Australian Politics Forum - Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders

cods

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #120 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 6:23pm

Aussie wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 5:58pm:

cods, the difference is that Cops have been given guns. That means they MUST be trained to use them safely, and that training ought to include preparation for the many different situations they might be confronted with....and this one ought to have been reasonably foreseeable by any competent trainer.

oh I agree whole heartedly.....but you will have to admit that will take a lot longer and they are talking mental illness... I mean even those who do mental illness struggle...

yet we expect the police to suddenly deal with every and any situation...

its a big ask aussie...every situation is different..

you can only train to a certain point....and even cops feel fear.

lets not forget that no training should ever disappear that..... it is part of our survival psyche

why they didnt use the laser is an issue.. but then who knows it could have sent him into a fit or something... we dont know but lets face it the police know more about this person than we do..and maybe what he was capable of doing..

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Aussie

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #121 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 6:24pm

Gnads wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 6:13pm:

Aussie wrote on Jun 9^th, 2016 at 7:20pm:

freediver wrote on Jun 9^th, 2016 at 7:04pm:

Whenever the police shoot and kill someone, people demand to know why they didn't aim for the legs instead. This is why.

If they can't hit what they are aiming at....at that range they ought have their Glocks taken off them. I can group pretty well at my age (21) using a very aged range .22 Smith & Wesson revolver at 25 yards. If they (aged 80) can't hit a shoulder, or a leg of a slow moving person at about at most 5 metres, they should not have a gun.

like using a cap gun ... smack all recoil ...

9 mm a tad different you'll find

just like previous Police issue 38 Smith & Wesson

Maybe a .22 cal would have been more effective and accurate.

Dunno about 'effective.' I agree there is little recoil with a .22 but I'm not shabby either with a larger calibre. I simply prefer the .22. It's less noisy as well.

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Gnads Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 33190 Gender:	Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders Reply #122 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 6:46pm Anyway ... even in my workplace when a safety critical situation occurs the first rule of thumb is before you act you assess the situation ... a risk assessment in your head she blew it .... big time
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Fuzzball

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #123 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:05pm

cods wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 5:51pm:

when we have never even been close to being in a situation like this... we can sure be judgmental...

After being in situations exactly like that, I'd have to say you can sure be judgemental when you know absolutely nothing about me or a confrontation like that. Engage your brain before opening your mouth.

Using your firearm in a shopping centre unless people are actually being stabbed is wrong, and when a firearm is required unless there is no other alternative (Taser, Pepper Spray, police dog), marksmen would be on the scene, not your average plod who hasn't been trained for that situation.

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GordyL

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #124 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:11pm

cods wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 6:23pm:

Aussie wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 5:58pm:

cods, the difference is that Cops have been given guns. That means they MUST be trained to use them safely, and that training ought to include preparation for the many different situations they might be confronted with....and this one ought to have been reasonably foreseeable by any competent trainer.

oh I agree whole heartedly.....but you will have to admit that will take a lot longer and they are talking mental illness... I mean even those who do mental illness struggle...

yet we expect the police to suddenly deal with every and any situation...

its a big ask aussie...every situation is different..

you can only train to a certain point....and even cops feel fear.

lets not forget that no training should ever disappear that..... it is part of our survival psyche

why they didnt use the laser

Because the miss rates with lasers is even worse than these police. Haven't you seen a Star Wars movie? The light saber would have done the job.

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Dustwun Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 545 Igloo Gender:	Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders Reply #125 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:25pm In my experience women are not so good in high stress situations. Some are but they seem the exception .
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Bobby. Gold Member Online Australian Politics Posts: 118049 Melbourne Gender:	Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders Reply #126 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:40pm Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:18am: Is the policewoman being charged with GBH? No proper answer from anyone. Is she being charged or not?
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Aussie

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #127 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:52pm

Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:40pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:18am:

Is the policewoman being charged with GBH?

No proper answer from anyone.

Is she being charged or not?

I'm sure no-one outside the Police have any idea what is happening. I doubt she'll be charged with GBH. She will be disciplined internally.

Yet, I'll bet you that if I was the shooter and caused the same injuries in the same circumstances, I would have already been charged and be begging/pleading for bail.

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cods

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #128 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:58pm

Fuzzball wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:05pm:

cods wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 5:51pm:

when we have never even been close to being in a situation like this... we can sure be judgmental...

After being in situations exactly like that, I'd have to say you can sure be judgemental when you know absolutely nothing about me or a confrontation like that. Engage your brain before opening your mouth.

Using your firearm in a shopping centre unless people are actually being stabbed is wrong, and when a firearm is required unless there is no other alternative (Taser, Pepper Spray, police dog), marksmen would be on the scene, not your average plod who hasn't been trained for that situation.

well I didnt mistake the rude part.... and I was referring to just about everyone on this thread..

when you say you have been in a life and death situation.. we only have your word for it.. it wasnt captured on video for the world to comment on was it???>..

you average plod has been trained for most situration ones that happen almost every day.. I know I had two coppers in my family..

however this situation is not AN EVERY DAY OCCURRENCE>>>

and like I said these coppers or plods as you call them... do have the fear like most of us...except you of course.

I fell for this copper I really do.. I do not believe anyone could be trained to deal with that situation and receive everyones blessing.... she will be judged and labeled for the rest of her life...

all because some mental case... was on day release????????????? Cheesy

where did he get the knife??... oh maybe they gave him that in case he wanted to eat out.. Angry

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cods

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #129 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:59pm

Aussie wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:52pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:40pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:18am:

Is the policewoman being charged with GBH?

No proper answer from anyone.

Is she being charged or not?

I'm sure no-one outside the Police have any idea what is happening. I doubt she'll be charged with GBH. She will be disciplined internally.

Yet, I'll bet you that if I was the shooter and caused the same injuries in the same circumstances, I would have already been charged and be begging/pleading for bail.

there is sadly every possibility she could get stood down without pay for the duration of the inquiry

its been done before...

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Bobby.

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #130 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:59pm

Aussie wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:52pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:40pm:

Bobby. wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:18am:

Is the policewoman being charged with GBH?

No proper answer from anyone.

Is she being charged or not?

I'm sure no-one outside the Police have any idea what is happening. I doubt she'll be charged with GBH. She will be disciplined internally.

Yet, I'll bet you that if I was the shooter and caused the same injuries in the same circumstances, I would have already been charged and be begging/pleading for bail.

She should be in jail -

it was reckless conduct endangering life & grievous bodily harm.

Any citizen who did what she did would be remanded in custody right now.

She could have shot at nearly point blank range - less than 1 meter & not missed & still would have been safe.

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red baron

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #131 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 8:03pm

When I was in the Police Force and the Air Force there was only one way that you were taught to use a firearm. If you draw and fire, you fire at the centre of the seen mass. No feedback I have had since then indicates that current officers are taught any different.

You see if you have cause to draw and use your firearm then you have cause to believe that your life or someone elses' is in imminent danger.

So when you fire you are firing to kill. Make no bones about it.

The Officer in question fired point blank from four metres and missed with both shots. I can only surmise that she panicked and 'pulled' her shots, you 'have to' squeeze the trigger not ram it back or your muzzle will be dragged off the target.

She is human and it happens, luckily for her the assailant changed direction, immediately after the shots or she would have been dead meat.

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Setanta Gold Member Offline \/ Peace man! Posts: 17241 Northern NSW Gender:	Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders Reply #132 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 9:07pm cods wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 7:58pm: where did he get the knife??... oh maybe they gave him that in case he wanted to eat out.. Well he wasn't a Mohammedan then, they are forbidden to eat pork!
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ian

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #133 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 9:42pm

Aussie wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 5:58pm:

cods, the difference is that Cops have been given guns. That means they MUST be trained to use them safely, and that training ought to include preparation for the many different situations they might be confronted with....and this one ought to have been reasonably foreseeable by any competent trainer.

They are trained, thats the issue. some serious comprehension problems here.

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Aussie

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Re: Police shooting at Hornsby wounds bystanders
Reply #134 - Jun 10^th, 2016 at 9:45pm

ian wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 9:42pm:

Aussie wrote on Jun 10^th, 2016 at 5:58pm:

cods, the difference is that Cops have been given guns. That means they MUST be trained to use them safely, and that training ought to include preparation for the many different situations they might be confronted with....and this one ought to have been reasonably foreseeable by any competent trainer.

They are trained, thats the issue. some serious comprehension problems here.

Isn't it self evident that whatever the training was, it failed as is indicated by the shooting of bystanders?

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