Australian Politics Forum - Not so 'moderate' Muslims

polite_gandalf

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #75 - Mar 30^th, 2016 at 7:08pm

freediver wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 6:22pm:

I also said your lunatic co-religionists should be free to express their opinions about blasphemy. You weren't complaining then, were you Gandalf?

lol - I was the one who argued that placards saying "behead those who insult the prophet" should be banned - remember? So yeah, I pretty much was complaining then. But its understandable you forgot that - we only debated it for about a month.

But you didn't answer my question FD - do you think turning this forum into a soapbox for right wing extremists to demand muslims have their rights systematically stripped away poses a threat to muslim's freedom?

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 98421	Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia Reply #76 - Mar 30^th, 2016 at 7:26pm Sorry, FD, what am I arguing again? I’ve forgotten.
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Karnal

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #77 - Mar 30^th, 2016 at 7:32pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 7:08pm:

freediver wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 6:22pm:

I also said your lunatic co-religionists should be free to express their opinions about blasphemy. You weren't complaining then, were you Gandalf?

lol - I was the one who argued that placards saying "behead those who insult the prophet" should be banned - remember? So yeah, I pretty much was complaining then. But its understandable you forgot that - we only debated it for about a month. freedom?

I see. So it was you who threatened to sue poor FD. Shame on you for destroying FD’s Freeeeedom, G.

Sorry, I mean the Freeeeedom of other decent white people everywhere - like those who suggest we behead all those who insult the prophet.

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freediver

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #78 - Mar 30^th, 2016 at 8:52pm

Quote:

Sorry, FD, what am I arguing again?

That it doesn't matter if Muslims chip away at those freedoms we do not routinely choose to exercise.

Quote:

lol - I was the one who argued that placards saying "behead those who insult the prophet" should be banned - remember? So yeah, I pretty much was complaining then.

Here you go Gandalf - two days ago:

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 28^th, 2016 at 2:30pm:

Its a nothing question FD - if we both agree that 'the Scots' shouldn't do anything to violate his right to free speech. So we get on to the bleeding obvious stuff like condemn his views and say how wrong they are. And in case I'm not clear enough, that course of action (condemn and say he is wrong) is my final answer to the original question.

But far more relevant is to ask what the muslim community that he represents should be doing - in which case I would answer that they should democratically move to have him removed from his position, or at the very least censure him.

Quote:

But you didn't answer my question FD - do you think turning this forum into a soapbox for right wing extremists to demand muslims have their rights systematically stripped away poses a threat to muslim's freedom?

No. I also let you post here Gandalf. It's a politics forum.

What opinions would you like to ban, in the name of freedom?

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 98421	Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia Reply #79 - Mar 30^th, 2016 at 10:08pm Thanks for reminding me, FD. Strange, I don’t remember saying that. Sometimes a question is just a question, no?
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ian Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 9451	Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia Reply #80 - Mar 30^th, 2016 at 11:36pm Lol at Karnal desperately struggling to remain relevant.
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polite_gandalf

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #81 - Mar 31^st, 2016 at 6:46am

freediver wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 8:52pm:

Here you go Gandalf - two days ago:

Gee thanks for that random quote of mine that has absolutely nothing to do with what you were arguing.

freediver wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 8:52pm:

No. I also let you post here Gandalf. It's a politics forum.

What opinions would you like to ban, in the name of freedom?

Nice strawman FD. Would you like to have another go at the actual question I asked?

Do you think turning this forum into a spineless apologist soapbox for right wing extremism against muslims poses a threat to the freedom of muslims? (hint: the answer has nothing to do with what should and shouldn't be allowed to be posted)

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 98421	Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia Reply #82 - Mar 31^st, 2016 at 8:40am ian wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 11:36pm: Lol at Karnal desperately struggling to remain relevant. Relevant? When has the traitorous spineless apologist Karnal ever been relevant? We'll leave the relevance to Yadda, Ian. Right now, FD's answering questions.
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Frank

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #83 - Mar 31^st, 2016 at 5:45pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 29^th, 2016 at 7:14pm:

Frank wrote on Mar 29^th, 2016 at 4:21pm:

WHat's your point?

Your entire narrative is about the hive-mind muslim horde all vying for western blood. Acknowledging the vast majority of muslim victims of terrorism would contradict this hive-mind narrative. Thats why you ignore it and talk only about christian and non-muslim victims of terror - even though these victims comprises less than 5% of the victims of Islamic terrorism.

Acknowledging 58 dead muslims out of 74 victims at the Lahore Easter celebration would obviously necessitate acknowledging a large number of muslims celebrating easter with christians - and that obviously is unacceptable. So you pretend all the victims were christian.

I pretend that the victims were Christians? Where do I pretend?

Christians were TARGETED:

Jamaat-ul-Ahrar (JuA), a faction of the Pakistani Taliban, has taken credit for the Easter-Day massacre and specified its purpose.

“The target was Christians,” said JuA spokesman, Ehsanullah Ehsan, who added that the jihadists wanted to send a message to Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif “that we have entered Lahore.”

It seems that your point is that it is OK for jihadis to TARGET Christians as long as they are stupid and callous enough to kill more Muslims than Christians. More Muslims dies so never mind that Christians are TARGETED.

It is all done in the name of Islam and following Mohammed's example: Jamaat-ul-Ahrar ("Assembly of the Free") is a militant Sunni Islamic group that split away from the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan in August 2014.

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freediver

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #84 - Mar 31^st, 2016 at 6:20pm

Karnal wrote on Mar 30^th, 2016 at 10:08pm:

Thanks for reminding me, FD. Strange, I don’t remember saying that.

Sometimes a question is just a question, no?

Do you think we should concern ourselves with those particular freedoms we do not routinely choose to exercise, like the right to draw cartoons of Muhammed?

Quote:

Gee thanks for that random quote of mine that has absolutely nothing to do with what you were arguing.

It is relevant because you are supporting this Imam's right to speak in support of death for blasphemy.

Quote:

Do you think turning this forum into a spineless apologist soapbox for right wing extremism against muslims poses a threat to the freedom of muslims? (hint: the answer has nothing to do with what should and shouldn't be allowed to be posted)

This forum is a bit of software Gandalf. It does not apologise for anything. Nor do I exert the control over opinions that you suggest.

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Frank

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #85 - Mar 31^st, 2016 at 7:57pm

Frank wrote on Mar 29^th, 2016 at 6:59pm:

polite_gandalf wrote on Mar 29^th, 2016 at 12:49pm:

What rubbish.

Its like saying there will be a lot less labour party gatherings in Norway after Anders Brievik's rampage.

It was a single incident - name me one other incident in the west where a muslim has been murdered, or even attacked by other muslims for being nice to Christians. I can't think of any. And thats why its world headline news and we're all talking about it - because it almost never happens. Far more muslim women are physically attacked in the west for wearing a hijab, but there's no evidence less women wear the hijab.

What about all the honour killings of Muslim girls who look at Western boys or go out with them or just dress like Western girls? Far, far too many of them are killed by their families for - being nice to non-Muslims.

Gandalf, did you miss this response to your question?

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Karnal Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 98421	Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia Reply #86 - Mar 31^st, 2016 at 8:17pm Sorry, FD, I lost concentration after "do you think we should concern.ourselves...". Do you want to ask.me another question?
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polite_gandalf

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #87 - Apr 1^st, 2016 at 10:17am

freediver wrote on Mar 31^st, 2016 at 6:20pm:

It is relevant because you are supporting this Imam's right to speak in support of death for blasphemy.

And yet I don't support spinelessly apologising for it.

My point is, once again, freedom is only a one-way street for you: you are passionate about countering attacks on freedom by muslims, but adopt a "nothing to see here" approach when this freedom crusade of yours turns into attacks on muslim's freedom. I am not talking about what you do and don't allow to be published - everyone knows you are happy to have all manner of opinions aired here, so don't keep bringing up that strawman. I'm talking about your own warped way of advocating freedom: as soon as anyone is perceived to be suggesting that Islam shouldn't be criticised, you scream it down from the rooftops, start a month-long thread on it and rant on and on about what a threat such a sentiment is to freedom. But when people suggest (as they do on a daily basis) that muslims should be banned, deported and systematically have their freedoms taken from them, FD is nowhere to be seen. Suddenly freedom isn't such an important thing - when its the freedom of muslims being attacked.

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A resident Islam critic who claims to represent western values said:
Quote:

Outlawing the enemy's uniform - hijab, islamic beard - is not depriving one's own people of their freedoms.

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 50550 At my desk.	Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia Reply #88 - Apr 1^st, 2016 at 7:26pm Am I right that you are criticising things I do not say again?
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Frank

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Re: Not so 'moderate' Muslims - and Western inertia
Reply #89 - Apr 1^st, 2016 at 7:57pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Apr 1^st, 2016 at 10:17am:

freediver wrote on Mar 31^st, 2016 at 6:20pm:

It is relevant because you are supporting this Imam's right to speak in support of death for blasphemy.

And yet I don't support spinelessly apologising for it.

My point is, once again, freedom is only a one-way street for you: you are passionate about countering attacks on freedom by muslims, but adopt a "nothing to see here" approach when this freedom crusade of yours turns into attacks on muslim's freedom. I am not talking about what you do and don't allow to be published - everyone knows you are happy to have all manner of opinions aired here, so don't keep bringing up that strawman. I'm talking about your own warped way of advocating freedom: as soon as anyone is perceived to be suggesting that Islam shouldn't be criticised, you scream it down from the rooftops, start a month-long thread on it and rant on and on about what a threat such a sentiment is to freedom. But when people suggest (as they do on a daily basis) that muslims should be banned, deported and systematically have their freedoms taken from them, FD is nowhere to be seen. Suddenly freedom isn't such an important thing - when its the freedom of muslims being attacked.

Muslims want to end freedom in the name of Islam.

You MUST be aware of that very significant point. Islam is Submission, not Freedom.

Why is it 'warped' to not afford Islam a special sanctuary from criticism? What is special about Islam?

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