Australian Politics Forum - Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King

John Smith

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #30 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:36am

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:28am:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:58am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 9:31pm:

If you don't want to use a toll road, just leave home a bit earlier and use an ordinary road.

Give me the choice between a tollway and a freeway then..... duuuuh.. that's a hard one.... ummm.. lemme think a minute... errrr.....

For every tollway there is an alternative route without tolls.

yeah right ... how often do they make those almost impossible to access. On one particular road up here, no exits for about 20 km, then once you are passed the poll station, an exit every couple of hundred meters or so.

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Wolseley

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #31 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:36am

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:33am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:28am:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:58am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 9:31pm:

If you don't want to use a toll road, just leave home a bit earlier and use an ordinary road.

Give me the choice between a tollway and a freeway then..... duuuuh.. that's a hard one.... ummm.. lemme think a minute... errrr.....

For every tollway there is an alternative route without tolls.

Often modified by having lanes removed to funnel traffic onto the toll road.

Because some of the traffic will be using the toll road. The cars on the toll road have to join it somewhere.

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Bam

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #32 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:42am

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:36am:

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:33am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:28am:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:58am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 9:31pm:

If you don't want to use a toll road, just leave home a bit earlier and use an ordinary road.

Give me the choice between a tollway and a freeway then..... duuuuh.. that's a hard one.... ummm.. lemme think a minute... errrr.....

For every tollway there is an alternative route without tolls.

Often modified by having lanes removed to funnel traffic onto the toll road.

Because some of the traffic will be using the toll road. The cars on the toll road have to join it somewhere.

But why spend money to modify the road unnecessarily when it is cheaper not to modify the road? One reason only - to increase toll revenue.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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Wolseley

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #33 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:48am

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:42am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:36am:

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:33am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:28am:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:58am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 9:31pm:

If you don't want to use a toll road, just leave home a bit earlier and use an ordinary road.

Give me the choice between a tollway and a freeway then..... duuuuh.. that's a hard one.... ummm.. lemme think a minute... errrr.....

For every tollway there is an alternative route without tolls.

Often modified by having lanes removed to funnel traffic onto the toll road.

Because some of the traffic will be using the toll road. The cars on the toll road have to join it somewhere.

But why spend money to modify the road unnecessarily when it is cheaper not to modify the road? One reason only - to increase toll revenue.

Increase revenue by making it easier to allow access to the toll road though, not by forcing people to use it. There wouldn't be any sense in building a toll road if you don't also put in a lane or two for drivers to get onto it.

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John Smith

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #34 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:06am

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:48am:

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:42am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:36am:

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:33am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:28am:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:58am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 9:31pm:

If you don't want to use a toll road, just leave home a bit earlier and use an ordinary road.

Give me the choice between a tollway and a freeway then..... duuuuh.. that's a hard one.... ummm.. lemme think a minute... errrr.....

For every tollway there is an alternative route without tolls.

Often modified by having lanes removed to funnel traffic onto the toll road.

Because some of the traffic will be using the toll road. The cars on the toll road have to join it somewhere.

But why spend money to modify the road unnecessarily when it is cheaper not to modify the road? One reason only - to increase toll revenue.

Increase revenue by making it easier to allow access to the toll road though, not by forcing people to use it. There wouldn't be any sense in building a toll road if you don't also put in a lane or two for drivers to get onto it.

easy to put access .... add a right lane onto the tollroad and leave all existing lanes as they are. Instead, they change all the existing lanes to force you to go right and onto the tollway, and add a left lane so as to avoid the toll ... usually the left lane has a short run up so it's easy to miss, with poor signage or in an area where traffic banks up so that if you get caught in the right lane and want to go left, you can't.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Bam

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #35 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:14am

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:48am:

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:42am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:36am:

Bam wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:33am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 10:28am:

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:58am:

Wolseley wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 9:31pm:

If you don't want to use a toll road, just leave home a bit earlier and use an ordinary road.

Give me the choice between a tollway and a freeway then..... duuuuh.. that's a hard one.... ummm.. lemme think a minute... errrr.....

For every tollway there is an alternative route without tolls.

Often modified by having lanes removed to funnel traffic onto the toll road.

Because some of the traffic will be using the toll road. The cars on the toll road have to join it somewhere.

But why spend money to modify the road unnecessarily when it is cheaper not to modify the road? One reason only - to increase toll revenue.

Increase revenue by making it easier to allow access to the toll road though, not by forcing people to use it. There wouldn't be any sense in building a toll road if you don't also put in a lane or two for drivers to get onto it.

They're not always adding a lane or two to access the toll road, which is reasonable. Sometimes, they're taking away lanes from alternative routes to make these routes less viable. This happened with Citylink in Melbourne.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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Wolseley Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 1453 Sydney Gender:	Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King Reply #36 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:33am Maybe I'm doing something wrong then, as I've never had any problems avoiding toll roads when I don't want to use them.
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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #37 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:35am

Ever notice how, once tollways were introduced in Sydney - many local councils staked out their territory by putting Stop signs and One Ways in - meaning that negotiating through those areas became a nightmare or even No go zones for traffic ..... even back in the 1990's it was often faster to run down Parramatta Road then the M.4 at peak hour.... every fool thought the Motorway was faster...... but I'd say increasing traffic has put paid to that.... I quake in horror at the news footage of peak hour in Syd-e-ney....

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Wolseley

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #38 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:49am

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:35am:

Ever notice how, once tollways were introduced in Sydney - many local councils staked out their territory by putting Stop signs and One Ways in - meaning that negotiating through those areas became a nightmare or even No go zones for traffic .....

That was being done before the widespread introduction of toll roads though, mainly to prevent residential back streets being used as "rat runs".

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 14^th, 2016 at 11:35am:

back in the 1990's it was often faster to run down Parramatta Road then the M.4 at peak hour.... every fool thought the Motorway was faster...... but I'd say increasing traffic has put paid to that.... I quake in horror at the news footage of peak hour in Syd-e-ney....

And going through Rawson Rd Granville, Wellington Rd and Vaughan St Auburn, through Lidcombe and past Rookwood was even quicker. The problem with the M4 in peak hour is not so much travelling along it, but getting off it. These days, if I am planning to travel on the M4 I stay in the middle lane on James Ruse Drive and look to see if the M4 looks like a car park or not. If it doesn't, I join the M4, if it does, I keep on going to Parramatta Road.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #39 - Feb 14^th, 2016 at 12:03pm

I always took exception to that term 'rat runs' - roads are for cars - love it or leave it, or live off a main road... don't buy there and then whine like the fools at St Peters did over aircraft noise.

Car owners pay for roads - councils receive funds from that = entitlement to use roads by car owners.

Oh - and BTW - new residence is bound by low flying aircraft noise from Williamtown - F-18s with unbaffled exhausts... hoo-yah... love it or leave it...

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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Wolseley

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #40 - Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:36pm

Labor voter wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 7:27am:

What gets me is why does the government give money to private companies to built things then the public has to pay to used those things. We already ready pay for it with our taxes.

The toll road company is spending more than twice what the government is. They would not spend that sort of money unless they will get a greater amount in returns. If the government footed the entire bill and didn't charge a toll, your taxes would have to increase to cover the cost, whether you used the road or not.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #41 - Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:42pm

Wolseley wrote on Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:36pm:

Labor voter wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 7:27am:

What gets me is why does the government give money to private companies to built things then the public has to pay to used those things. We already ready pay for it with our taxes.

The toll road company is spending more than twice what the government is. They would not spend that sort of money unless they will get a greater amount in returns. If the government footed the entire bill and didn't charge a toll, your taxes would have to increase to cover the cost, whether you used the road or not.

Only to meet the costs... the government, if it was reaping the same rewards from tolls, would not need to charge as much, for the simple reason that it does not need to pay it's 'shareholders' or its 'ceo' and 'board members in the most handsome way possible.

Government shareholders are road users.... and reap the benefit from lower costs of using OUR roads... they already get their dividend...... no need to push it out and pay your mates handsomely.

**somebody stop me**

...... bring on the 'mums and pops' investors argument ....... LMAO.....

You ever wonder why you can't access the list of 'Statewide Roads' board members etc? Ever wonder why you can't see a list of shareholders?

BECAUSE THEY ARE ALL POLITICIANS AND MATES AND FAMILIES OF POLITICIANS......... THEY ARE NOT MUMS AND POPS.

Down at Ye Olde Third World Central American Republic... Austrazil....

"Il Presidente.. the family of Don Hokkesti eesh to make an investment! Por Favour... is there a franchise that will suit?"

"Si.. is... ze Coca Cola franchise is all taken by Don Turnbuli... but I theenk there is a chance for ze highways republica.. many vacancies on ze board and on ze head honcho position..... is there.... some little 'preference' you may weesh to show me?"

Si.. SI, Don Caglione.....Il Presidente! Ees thees small paper bag.. a gesture only of honour.. sufficient?"

"I theenk it will suffice, Muchacho... now we talk beesiness!! Always is La Republica da Austrazil open for ze business! All doors are open!"

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« Last Edit: Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:56pm by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Its time

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #42 - Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:43pm

Wolseley wrote on Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:36pm:

Labor voter wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 7:27am:

What gets me is why does the government give money to private companies to built things then the public has to pay to used those things. We already ready pay for it with our taxes.

The toll road company is spending more than twice what the government is. They would not spend that sort of money unless they will get a greater amount in returns. If the government footed the entire bill and didn't charge a toll, your taxes would have to increase to cover the cost, whether you used the road or not.

What am i missing ? We have no tolls in WA and i am led to believe tolls havent eased congestion at all via the posts on here .

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Bam

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #43 - Feb 24^th, 2016 at 9:39pm

Wolseley wrote on Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:36pm:

Labor voter wrote on Feb 13^th, 2016 at 7:27am:

What gets me is why does the government give money to private companies to built things then the public has to pay to used those things. We already ready pay for it with our taxes.

The toll road company is spending more than twice what the government is. They would not spend that sort of money unless they will get a greater amount in returns. If the government footed the entire bill and didn't charge a toll, your taxes would have to increase to cover the cost, whether you used the road or not.

Do the taxes increase by a minimum 4% a year for 30 years with no possibility of repeal? That's what some toll road contracts allow.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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Wolseley

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Re: Motorist Cash Cows For The Toll Road King
Reply #44 - Feb 25^th, 2016 at 11:38pm

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:42pm:

the government, if it was reaping the same rewards from tolls, would not need to charge as much

But it would have to find three or four times the amount of money it has to now if it were to fund the process by itself.

Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Feb 24^th, 2016 at 8:42pm:

You ever wonder why you can't access the list of 'Statewide Roads' board members etc? Ever wonder why you can't see a list of shareholders?

BECAUSE THEY ARE ALL POLITICIANS AND MATES AND FAMILIES OF POLITICIANS......... THEY ARE NOT MUMS AND POPS.

You could, if you want, obtain information on the directors and on the top 20 shareholders, from ASIC.

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