. She will have difficulty getting married. An uncut woman is viewed as unclean and therefore unable to participate fully in the community.

With these social pressures, if a family chooses not to cut their daughter, they have risked severely damaging her social status. To imply that parents are actually “mutilating” their daughters through a decision made with love and concern for her well-being is unfair to them and risks alienating and offending them rather than convincing them to abandon the practice.

In addition, we have found that many communities do not fully understand the consequences of the practice—the effects of which are not always immediate or obvious, especially in cases of infections, tetanus, etc. Without an understanding of concepts such as germ theory, recognizing the true long-term health implications of FGC is difficult. When communities do get access to this information, presented in a manner that is trustworthy and non-combative, they come to understand the harm the practice causes and will decide on their own to stop—but if the person bringing these messages begins with judgmental terms, the chance of reaching this breakthrough disappears.

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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #17 - Mar 10th, 2017 at 1:07pm
 
We should remember that all of us, no matter where we are from, tend to greet judgmental outsiders in similar ways. When our beliefs and actions are challenged or condemned by a stranger, we are likely to become defensive; rather than taking their concerns to heart, we view their accusation as an unwarranted and uninformed attack on our character. We certainly won’t feel inclined to change in order to satisfy this judgmental critic; we may even respond by holding on more tightly to the belief or action being questioned. Our experience has shown us that it is dialog and discussion that leads to change, and dialog requires a relationship of trust and respect. But calling the practice “mutilation” prevents this relationship from developing and invites defensiveness rather than productive discourse. And, if we take the example of Oureye Sall—who transformed her experience as a former cutter into a source of leadership against FGC—it becomes clear that we must avoid demonizing those who perform the practice. Oureye is not a “mutilator” and villain; she is a hero driven by her new knowledge. When she had cut girls, she did so because the experience and knowledge available to her told her it was right to do so. When she decided to stop and to become a champion of the movement to abandon FGC, it was because new experiences and new knowledge showed her that the practice was harmful and that change was necessary.

Tostan’s experience has shown this to be the case for almost all cutters; they are not evil, they do not seek to “mutilate” girls or bring them harm, but rather they are acting based on what they believe is right.


Perhaps most importantly, we should be very cautious in labeling and stigmatizing the girls and women who have been cut. We do not believe it is our place to tell them that they are “mutilated.” As with other victims of violence, we believe they have the human right to self-identify in whatever manner they choose.


Some prefer to call themselves mutilated, others simply “cut,” many others say less, or nothing, as they are not yet comfortable being public about this very private matter.

We believe women should be free to choose the term that best defines them, and that the term “mutilated” should not be forced upon them.

In short, our use of the term “FGC” is not apology, nor is it political correctness. It is simple practicality: this way of speaking opens doors to dialog that have led to thousands of communities standing up to abandon this practice, doors that more accusatory language would keep shut.

We choose to use language that has proven to be effective, that community leaders and evaluation data alike are telling us brings real, concrete change. In keeping with the above approach, we are not posting this in any effort to pick a fight with others who choose to use different language. We respect the many differences of opinion on this truly complex subject and the language that accompanies it.

We do encourage others to study our experiences, both in relation to FGC and the many, many other areas on which our program works. We hope to continue supporting community-led work in the field to ensure all girls—cut and uncut—have human dignity. These actions are our main focus, and we believe they speak much louder than words. -

See more at: https://orchidproject.org/why-do-we-use-the-term-female-genital-cutting-and-not-
female-genital-mutilation/#sthash.EQQle3C4.dpuf


https://orchidproject.org/why-do-we-use-the-term-female-genital-cutting-and-not-...
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Yadda
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #18 - Mar 10th, 2017 at 1:31pm
 

FGC, not FGM


i.e.
Please DO use the term; Female Genital 'Cutting',

....rather than the term; Female Genital Mutilation.



Moslems, posing as leftist 'progressives', now seek to introduce mainstream media terms which would tend to disguise the full extent of the barbarity of ISLAMIC inspired moslem violence.


e.g.
Beheading infidels.

"Pre-whole-body-transplant procedure."




Another one;

Murdering an intimate member of your family, who challenges the authority of ISLAM over their life ?

"Honour killing."




Another one;

Randonly stabbing police officers in public places.

"Educating pigs to respect moslems."






.




ISLAMIC LAW....
"Ibn 'Umar related that the Messenger of Allah, upon whom be peace, said, "I have been ordered to kill the people until they testify that there is no god except Allah, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and they establish prayer and pay the zakah. If they do that, their blood and wealth are protected from me save by the rights of Islam. Their reckoning will be with Allah." (Related by al-Bukhari and Muslim.) "
fiqhussunnah/fus1_06


ISLAMIC LAW....
"Ibn 'Abbas reported that the Prophet said: "The bare essence of Islam and the basics of the religion are three [acts], upon which Islam has been established. Whoever leaves one of them becomes an unbeliever and his blood may legally be spilled. [The acts are:] Testifying that there is no God except Allah, the obligatory prayers, and the fast of Ramadan."...."
fiqhussunnah/#3.110

n.b.
"Whoever......becomes an unbeliever.....his blood may legally be spilled."





Google;
islam, unbelief is worse than killing






THE HADITH....

"...the Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him."
- DEAD.
hadithsunnah/bukhari/ #004.052.260



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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31
 
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #19 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:09am
 
Abu liked to push this nonsense also. Apparently Islam promotes the "good" version of female genital mutilation, which he was very keen to distance from the "bad" version that pagans practice. I am yet to encounter an anti FGM feminist who thinks the distinction matters. I guess it is a bit like the difference between getting your hand cut off at the elbow or wrist.

No surprise that mothra has swallowed this spin hook line and sinker. I'm surprised he is not standing up for the poor oppressed neonazis.
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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.
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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #20 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:12am
 
freediver wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:09am:
Abu liked to push this nonsense also. Apparently Islam promotes the "good" version of female genital mutilation, which he was very keen to distance from the "bad" version that pagans practice. I am yet to encounter an anti FGM feminist who thinks the distinction matters. I guess it is a bit like the difference between getting your hand cut off at the elbow or wrist.

No surprise that mothra has swallowed this spin hook line and sinker. I'm surprised he is not standing up for the poor oppressed neonazis.



Ridiculous.


"Perhaps most importantly, we should be very cautious in labeling and stigmatizing the girls and women who have been cut. We do not believe it is our place to tell them that they are “mutilated.” As with other victims of violence, we believe they have the human right to self-identify in whatever manner they choose."

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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #21 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:15am
 
Good point mothra. We should also stop trying to prevent Muslims raping people in case we stigmatise rape victims.
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #22 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:18am
 
mothra wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 10:58am:
It seems Female Genital Cutting is now thee prefered term over Feale Genital Mutilation.



Muslims and their apologists like to use political correctness to downplay female genital mutilation, their moral bankruptcy has to be seen to be believed.

Why don't you call it a ritual nick or has that already been tried, at least Pru Goward toldthem to bugger off when they tried that nonsense.
abc.net.au/news/2010-05-28/doctors-consider-less-severe-female-circumcision/8447...


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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #23 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:19am
 
freediver wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:15am:
Good point mothra. We should also stop trying to prevent Muslims raping people in case we stigmatise rape victims.



That's not even remotely relative.

Would you like to try again?

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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #24 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:22am
 
Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:18am:
mothra wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 10:58am:
It seems Female Genital Cutting is now thee prefered term over Feale Genital Mutilation.



Muslims and their apologists like to use political correctness to downplay female genital mutilation, their moral bankruptcy has to be seen to be believed.

Why don't you call it a ritual nick or has that already been tried, at least Pru Goward toldthem to bugger off when they tried that nonsense.
abc.net.au/news/2010-05-28/doctors-consider-less-severe-female-circumcision/8447...





No you muppet. FGC incorporates the women who are simply cut (which can have life long problems) with the women who are ore horrendously disfigured.

It is, after all, about the women and not your outrage.
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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #25 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:25am
 
"The conclusions, however, are all too often applied to the entire range of practices that are classified as “FGM” without differentiating the obvious difference in risk posed by varied forms of the practice. Yes, there are blindingly obvious risks associated with infibulations. But it is also obvious that nicking, a practice that involves no removal of tissue or permanent alteration of the female genitalia, is not more risky than forms of male circumcision or body piercing that are widely (though obviously not uniformly) condoned in Western society."
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #26 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:29am
 
mothra wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:19am:
freediver wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:15am:
Good point mothra. We should also stop trying to prevent Muslims raping people in case we stigmatise rape victims.



That's not even remotely relative.

Would you like to try again?



Did I say rape? Sorry. I meant mutilating the genitals of little girls, which is completely different. We should stop trying to prevent Muslims doing this, in case the women who are already victims feel stigmatised. We must stamp out cultural imperialism so that Muslims can continue mutilating girls for another 1400 years.
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #27 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:35am
 
freediver wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:29am:
mothra wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:19am:
freediver wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:15am:
Good point mothra. We should also stop trying to prevent Muslims raping people in case we stigmatise rape victims.



That's not even remotely relative.

Would you like to try again?



Did I say rape? Sorry. I meant mutilating the genitals of little girls, which is completely different. We should stop trying to prevent Muslims doing this, in case the women who are already victims feel stigmatised. We must stamp out cultural imperialism so that Muslims can continue mutilating girls for another 1400 years.



No FD. The people that are fighting this and gaining successes n the ground use the term FGC. They are getting cutters to abandon their tools. THy find the term "mutilating" has an adverse effect on getting people to change their minds.

Can you think why? Do try.

Dd you actually read the articles i posted? I think not. The answers are in there.

And why the need to single out Muslims? Did you know Christians and Aniists perform FGC also? Or are you not worried about them.

Seems to me you are a classic example of a man who doesn't really care about the women and the girls, just wants to use the issue to proote your own prejudices.

You are evidencing that strongly.
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mothra
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #28 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:42am
 
"She began by explaining why she has a problem with the term ‘female genital mutilation’.

‘I think it’s quite harsh and it’s very western-centric,’ Ms Gbla told me. ‘In Africa mostly we call it “female circumcision”, which I think goes to show more respect to the victims, while “female genital mutilation” just conjures up horrible pictures in people’s minds... It doesn’t go to support or help our mental health.’ In brief, she objects to being described repeatedly as someone who is mutilated."
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Re: FGC, not FGM
Reply #29 - Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:46am
 
mothra wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:22am:
Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 9:18am:
mothra wrote on Mar 10th, 2017 at 10:58am:
It seems Female Genital Cutting is now thee prefered term over Feale Genital Mutilation.



Muslims and their apologists like to use political correctness to downplay female genital mutilation, their moral bankruptcy has to be seen to be believed.

Why don't you call it a ritual nick or has that already been tried, at least Pru Goward toldthem to bugger off when they tried that nonsense.
abc.net.au/news/2010-05-28/doctors-consider-less-severe-female-circumcision/8447...





No you muppet. FGC incorporates the women who are simply cut (which can have life long problems) with the women who are ore horrendously disfigured.

It is, after all, about the women and not your outrage.


This is what you're defending,there is no cure for your stupidity.

Quote:
Female circumcision has not been prescribed for no reason, rather there is wisdom behind it and it brings many benefits.

The secretions of the labia minora accumulate in uncircumcised women and turn rancid.I have seen many cases of sickness caused by the lack of circumcision.

Circumcision reduces excessive sensitivity of the clitoris which may cause it to increase in size to 3 centimeters when aroused,which is annoying to the husband, especially at the time of intercourse.

Another benefit of circumcision is that it prevents stimulation of the clitoris which makes it grow large in such a manner that it causes pain.

Circumcision prevents spasms of the clitoris which are a knid of inflammation.

Circumcision reduces excessive sexual desire. ( a muslim man can have 4 wives)

For us in the muslim world,female circumcision is,above all else obedience to Islam.

And Allah knows best.
islamqa.info/en/45528


An Islamic source tells you why female genital mutilation is done and morally bankrupt retards defend this religion.
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Leftists and the Ayatollahs have a lot in common when it comes to criticism of Islam, they don't tolerate it.
 
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