Australian Politics Forum - A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #60 - Mar 7^th, 2016 at 9:10pm

Swagman wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:47pm:

Its time wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:34pm:

Swagman wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:31pm:

stunspore wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:29pm:

. Penalty rates don't cause unemployment.

Outside the market compulsory ones do.

It's factored in to the Mon-Fri price Swag, don't pretend it isn't .

...depends on the business. They are all different. That variety, fickle trading conditions, variable purchasing power, availability of working capital is why penalty rates shouldn't be compulsory.

What good is all that if the very thing that keeps your doors open no longer has the spending power they once did.

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stunspore Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 5097 Gender:	Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates Reply #61 - Mar 7^th, 2016 at 10:15pm Swagman wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:31pm: stunspore wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:29pm: . Penalty rates don't cause unemployment. Outside the market compulsory ones do. No they dont.
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Swagman

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #62 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 8:39am

stunspore wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 10:15pm:

Swagman wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:31pm:

stunspore wrote on Mar 7^th, 2016 at 8:29pm:

. Penalty rates don't cause unemployment.

Outside the market compulsory ones do.

No they dont.

Uncompetitive businesses fail. Business failures cause unemployemnt. Outside the market compulsory penalty rates make businesses uncompetitive. They either fail or don't even get off the ground at all. If they fail, it causes unemployment, if they don't get off the ground or stay closed then lots of potential jobs are foregone.

Australia's manufacturing industry is a good example. It has declined 50% over the last 40 years due to it's inability to be viable (uncompetitiveness) Sad

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51474 Gender:	Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates Reply #63 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 8:41am So business moves to China. So raise tariff rates which have been lowered too much.
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Wolseley Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1453 Sydney Gender:	Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates Reply #64 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:11am Swagman wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 8:39am: Australia's manufacturing industry is a good example. It has declined 50% over the last 40 years due to it's inability to be viable (uncompetitiveness) But what does this have to do with cafes charging a surcharge on weekends?
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stunspore

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #65 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:13am

Unless a cafe have teleport powers to teleport staff in amd out of australia they all play in the same market with the same rules including penalty rates. International or otherwise. Same rulea means not out of the market but in the market.

Again i know how pointless swag tries to persuade. He wont with hia hypertheticals.

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John Smith

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #66 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:34am

Wolseley wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:11am:

Swagman wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 8:39am:

Australia's manufacturing industry is a good example. It has declined 50% over the last 40 years due to it's inability to be viable (uncompetitiveness)

But what does this have to do with cafes charging a surcharge on weekends?

nothing ... but that won't stop Swag. He has blinkers on when it comes to penalty rates.

Apparently they caused the famine in Ethiopia too! Cheesy

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Wolseley

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #67 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:57am

Apparently there was a change to the legislation in 2009 requiring prices of all components of the charge to be displayed, which rendered a 10% surcharge illegal unless the menus gave both the normal and the Sunday/Public Holiday prices for each item. This was amended in mid-2013 to allowed cafe and restaurant owners to simply make a statement on the menu saying that there was a 10% surcharge (or whatever other percentage it might be) thus restoring the decades old practice of charging the surcharge as a percentage of the final bill.

Quote:

Certainty finally delivered on menu surcharge laws

2 July, 2013

Rosemary Ryan

The foodservice industry can finally return to safely adding surcharges to their menus following the passing of a bill in Federal Parliament.

Under previous legislation restaurants and cafes were not allowed to just state that a surcharge would apply on days such as weekends or public holidays. Instead they were required to provide a separate menu for those days with the prices including the extra charge factored in.

The bill passed last week exempts restaurants and cafés from the single pricing requirement in Australian Consumer Law.

Assistant Treasurer David Bradbury said in a statement that the move was an important win for small business.

"Restaurants and cafes are a valuable part of the Australian economy, so it is important that these businesses are not subject to any unnecessary regulatory burden," he said.

"These amendments will cut red tape for small business, enabling many venues that are open on weekends and public holidays to go about their business without fear of accidentally falling foul of the law."

http://www.hospitalitymagazine.com.au/food/news/certainty-finally-delivered-on-m... [/quote]

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Swagman

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #68 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 1:11pm

Wolseley wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:11am:

Swagman wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 8:39am:

Australia's manufacturing industry is a good example. It has declined 50% over the last 40 years due to it's inability to be viable (uncompetitiveness)

But what does this have to do with cafes charging a surcharge on weekends?

....the discussion just developed that way. The surcharge is subject to the market. The cafe may lose business to a competitor that is not charging a surcharge. Whilst the penalty rate is an imposition.

If the cafe with the surcharge starts losing business it will drop the surcharge. It can't do that with penalty rates? They are compulsory. A millstone around its neck.

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Vic

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #69 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 2:39pm

Wolseley wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 9:57am:

Apparently there was a change to the legislation in 2009 requiring prices of all components of the charge to be displayed, which rendered a 10% surcharge illegal unless the menus gave both the normal and the Sunday/Public Holiday prices for each item. This was amended in mid-2013 to allowed cafe and restaurant owners to simply make a statement on the menu saying that there was a 10% surcharge (or whatever other percentage it might be) thus restoring the decades old practice of charging the surcharge as a percentage of the final bill.

Quote:

Certainty finally delivered on menu surcharge laws

2 July, 2013

Rosemary Ryan

The foodservice industry can finally return to safely adding surcharges to their menus following the passing of a bill in Federal Parliament.

Under previous legislation restaurants and cafes were not allowed to just state that a surcharge would apply on days such as weekends or public holidays. Instead they were required to provide a separate menu for those days with the prices including the extra charge factored in.

The bill passed last week exempts restaurants and cafés from the single pricing requirement in Australian Consumer Law.

Assistant Treasurer David Bradbury said in a statement that the move was an important win for small business.

"Restaurants and cafes are a valuable part of the Australian economy, so it is important that these businesses are not subject to any unnecessary regulatory burden," he said.

"These amendments will cut red tape for small business, enabling many venues that are open on weekends and public holidays to go about their business without fear of accidentally falling foul of the law."

http://www.hospitalitymagazine.com.au/food/news/certainty-finally-delivered-on-m...

[/quote]

Well there you go! I never knew that!

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Football, Meat Pies, Kangaroos and Liberal Lies

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Bruce Baines New Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21 Gender:	Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates Reply #70 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 2:45pm If you are a Cafe owner who cannot afford the wages to open on a Sunday/public holiday... then don't open. If your business isn't successful enough to make money on those days, YOU need to change, not wage law.
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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates Reply #71 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:13pm Bruce Baines wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 2:45pm: If you are a Cafe owner who cannot afford the wages to open on a Sunday/public holiday... then don't open. ...thanks Bruce, good example of penalty rates causing unemployment.
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Jovial Monk

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #72 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:20pm

Swagman wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:13pm:

Bruce Baines wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 2:45pm:

If you are a Cafe owner who cannot afford the wages to open on a Sunday/public holiday... then don't open.

...thanks Bruce, good example of penalty rates causing unemployment.

Sounds to me much more like the cafe doesn’t do enough business on a Sunday.

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Swagman

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Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates
Reply #73 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:24pm

Jovial Monk wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:20pm:

Swagman wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:13pm:

Bruce Baines wrote on Mar 8^th, 2016 at 2:45pm:

If you are a Cafe owner who cannot afford the wages to open on a Sunday/public holiday... then don't open.

...thanks Bruce, good example of penalty rates causing unemployment.

Sounds to me much more like the cafe doesn’t do enough business on a Sunday.

The market not strong enough huh?

....maybe the Govt should force people to buy coffee at his business on Sundays like they force him to pay penalty rates? Cheesy

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51474 Gender:	Re: A Surcharge To Cover Penalty Rates Reply #74 - Mar 8^th, 2016 at 7:29pm Maybe take a break now and then swag?
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