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The growing Centrelink debt scandal (Read 41763 times)
Jovial Monk
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #240 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:16pm
 
Another abusive post. Sign of an inferior mind.
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Grendel
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #241 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:16pm
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 7:36pm:
Quote:
a Victorian-based Centrelink staffer told Fairfax Media staff warned the Department of Human Services that automated data matching would lead to incorrect debts being issued.


They need to put back the manual checking they took away to increase (they thought) the rate of recovery of debts.

NO....
The ALP created a system in order to free up staff because as anyone with an ounce of knowledge knows... Centrelink and its sytems are overly complicated and they have always been understaffed when it comes to looking after clients.  Waiting time whether in Offices or on the phones have always been far too long.  Hence the need for automation.

The Automated debt recovery system created by the ALP however is flawed.  The programming is creating errors.  The correct method to fix the problem is to suspend the use of the system until the programming is corrected and it ceases to produce errors.
Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

It is pointless and a waste of time and effort to create an automated system to then have to recheck it manually.  Only an idiot would do that. Cheesy
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Jovial Monk
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #242 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:19pm
 
Oh dear, back to 2011 for roach. Anyway he can make Labor look bad and the Libs good.

You are desperate if you refer to a press release in 2011 to explain the mess now.
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TheFunPolice
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #243 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:23pm
 
Grendel wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:05pm:
Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 5:44pm:
You are a rightard and Wilkie is a flake.

The system is stuffed because manual checking no longer happens.

And that is the talk of an idiot. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

...which is why Turnbull is bugger**  Grin ?!?!
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TheFunPolice
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #244 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:25pm
 
Grendel wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:16pm:
Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 7:36pm:
Quote:
a Victorian-based Centrelink staffer told Fairfax Media staff warned the Department of Human Services that automated data matching would lead to incorrect debts being issued.


They need to put back the manual checking they took away to increase (they thought) the rate of recovery of debts.

NO....
The ALP created a system in order to free up staff because as anyone with an ounce of knowledge knows... Centrelink and its sytems are overly complicated and they have always been understaffed when it comes to looking after clients.  Waiting time whether in Offices or on the phones have always been far too long.  Hence the need for automation.

The Automated debt recovery system created by the ALP however is flawed.  The programming is creating errors.  The correct method to fix the problem is to suspend the use of the system until the programming is corrected and it ceases to produce errors.
Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

It is pointless and a waste of time and effort to create an automated system to then have to recheck it manually.  Only an idiot would do that. Cheesy

Was that a lecture on the subject of logic, perhaps?  Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked


..because turnbull is m'th'rf'n fried if it was...........  Embarrassed
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TheFunPolice
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #245 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:26pm
 
libs are gone,.. ooooooooooops  Shocked
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Bam
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #246 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 9:43pm
 
Another Pope cartoon.
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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #247 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 9:53pm
 
Still waiting for the announcement that this nonsense will be suspended and checked.... how's the Ombudsman going?
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Bam
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #248 - Jan 11th, 2017 at 11:03pm
 
The cartoonists are having a lot of fun at the government's expense. Another one by Pope.

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Grendel
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #249 - Jan 12th, 2017 at 7:46am
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:19pm:
Oh dear, back to 2011 for roach. Anyway he can make Labor look bad and the Libs good.

You are desperate if you refer to a press release in 2011 to explain the mess now.

YOU got nothin Monk...  best you just shut up eh... Grin Grin Grin
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Jovial Monk
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #250 - Jan 12th, 2017 at 7:51am
 
NBNfail, Censusfail and Taxofficefail now brings us Centrelinkfail - this mob literally defines the popular meme....


...

Libs, the bringers of cut price disasters. It is obvious these fools never think anything through and never listen to experts. By attacking the poor, the sick and the old they are building up hatreds that will see them split and disappear.

The NBN—$60Bn spent to give us a slight improvement over ADSL except that the state of the copper is so crap that people getting lower bandwidth on VDSL than ADSL is far from rare. Running VDSL over Telstra copper also sees reliability drop rapidly. Drop outs are a fact of life. Continuing the FTTH rollout would have been far cheaper and would be now be earning NBN Co very good revenues even tho CVC charges would by now be much lower.

Census fail. Complete lack of proper planning. You can’t just switch a major activity like the census from manual to computerised in one go! You think the conversion through, prepare a design brief, send it to multiple vendors etc to get the best solution then you test and test the resultant computerised version, run it in parallel. The ABS computers were overloaded (no proper planning, see) and crashed.

Tax Office fail. Sacked thousands of workers. Those expert in international tax are now working for the big four accounting firms advising companies how to evade tax. This is real shoot in the foot stuff, gobsmackingly stupid!

Centrelink fail. Removing the manual checking and just churning out the letters to generate revenue without regard to legal isssues. Pure revenue generating measure, the $4Bn not so much a saving as a target. They know that huge numbers of false debts are being created and they don’t care!

Pension fail—the stinking Green neocons share responsibility here—will see part pensioners restructure their finances and claim the full aged pension. Completely stupid crap just not thought through!

Complete lack of thought. The stench of cronyism on the NBN Board/upper management, the idiocy of the documents used to justify switching to the MTM from ubiquitous FTTH suggests a huge level of corruption. Most of those board members came from Telstra and have huge Telstra shareholdings—conflict of interest writ large!
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Grendel
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #251 - Jan 12th, 2017 at 7:54am
 
Jovial Monk wrote on Jan 11th, 2017 at 8:16pm:
Another abusive post. Sign of an inferior mind.

LOL that's a joke coming from you, you really know how to abuse, I've seen it...  good to see you've managed to stop using the C-word...  if you think I'm being abusive...  you are kidding yourself. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy  You keep lying about me and my politics you keep lying about what I say...  don't expect me to be courteous to you. Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
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Jovial Monk
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #252 - Jan 12th, 2017 at 8:33am
 
You have called me an idiot several times in this thread alone. All because you are trying to push the lie that the ALP caused the Centrelink debacle. Just not believable.

That you blame the ALP and protect the Libs—that shows what your political leanings are.
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Bam
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #253 - Jan 12th, 2017 at 8:45am
 
How Centrelink debt letters are harming Australians' mental health

Quote:
Policies that mitigate the stress of poverty and promote mental health would more effectively reduce the welfare burden than scaring individuals into paying back debts they're unlikely to have, writes Erin Stewart.

Anyone who has suffered mental anguish as a direct consequence of these fraudulent letters should look after their mental health first, and then consult a lawyer for possible litigation. Punitive damages may be claimable from Centrelink and the government.
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Bam
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Re: The growing Centrelink debt scandal
Reply #254 - Jan 12th, 2017 at 8:51am
 
Government knew about discrepancies in data-matching system before reducing human oversight

Quote:
The government drastically reduced human oversight of Centrelink’s data-matching system despite holding internal analysis showing that 15% of detected discrepancies were not debts owed by people.

The Department of Human Services conducted a cost-benefit analysis of the effectiveness of its data-matching process with the Australian Taxation Office for 2011-12, 2012-13 and 2013-14.

The system detected 1,080,000 discrepancies from 866,000 welfare recipients, which, at that stage, were manually examined by Centrelink staff to weed out errors. The analysis found 85% of those discrepancies led to a debt of an average value of $1,440.

The analysis was referred to in 2015, in response to a question on notice from the Labor senator Doug Cameron to the Department of Human Services secretary, Kathryn Campbell, who, like the human services minister, Alan Tudge, has been on leave for much of the recent debt recovery controversy.

In mid-2016, as part of its attempt to ramp up the debt recovery program, manual oversight was largely removed. Now when a discrepancy is detected the system automatically sends out a letter; more than 169,000 have been delivered since July.

If no response is received or someone is unable to dispute the tax office’s figures, individuals are told to begin paying. Even when a person disputes the debt, they are told to start paying.

In many cases, welfare recipients are not receiving initial letters owing to changes of address, or are unable to track down years-old information about their income to prove they were entitled to benefits.

Labor’s Linda Burney said the analyisis showed the government knew “thousands of honest people were going to be targeted but he pushed ahead anyway”.

“That is an incredible failure of administration,” she said. “People deserve to see the full business case and methodology the government have used to inflict so much distress on the community.

“Minister Tudge says the system ‘is working’. Not for those calling my office day in and day out. How many people are paying false debt while they are waiting for review?”

Burney questioned whether the 85% figure included debts later found to be baseless, and called on the government to release the analysis and the business case in full.

Tudge said the system continued to operate in largely the same way it had for years. He said people were given multiple chances to explain any discrepancy.

“The methodology is precisely the same that has been used for many years now, with the main difference that we’ve automated more of the process,” he said.

“When there is that discrepancy, I think it’s reasonable to ask people about that discrepancy, and ask them to explain if there is a valid reason for it. So that’s what has always been the case, it’s what we continue to do.”

The St Vincent de Paul Society has joined calls for the system to be suspended. The chief executive of its national council, Dr John Falzon, said on Tuesday that Centrelink needed to be properly resourced, and described the debt recovery scheme as “part of a broader assault on the social security system”.

“People should not be intimidated and hounded for money they do not owe,” he said. “Centrelink should not be used by the government as a blunt weapon to achieve a deficit reduction on the backs of people who already carry the greatest burden of inequality.”

The Australian Council for Social Service said on Wednesday that the government fundamentally failed in its duty of care to welfare recipients.

Its acting chief executive, Peter Davidson, said the system was treating them like second-class citizens. “Centrelink must properly investigate overpayments rather than shift the onus of proof on to Centrelink recipients,” he said.

“This would not be accepted from a private creditor and it should not be accepted from a government agency assisting financially vulnerable people.”

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