John_Taverner wrote on Feb 20^th, 2016 at 2:52pm:









ISLAMIC LAW....
"Ibn 'Umar related that the Messenger of Allah, upon whom be peace, said, "I have been ordered to kill the people until they testify that there is no god except Allah, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and they establish prayer and pay the zakah. If they do that, their blood and wealth are protected from me save by the rights of Islam. Their reckoning will be with Allah." (Related by al-Bukhari and Muslim.) "
fiqhussunnah/fus1_06





John_Taverner,

Arab Christians are dhimmis.         < --------- do you UNDERSTAND, what that word signifies, within a strict Sharia jurisdiction ???

Dhimmis do,       ......whatever they are told,          ......by Arab moslems.

If Arab Christians 'insult' the moslem [or 'insult' his deity, or 'insult' his religion], the moslem 'righteously' KILL THEM, dead.

Some people would prefer death to bowing down before Allah,          but many Arab Christians clearly love life so much, that they are happy to worship, on their knees, before Allah.



But what is in a name eh ?

gandalf calls him Allah.

I call him YAHWEH.




Revelation 6:9
And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10  And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11  And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.


Revelation 20:4
And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.



.



My God is truly wondrous and just,
....but his name is not Allah.

God's people are called by his name.

2 Chronicles 7:14
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

Isaiah 43:1
But now thus saith the LORD that created thee, O Jacob, and he that formed thee, O Israel, Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine.
2  When thou passest through the waters, I will be with thee; and through the rivers, they shall not overflow thee: when thou walkest through the fire, thou shalt not be burned; neither shall the flame kindle upon thee.
3  For I am the LORD thy God, the Holy One of Israel, thy Saviour: I gave Egypt for thy ransom, Ethiopia and Seba for thee.
4  Since thou wast precious in my sight, thou hast been honourable, and I have loved thee: therefore will I give men for thee, and people for thy life.
5  Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the east, and gather thee from the west;
6  I will say to the north, Give up; and to the south, Keep not back: bring my sons from far, and my daughters from the ends of the earth;
7  Even every one that is called by my name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.



.



Allah, and the God of Israel, are NOT the same god or, 'person'.

Google;
a different god allah

Google;
allah another god




One of the many names of Allah, is The Great Deceiver....

Google;

John_Taverner,

'Real names' are important.

Human conversation and communication would be an unintelligible mess, indeed it would be impossible to meaningfully communicate with each other,         ....unless we all agreed upon the definitions of the 'real names', which we use in our human languages.         [....Q. and what does this say, about those, who intentionally misrepresent, what they pretend to plainly declare ?     A. that they are the intentional authors of human confusion.]


John_Taverner,

Your argument, seems to be, that it is in any case, unimportant [to Arab Christians], if Arab Christians in the middle East call their God, Allah,      .....or, if Arab Christians in the middle East call their God, YAHWEH [i.e. Jehovah].         ....because those Arab Christians understand who it is, that they worship.

Do they ?





QUESTION;
Would a young child be confused, if the mother of the child, told her child;
"The man who lives here is called Steve, but your real daddy's name is Richard. But you should call Steve, 'daddy'."    ???

What if the mother told her child; "Steve is your daddy."    [....and didn't even mention the name or existence, of the real father!] ?

Wouldn't the child be in a situation of ignorance [which had been imposed upon it] ?

And, what influence could 'Steve' have upon the development of child, if the child believed that Steve was his/her real father ?

Are these considerations unimportant ?



.




Quote:
Google


The word 'God', is a title,    ....but this isn't God's 'name'.

But is the actual name of God so important ?

Why would it be important,      .....if the God of Islam, Allah, is indeed the God of Abraham, are the same entity ?



Well, moslems say that their God's name, is Allah.

And moslems insist that actual name of God is important,       .....and moslems insist that everyone must worship the God, who is called Allah.


AND, with all of the atrocities that we see committed in the name of ISLAM, and in the name of the God of ISLAM,          ....we have the serious 'religious' evidence, which demonstrates that moslems regard the name by which God is called,       .....as absolutely critical, as to whether, in effect, a person has a right to live [remain alive].

And this doctrine [of the absolute importance of their diety's name] is established, within ISLAMIC religious texts.

---------- >

ISLAMIC LAW....
"Ibn 'Umar related that the Messenger of Allah, upon whom be peace, said, "I have been ordered to kill the people until they testify that there is no god except Allah, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and they establish prayer and pay the zakah. If they do that, their blood and wealth are protected from me save by the rights of Islam. Their reckoning will be with Allah." (Related by al-Bukhari and Muslim.) "
fiqhussunnah/fus1_06


"There is for you an excellent example (to follow) in Abraham and those with him, when they said to their people: "We are clear of you and of whatever ye worship besides Allah: we have rejected you, and there has arisen, between us and you, enmity and hatred for ever,- unless ye believe in Allah and Him alone"....."
Koran 60:4

I think you're getting entangled for no good reason.  Somewhere in that post, you mention the fact that God is a title.  You're right. It means deity. The word Lord is a similar descriptive title.

However, in prayers, and in the Bible, generally you don't say Jehovah or YVHV or Yahweh.

You would usually say Father or Lord.  You might even use the term  Lord God.  The Indonesians use similar terms in their bible.

Father = Bapa
Lord= Tuhan
God= Allah
Lord God = Tuhan Allah

These terms are translated, but not always consistently. In the English translations, very often YHVH is translated as "Lord"
Another Hebrew term "El Shaddai" is usually translated as "Lord God Almighty". The El in that is cognate with Illa (Al- Illa).

Exodus 6.3  Different translations:

God continued speaking to Moses, reassuring him, “I am God. I appeared to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob as The Strong God, but by my name God (I-Am-Present) I was not known to them.

KJV:

Quote:


Good News Bible:
Quote:


In the original Hebrew version, the tetragrammaton YVHV appears. This is vocalised  as "Yeho" in the modern pronunciation of Hebrew, but was probably something like Yehua in archaic Hebrew.   

"Jehovah" first appeared in William Tyndale's first English translation of the bible. This came from the Latin  Iehouah in one translation.

The name Jehovah does not appear in other languages.

German:

Quote:


The Vulgate Bible (From Latin)

Quote:


The Indonesian Bible:

Quote:


I recommend this link. You will find it very interesting:

http://www.yhwh.com/jehovah.htm

It details the history of the name Jehovah.

As an aside:
Quote:

 
In modern Hebrew (and this might amuse you), Allah Akhbar sounds like "Allah is a mouse" Akhbar is Hebrew for mouse.

On the topic subject - Elohim is used in a singular sense by Jews today, but in the original archaic Hebrew, it was a plural.

John_Taverner wrote on Feb 24^th, 2016 at 6:45pm:




I am aware of it.

But i have not read any of it, formally.

[so much to do,    ...so little time]

John_Taverner wrote on Feb 25^th, 2016 at 7:47am:




That is correct, when i pray myself, i simple address my prayer to 'God' [a title] or 'Father'.


Yes, it is widely accepted, that the ancient Israelites in their Hebrew script, recorded the name of their God using 4 letters, YHWH.

And, Hebrew script [in reading it] gives no guidance on how that name is to be properly pronounced.

So nobody knows for sure, what the correct pronunciation is, for the name of the God of Israel.


Thank you for the link;            http://www.yhwh.com/jehovah.htm

Exodus 20:3 lo yih'yeh-l'khä élohiym áchëriym al-Pänäya (Thou shalt have no other gods before me. )

That is one of several examples where Elohim (same word)  is used as a plural.

Elohim has been interpreted to mean "God of Gods" in the earlier Monolatrous sense, but this is derived from the Canaanite Elohim, meaning the sons of El.   

Elohai Avraham (God of Abraham). Here we see the singular form of Elohim, which is used where the Bible is referring to a personal God.

The history of the Abrahamic religion is something that still interests me a great deal.  The three branches have a lot more in common than adherents might think.

It's sad that Shias fight Sunnis, that  Protestants have animosity towards Catholics (although that is improving) and even that there is conflict within Judaism.

It's a property of Abrahamic religions that everybody has to be totally right.  I am encouraged by those rare events where society  rejects sectarianism. I remember seeing the first ever Orange Parade in Aberdeen in NE Scotland about 15 years ago.  When the parade proceeded down the main shopping street, the shoppers (almost every single one of them) turned their backs on the parade. I considered myself privileged to be there at the time and witness that event. It was the highlight of my holiday.  

In that part of Scotland there has never been a tradition of Catholic versus Protestant, and the citizens were expressing their disgust at the attempt to introduce such a culture.

Yadda wrote on Feb 28^th, 2016 at 8:22pm:


Well that's true. I don't believe in a personal God, but I guess I appreciate a life lived to the full but in moderation.

Nobody can define God for us as individuals.

Did you like my account of the anti-sectarian passive  demonstration in Scotland?  It shines in my memory like a jewel.

I may not share your belief, but I am a great believer in preserving Christianity. It's a dying culture in this country unfortunately, unless you count Hillsong Inc.