Forum

 
  Back to OzPolitic.com   Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register
  Forum Home Album HelpSearch Recent Rules LoginRegister  
 

Pages: 1 2 3 4
Send Topic Print
The disintegration of the EU (Read 9991 times)
bogarde73
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Anti-Global & Contra Mundum

Posts: 18443
Gender: male
The disintegration of the EU
Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:32am
 
The EU sowed the seeds of its own destruction when, drunk on their own wild aspirations, they expanded the EU to encompass most of Eastern Europe.
The inevitable consequence will be the Balkanisation of Europe over time, maybe to a geography more like the Holy Roman Empire than even the Europe of 1900.

The catalyst for the beginning of disintegration is of course the invasion by millions of mostly young muslim men which is set to continue for maybe three years or more.
We already see more and more countries resisting the calls from Brussels to pull together and accept these people as refugees. Borders will be strengthened, fences will be put up, people will be pushed this way and that and national tempers will rise even more than we already see.

But more than that, what I see happening is that many of the new member states will come to see they can defy Brussels and get away with it. After all, what can the bureaucrats do? Threaten to cut off funding for this or that?
Such threats from the Commission, when they are seen to be hollow, will hasten their own demise.

This will be a gradual process. Non-cooperation will run to taking what can be got but giving nothing in return. Sooner or later though states will exit the union, a process that will continue till the EU perhaps shrinks back to its core membership.
However it will not be able to act like its core membership because the central core will still need the markets of the former members. Bilateral trade deals will replace free trade until even the core is only a union in name.

The day will come when tourists will be shown through ghost buildings and the guide will say, this is where the European Parliament used to meet, these were the offices of the EU Commission.
Back to top
 

Know the enemies of a civil society by their public behaviour, by their fraudulent claim to be liberal-progressive, by their propensity to lie and, above all, by their attachment to authoritarianism.
 
IP Logged
 
bogarde73
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Anti-Global & Contra Mundum

Posts: 18443
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #1 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:33am
 
Breitbart:
A second wave of migrants is set to break across Europe as the wives and children of men who have already made the journey set out to join them. According to European Union law, migrants already settled in member states are entitled to bring their families to live with them in their adopted country as part of their right to a family life.

As January draws to a close, the demographics of those arriving by boat in Greece has already shifted, revealing the changing face of the migration crisis. 2015 was characterised by predominantly male migration – 73 percent of those landing on Greek shores last summer were men.

But that figure has already dropped to 45 percent, while the number of women has doubled. Greece has also seen a huge rise in the number of under 18s arriving; they now make up a third of migrants landing on the Greek Islands, according to figures from the UN’s Refugee Agency.


Migrants from Syria the most demographically mixed; men make up just 47 percent of new Syrian arrivals in Greece. The figure suggests that huge numbers of Syrian men who travelled predominantly to Germany in 2015 – thanks to Chancellor Angela Merkel’s offer of automatic asylum for anyone with a Syrian passport – are now settled and bringing their families to join them.

However, it has also been suggested that children in particular are increasingly making the trip as European countries are more inclined to grant them asylum, allowing their families to later join them.

In the UK, any migrant under the age of 18 automatically becomes the responsibility of the local authority which first registers their arrival. That local authority is expected to pay for their housing and schooling until they reach the age of 18. Last year Kent County Council warned of a massive hole being created in its budget thanks to the number of unaccompanied children who were being ferried across the Channel at Dover and abandoned by the side of the road.

The number of these so-called ‘grappling hook kids’ has exploded in the last year or so – Sweden recorded the arrivals of nearly twice as many unaccompanied children in 2015 as it did in 2014, which itself saw an 80 percent rise on the previous year’s figures.

A more detailed breakdown of the numbers arriving into Italy over the last year shows the scale of the issue: unaccompanied children outnumbered accompanied children by a factor of ten to one in December of 2015, and were the second largest demographic after the men.

With the number of lone women travellers also on the rise, migrant rights organisations have urged European nations to do more to protect the women as they travel. Many migrant shelters on the routes through the Balkans lack segregated accommodation for men and women, and there are numerous reports of rape and sexual assault by the male migrants.

“The health and rights of victims of wars and persecution, especially women and adolescent girls, should not be treated like an afterthought in humanitarian response,” said Babatunde Osotimehin, executive director of the UN population fund, UNFPA.

Vincent Cochetel, the director of UNHCR’s bureau for Europe added: “Many women and girls travelling on their own are entirely exposed, deprived of their family or community to protect them. Even those travelling with family are often vulnerable to abuse.”
Back to top
 

Know the enemies of a civil society by their public behaviour, by their fraudulent claim to be liberal-progressive, by their propensity to lie and, above all, by their attachment to authoritarianism.
 
IP Logged
 
bogarde73
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Anti-Global & Contra Mundum

Posts: 18443
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #2 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:36am
 
The chances of a Brexit must be increasing day by day, whether David Cameron wants it or whether it might precipitate another Scottish referendum.
I think the English have had it up to here with the Scots and they've certainly had it with uninvited migrant workers and asylum seekers.
Back to top
 

Know the enemies of a civil society by their public behaviour, by their fraudulent claim to be liberal-progressive, by their propensity to lie and, above all, by their attachment to authoritarianism.
 
IP Logged
 
cods
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 88048
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #3 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:58am
 
bogarde73 wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:36am:
The chances of a Brexit must be increasing day by day, whether David Cameron wants it or whether it might precipitate another Scottish referendum.
I think the English have had it up to here with the Scots and they've certainly had it with uninvited migrant workers and asylum seekers.



whats the answer??... we cant be this naive to believe these will all integrate and in about 5 to 10 years none will remember any of this?....

the English have always been sitting ducks for everyone to load the blame on.. whilst they sit back and do bugger all....the Scots were very quick to say No to self govt wshen they found out they would have to pay everything themselves...

takes on a whole differetn look doesnt it..

maybe its time these so called refugees paid to enter another country.....they seem to have funds for people smugglers....lets put a charge on entry...and no welfare of any kind for 10 years....

we may actually see the real refugee in that case...
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
bogarde73
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Anti-Global & Contra Mundum

Posts: 18443
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #4 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:59am
 
SMH, Davos:
Europe's leaders have issued a passionate plea for Britain to remain in the European Union, fearing that "Brexit" could set off a disastrous chain of events at a time of existential crisis for the European Union.

Manuel Valls, the French prime minister, said the whole of European civilisation was under grave threat and the region must stick together in self-defence. He said the departure of the UK "would be a tragedy".

Mr Valls warned that the European system was alarmingly fragile. "Europe could lose its historical footing and the project could die quickly. Things could fall apart within months," he told the World Economic Forum in Davos.

"We are involved in a world war against terrorism. We're going to have to live with this threat for years," he said, insisting that Europe must go on the offensive to defeat Isil and jihadi forces in Libya, the African Sahel, and Syria.


Wolfgang Schaeuble, the German finance minister, implored the British people to vote yes to Europe in this year's referendum. "It would be a disaster otherwise," he said.

Political leaders in Berlin are deeply concerned that British withdrawal could change the balance of power and the internal chemistry of the EU, leaving Germany with an unwelcome hegemony that would strain the Franco-German partnership to breaking point.

Mr Schaeuble has warned in the past that if the EU is unable to stop one of its more prosperous members from walking out in frustration, hard-headed investors in Asia, the US, and around the world, will take it as evidence that the EU was in terminal decline.




Back to top
 

Know the enemies of a civil society by their public behaviour, by their fraudulent claim to be liberal-progressive, by their propensity to lie and, above all, by their attachment to authoritarianism.
 
IP Logged
 
cods
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 88048
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #5 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 10:06am
 
bogarde73 wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:59am:
SMH, Davos:
Europe's leaders have issued a passionate plea for Britain to remain in the European Union, fearing that "Brexit" could set off a disastrous chain of events at a time of existential crisis for the European Union.

Manuel Valls, the French prime minister, said the whole of European civilisation was under grave threat and the region must stick together in self-defence. He said the departure of the UK "would be a tragedy".

Mr Valls warned that the European system was alarmingly fragile. "Europe could lose its historical footing and the project could die quickly. Things could fall apart within months," he told the World Economic Forum in Davos.

"We are involved in a world war against terrorism. We're going to have to live with this threat for years," he said, insisting that Europe must go on the offensive to defeat Isil and jihadi forces in Libya, the African Sahel, and Syria.


Wolfgang Schaeuble, the German finance minister, implored the British people to vote yes to Europe in this year's referendum. "It would be a disaster otherwise," he said.

Political leaders in Berlin are deeply concerned that British withdrawal could change the balance of power and the internal chemistry of the EU, leaving Germany with an unwelcome hegemony that would strain the Franco-German partnership to breaking point.

Mr Schaeuble has warned in the past that if the EU is unable to stop one of its more prosperous members from walking out in frustration, hard-headed investors in Asia, the US, and around the world, will take it as evidence that the EU was in terminal decline.







the French it makes me laugh they hate Britain..
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Melanias purse
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 101221
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #6 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 6:13pm
 
Europe is a trading bloc. It won’t decline because of a few refugees.

Quite the opposite - Europe has an aging population. Many of those young, fit refugees are being snapped up by German factories. Germany and France need the labour. Why else would Merkel open up her arms?

Give me your tired, hungry masses, yearning to breathe free. New York is the centre of the world thanks to immigration. Immigration is a huge economic advantage, not a  drain on resources. Why do you think everybody does it?

Empires will continue to rise and fall, but not because of labour migration and easy transportation.
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jan 22nd, 2016 at 6:27pm by Melanias purse »  
 
IP Logged
 
John_Taverner
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 2217
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #7 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 6:48pm
 
cods wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:58am:
the Scots were very quick to say No to self govt wshen they found out they would have to pay everything themselves...


A very simplistic stereotype.

The vote actually came very close, but the areas of highest unemployment were the strongholds of the yes vote. The so-called bludgers almost unanimously wanted an independent Scotland.  The Shetlanders do not readily see themselves as part of Scotland, and had Shetland been excluded, the "Yes" vote would have prevailed (with disastrous results)

The "No" vote was overwhelming in the educated demographic who realised that breaking up the 5th biggest economy in the world would send shudders through World markets that would make the Greek debt reactions look like minor corrections. 

So give some credence to the fact that (on the whole) the Scots are pretty savvy when it comes to economics.  They pioneered it, if you remember Adam Smith, John Law, David Hume and others.  Financial acumen runs in the DNA, as does education. In the 1830s, literacy in Scotland was almost universal while only a small proportion of the population was literate South of the border. 

You just have do a quick Google search to realise that London has almost double the population but  four times the unemployment of Scotland.
Back to top
 
72+Adelaide+Street  
IP Logged
 
Postmodern Trendoid III
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 10300
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #8 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 7:27pm
 
Melanias purse wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 6:13pm:
Europe is a trading bloc. It won’t decline because of a few refugees.

Quite the opposite - Europe has an aging population. Many of those young, fit refugees are being snapped up by German factories. Germany and France need the labour. Why else would Merkel open up her arms?

Give me your tired, hungry masses, yearning to breathe free. New York is the centre of the world thanks to immigration. Immigration is a huge economic advantage, not a  drain on resources. Why do you think everybody does it?

Empires will continue to rise and fall, but not because of labour migration and easy transportation.


It's more than a trading block (that's your Marxist training again, reducing everything to economics). It's collection of nation states, each with their own unique identity and culture(s). Only the money hungry oligarchs, and idiotic old fashioned Marxists, view the state as solely an economic entity. The people don't.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Melanias purse
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 101221
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #9 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 8:59pm
 
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 7:27pm:
Melanias purse wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 6:13pm:
Europe is a trading bloc. It won’t decline because of a few refugees.

Quite the opposite - Europe has an aging population. Many of those young, fit refugees are being snapped up by German factories. Germany and France need the labour. Why else would Merkel open up her arms?

Give me your tired, hungry masses, yearning to breathe free. New York is the centre of the world thanks to immigration. Immigration is a huge economic advantage, not a  drain on resources. Why do you think everybody does it?

Empires will continue to rise and fall, but not because of labour migration and easy transportation.


It's more than a trading block (that's your Marxist training again, reducing everything to economics). It's collection of nation states, each with their own unique identity and culture(s). Only the money hungry oligarchs, and idiotic old fashioned Marxists, view the state as solely an economic entity. The people don't.


Europe is also.a dream, a project. The two world wars had economic causes - Finance, inflation, competition for resources and labour, etc. Europe is really Europe today because of a shared currency.

Yes, Europe comes down to the Euro. It’s hard to believe that human evolution could come down to a currency, but it has. From silver to gold to US dollars to the Euro.

We could include things like tulips, but this would confuse things. Europe is now united by a currency. Most else - the borders, the treaties, the Hague, the Eurovision Song Contest - follows this.

Europe is a dream with a very finite beginning and end. It starts with a common market and a currency. It ends with a huge market for goods and financial stability. This is the very purpose of the EU.

If markets and currencies can bring war, it stands to reason they can bring peace too. Why else would nationalist leaders like Charles de Gaul fight for the Euro?

"Progressives".
Back to top
« Last Edit: Jan 22nd, 2016 at 9:12pm by Melanias purse »  
 
IP Logged
 
Postmodern Trendoid III
Gold Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 10300
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #10 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 10:10pm
 
Don't be a dumbarse. The French don't view themselves as Germans nor do the Italians view themselves as Austrians because of a shared currency.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Melanias purse
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 101221
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #11 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 11:10pm
 
Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 10:10pm:
Don't be a dumbarse. The French don't view themselves as Germans nor do the Italians view themselves as Austrians because of a shared currency.


Do you view yourself as a Turk? An economic migrant? A cosmopolitan? What?

I’m curious.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
ian
Gold Member
*****
Offline


OzPolitic

Posts: 9451
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #12 - Jan 22nd, 2016 at 11:43pm
 
Melanias purse wrote on Jan 22nd, 2016 at 6:13pm:
. Why else would Merkel open up her arms?

Give me your tired, hungry masses, yearning to breathe free. New York is the centre of the world thanks to immigration. Immigration is a huge economic advantage, not a  drain on resources. Why do you think everybody does it?
Sure, but they didnt have comprehensive social security support based on the number of children you breed. Muslims arent going to Europe for a new life based on hard work and entrepreneurship, they are going because they pay them to breed.

Quote:
Empires will continue to rise and fall, but not because of labour migration and easy transportation.
Muslims and labor ? Lol. you really arent up with this at all are you? Muslims are migrating to western countries so they dont have to work.
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
Melanias purse
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Australian Politics

Posts: 101221
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #13 - Jan 23rd, 2016 at 9:30am
 
So how do you account for all the Muslims in my workplace, Ian? Statistical aberations? A tiny minority? Dare I say it, nothing to do with Islam?
Back to top
 
 
IP Logged
 
bogarde73
Gold Member
*****
Offline


Anti-Global & Contra Mundum

Posts: 18443
Gender: male
Re: The disintegration of the EU
Reply #14 - Jan 23rd, 2016 at 11:15am
 
Europe isn't multicultural Australia Karnal.

We're not talking here about muslims per se, we're talking about an invasion crisis coming on top of other issues embattling Europe:
- the North/South divide
- Greece
- debt
- massive unemployment
- Eastern European member states with little in common with the core community.

And a pending potential crunch for many states would be what happens about a Turkey application. The EU bureaucrats and probably Germany would push for it but most would be opposed.

Look for signs of strain appearing more often in the grand project - a socialist dream - and watch for growing refusals to accept EU directives.
Back to top
 

Know the enemies of a civil society by their public behaviour, by their fraudulent claim to be liberal-progressive, by their propensity to lie and, above all, by their attachment to authoritarianism.
 
IP Logged
 
Pages: 1 2 3 4
Send Topic Print