Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print
Trump gag order for government scientists (Read 3696 times)
Raven
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 2982
Around
Trump gag order for government scientists
Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am
 
Science and reason are up for one hell of a fight under the Trump administration. We now live in the Orwellian world of “alternative facts”, which are like facts, but bullshit. It’s surely only a matter of time before the Ministry of Truth is set up.

Right off the bat, controversial oil pipelines have been resurrected on the very same day Trump claimed to the automobile industry that he’s an “environmentalist.” References to climate change have been eradicated from the White House website, with orders for the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) to follow suit. Clean power plans have been scuttled, various scientific agencies are having their Twitter accounts censured, and scientific funding is being bled dry.

Now, as internal memos published by BuzzFeed have revealed, federal scientists were also briefly muzzled from speaking about their work with the press.

The EPA, the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), the Department of Health and Human Services, the Department of Transportation and the National Park Service – all of which contain thousands upon thousands of taxpayer-funded scientists – were told a few days ago to cease and desist any form of communication with the public and the media when it came to their research.

Although still allowed to publish in scientific journals, any reference to their work in any other form would have been banned. News releases, photographs, infographics, fact sheets, and any social media content on Facebook, Twitter, and elsewhere would be prohibited in any form, according to the memos.

They did not explicitly reference President Trump or his new administration, but this is the only authority such a widespread gagging order could have originated from. However, at the time of writing, the administrator of the scientific wing of the USDA rescinded this muzzling order.

There’s no update as of yet on whether or not the other federal agencies have decided to fight back against this information suppression.

It’s worth noting that these agencies ramped up their investigations into climate change and environmental protection under the Obama administration. The climate change denial aspects of Trump and his cabinet has been extensively covered, so it comes as no surprise that they’re attempting to silence their communications to the public.

Worryingly, this is a tactic that has been recently seen in other democracies around the world, including in Canada (under the Harper administration) and right now in the UK.

Although many US governments have to some degree ordered scientists to keep quiet about certain research topics (particularly during a government changeover, as seen during the Bush-Obama transition) the speed at which the Trump administration is apparently seeking to muzzle America’s scientists is astonishing, to say the least.

“To our knowledge, there is not a precedent for large-scale communication freezes like this,” Gretchen Goldman, research director for the Center for Science and Democracy at the Union of Concerned Scientists, told BuzzFeed News.

It’s difficult to completely ban scientists from researching on a particular topic. However, by preventing researchers from even talking about their work, they are clearly hoping the public will stop paying attention to the dangerously warming world and the increasingly decrepit environment around them.

Of course, scientists aren’t going to just stand by and let this happen. They are making it exceedingly clear, through protests, open letters, data salvaging, clever hashtags, and even renegade Twitter accounts, that they will not be silenced.

Ladies and gentlemen, fans of science and reason – welcome to the Resistance.
Back to top
 

Quoth the Raven "Nevermore"

Raven would rather ask questions that may never be answered, then accept answers which must never be questioned.
 
IP Logged
 
Rider
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 2669
OnTheRoad
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #1 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 5:29am
 
The Donald is dismantling the  ministry of truth.

Under Article 2 he is the boss.

Get used to it swampy, your gravy train just got terminated.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Lord Herbert
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 34441
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #2 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 6:13am
 
Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
Science and reason are up for one hell of a fight under the Trump administration.


Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
... many US governments have to some degree ordered scientists to keep quiet about certain research topics.



Quote:
Right off the bat, controversial oil pipelines have been resurrected on the very same day Trump claimed to the automobile industry that he’s an “environmentalist.”


The problem? The pipe-line will go through an injun reservation where the bulldozers will have their work cut out for them removing mountains of empty beer bottles to make room for the pipe-line ...  Grin 

Quote:
References to climate change have been eradicated from the White House website, with orders for the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) to follow suit.


It's wonderful news that at last a realist is in the driver's seat who isn't going to pander to the multi-billion dollar Victimhood Industry that has grown up around the mythology of an anthropogenic Climate Change 'narrative'.

My only gripe against Trump so far is his anti-abortion stance.



Thank you Raven. Please keep us informed of further developments.  Cool

Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #3 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:08am
 
Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
Science and reason are up for one hell of a fight under the Trump administration. We now live in the Orwellian world of “alternative facts”, which are like facts, but bullshit. It’s surely only a matter of time before the Ministry of Truth is set up.

Right off the bat, controversial oil pipelines have been resurrected on the very same day Trump claimed to the automobile industry that he’s an “environmentalist.” References to climate change have been eradicated from the White House website, with orders for the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) to follow suit. Clean power plans have been scuttled, various scientific agencies are having their Twitter accounts censured, and scientific funding is being bled dry.

Now, as internal memos published by BuzzFeed have revealed, federal scientists were also briefly muzzled from speaking about their work with the press.

The EPA, the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), the Department of Health and Human Services, the Department of Transportation and the National Park Service – all of which contain thousands upon thousands of taxpayer-funded scientists – were told a few days ago to cease and desist any form of communication with the public and the media when it came to their research.

Although still allowed to publish in scientific journals, any reference to their work in any other form would have been banned. News releases, photographs, infographics, fact sheets, and any social media content on Facebook, Twitter, and elsewhere would be prohibited in any form, according to the memos.

They did not explicitly reference President Trump or his new administration, but this is the only authority such a widespread gagging order could have originated from. However, at the time of writing, the administrator of the scientific wing of the USDA rescinded this muzzling order.

There’s no update as of yet on whether or not the other federal agencies have decided to fight back against this information suppression.

It’s worth noting that these agencies ramped up their investigations into climate change and environmental protection under the Obama administration. The climate change denial aspects of Trump and his cabinet has been extensively covered, so it comes as no surprise that they’re attempting to silence their communications to the public.

Worryingly, this is a tactic that has been recently seen in other democracies around the world, including in Canada (under the Harper administration) and right now in the UK.

Although many US governments have to some degree ordered scientists to keep quiet about certain research topics (particularly during a government changeover, as seen during the Bush-Obama transition) the speed at which the Trump administration is apparently seeking to muzzle America’s scientists is astonishing, to say the least.

“To our knowledge, there is not a precedent for large-scale communication freezes like this,” Gretchen Goldman, research director for the Center for Science and Democracy at the Union of Concerned Scientists, told BuzzFeed News.

It’s difficult to completely ban scientists from researching on a particular topic. However, by preventing researchers from even talking about their work, they are clearly hoping the public will stop paying attention to the dangerously warming world and the increasingly decrepit environment around them.

Of course, scientists aren’t going to just stand by and let this happen. They are making it exceedingly clear, through protests, open letters, data salvaging, clever hashtags, and even renegade Twitter accounts, that they will not be silenced.

Ladies and gentlemen, fans of science and reason – welcome to the Resistance.


Im not fan of the climate change con, but this disturbs me greatly. Perhaps it is because Trump's reasoning is not to oppose climate chance based on facts or logic, but on ideology. He is opposed to science itself, not just climate science. He wants to shut down the EPA or at least cripple it so it can no longer do its job effectively. and the EPA is basically... science in the environment.

Every day we get yet another reason to fear and mock Trump and the idiots who gave him the job.
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
Dnarever
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 61356
Here
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #4 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:23am
 
I remember when the USA was a democracy.

Where are all the freedom of speech nuts when you need them ?

Isn't the freedom of speech a constitutional right in the USA ?

Does this mean that The Trump presidency have breached the US constitution ?
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #5 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:28am
 
Dnarever wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:23am:
I remember when the USA was a democracy.

Where are all the freedom of speech nuts when you need them ?

Isn't the freedom of speech a constitutional right in the USA ?

Does this mean that The Trump presidency have breached the US constitution ?


Freedom to speak in the workplace is another thing altogether. If your job requires you to not speak to the public or whatever than you are free to quit and then speak.

It is concerning, but the right to speak does not give you freedom from consequences - such as losing your job.

I suspect what we are going to get is some form of the 'Ministry of Truth' where all information from all departments will be filtered through the White house and the last few days has clearly shown that it will me massaged and altered to fit a narrative.

George Bush created the Dept of Homeland Security. Trump will create the Department for Alternative Facts.
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
Sprintcyclist
Gold Member
*****
Offline


OzPolitic

Posts: 41353
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #6 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:33am
 
Rider wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 5:29am:
The Donald is dismantling the  ministry of truth.

Under Article 2 he is the boss.

Get used to it swampy, your gravy train just got terminated.



X 2


Back to top
 

Modern Classic Right Wing
 
IP Logged
 
Dnarever
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 61356
Here
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #7 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 9:11am
 
longweekend58 wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:28am:
Dnarever wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:23am:
I remember when the USA was a democracy.

Where are all the freedom of speech nuts when you need them ?

Isn't the freedom of speech a constitutional right in the USA ?

Does this mean that The Trump presidency have breached the US constitution ?


Freedom to speak in the workplace is another thing altogether. If your job requires you to not speak to the public or whatever than you are free to quit and then speak.

It is concerning, but the right to speak does not give you freedom from consequences - such as losing your job.

I suspect what we are going to get is some form of the 'Ministry of Truth' where all information from all departments will be filtered through the White house and the last few days has clearly shown that it will me massaged and altered to fit a narrative.

George Bush created the Dept of Homeland Security. Trump will create the Department for Alternative Facts.


I missed that they were all employed with the government, still blocking the release of science is a very bad look.

Trump needs a minister for shooting the messenger.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Dnarever
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 61356
Here
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #8 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 9:13am
 
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:33am:
Rider wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 5:29am:
The Donald is dismantling the  ministry of truth.

Under Article 2 he is the boss.

Get used to it swampy, your gravy train just got terminated.



X 2




Trump is trying to hide valid scientific research - you guys would support anything he does in multiple apparently.

This is a disgrace in any terms.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #9 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 9:47am
 
Dnarever wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 9:13am:
Sprintcyclist wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 8:33am:
Rider wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 5:29am:
The Donald is dismantling the  ministry of truth.

Under Article 2 he is the boss.

Get used to it swampy, your gravy train just got terminated.



X 2




Trump is trying to hide valid scientific research - you guys would support anything he does in multiple apparently.

This is a disgrace in any terms.


Agreed. It seems at this stage at least, that he wants to control the entire message of the entire government which can only be bad. It is ironic that with all his claims of rigged elections and fake new, the one really effective way to 'rig elections and send out fake news' is to do exactly what he is doing now.
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
lee
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20189
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #10 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 10:23am
 
Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
The EPA, the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), the Department of Health and Human Services, the Department of Transportation and the National Park Service – all of which contain thousands upon thousands of taxpayer-funded scientists – were told a few days ago to cease and desist any form of communication with the public and the media when it came to their research.



You mean they should only go through PR people like in any large organisation? How terrible. Imagine if a cleaner from tha ATO gave an interview on practises.

Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
References to climate change have been eradicated from the White House website



Not true. They have been archived under Obama as previous things have been posted under their particular Presidents.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/energy/climate-change

So Buzzfeed is a trusted source right?
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #11 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 11:01am
 
lee wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 10:23am:
Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
The EPA, the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), the Department of Health and Human Services, the Department of Transportation and the National Park Service – all of which contain thousands upon thousands of taxpayer-funded scientists – were told a few days ago to cease and desist any form of communication with the public and the media when it came to their research.



You mean they should only go through PR people like in any large organisation? How terrible. Imagine if a cleaner from tha ATO gave an interview on practises.

Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
References to climate change have been eradicated from the White House website



Not true. They have been archived under Obama as previous things have been posted under their particular Presidents.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/energy/climate-change

So Buzzfeed is a trusted source right?


but they ARENT going through PR. They are now having to be processed by the WHite house. You dont think those messages might be largely discarded and the rest politically massaged?
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
longweekend58
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 45675
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #12 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 11:32am
 
lee wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 10:23am:
Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
The EPA, the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), the Department of Health and Human Services, the Department of Transportation and the National Park Service – all of which contain thousands upon thousands of taxpayer-funded scientists – were told a few days ago to cease and desist any form of communication with the public and the media when it came to their research.



You mean they should only go through PR people like in any large organisation? How terrible. Imagine if a cleaner from tha ATO gave an interview on practises.

Raven wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 4:34am:
References to climate change have been eradicated from the White House website



Not true. They have been archived under Obama as previous things have been posted under their particular Presidents.

https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/energy/climate-change

So Buzzfeed is a trusted source right?


Stop doing a peccahead and playing the pedantry game. Raven is right. Archives are not the same as the actual current website.
Back to top
 

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
IP Logged
 
lee
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20189
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #13 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 12:08pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 11:32am:
Raven is right. Archives are not the same as the actual current website.


But the current website is for the current President. Capiche?

Why would an ex-President feature on a new President's website?

It is not pedantry; it is fact. See if you can find Carter's stuff on Clinton's website.

Why are you so desperate to find fault?
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
lee
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 20189
Gender: male
Re: Trump gag order for government scientists
Reply #14 - Jan 26th, 2017 at 12:11pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Jan 26th, 2017 at 11:01am:
but they ARENT going through PR. They are now having to be processed by the WHite house. You dont think those messages might be largely discarded and the rest politically massaged?



And you don't think disgruntled employees would issue politically massaged messages? Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 
Send Topic Print