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Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human (Read 2101 times)
mothra
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #15 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:08am
 
PTSD and psychotic Symptoms can co-occur. In clinical terms, PTSD is described as consisting of three clusters of symptoms: re-experiencing symptoms, avoidance symptoms, and hyperarousal symptoms. However, some mental health professionals believe that the experience of psychotic symptoms should be considered as an addition to that list, given that they commonly occur among people with PTSD.

Psychotic Symptoms

Before the relationship between PTSD and psychotic symptoms is discussed, it is first important to describe what would be considered a psychotic symptom.

Psychotic symptoms can be divided into two groups: positive symptoms and negative symptoms.

Positive symptoms are characterized by the presence of unusual feelings, thoughts, or behaviors. Positive symptoms include such experiences as hallucinations or delusions. A hallucination could be hearing voices that no one else can hear, or seeing things that are not really there.

Delusions are ideas that a person believes are true despite the fact that they may be unlikely or odd. For example, people with delusions may believe that the CIA is spying on them, or that aliens are controlling their behaviors or thoughts.

Negative symptoms are characterized by the absence of experience. For example, a person with negative symptoms may not be emotionally expressive. She may have difficulty speaking, may not say anything for days on end, or be unable to persist at simple tasks or activities, such as getting dressed in the morning.

These positive and negative symptoms are often associated with the diagnosis of schizophrenia; however, they are also seen in other disorders, such as PTSD.

Psychotic Symptoms in PTSD

Researchers at the University of Manitoba, Columbia University, and the University of Regina examined the data on 5,877 people from across the United States in order to determine the rates with which people with PTSD experience different psychotic symptoms.

They found that, among people with PTSD, the experience of positive psychotic symptoms was most common.

Approximately 52% of people who reported having PTSD at some point in their lifetime also reported experiencing a positive psychotic symptom.

The most common positive symptoms were:

Believing that other people were spying on or following them (27.5%)

Seeing something that others could not see (19.8%)

Having unusual feelings inside or outside of their bodies, such as feeling as though they were being touched when no one was really there (16.8%)

Believing that they could hear what someone else was thinking (12.4%)

Being bothered by strange smells that no one else could smell (10.3%)

Believing that their behaviors and thoughts were bring controlled by some power or force (10%)
The researchers also found evidence that the more PTSD symptoms a person was experiencing, the greater the likelihood that they would also experience positive psychotic symptoms.

To take their study a step further, the researchers also looked at what traumatic events were most commonly related to the experience of psychotic symptoms. They found the following to be most strongly connected:

Being involved in a fire, flood, or natural disaster

Seeing someone get seriously injured or killed

Experiencing tremendous shock as a result of a traumatic event that happened to a close relative, friend, or significant other

http://ptsd.about.com/od/relatedconditions/a/Psychosis.htm

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #16 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:08am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:56pm:
Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:26pm:
Sadly, this seems to have overflowed with some..... but there have always been such in the military.  I believe I've cited for you before the case of a US 1st Cavalry captain in Vietnam convicted over the deaths of civilians when he was not actually present, on the basis that as the commander he held responsibility (Yamashita Decision), and his (commissioned) subordinate, who was directly responsible, being deemed to be 'mentally insufficient' (dumb) and being discharged from service rather than charged.


PTSD - an absolutely inevitable consequence of sending young men and women off to experience the horrors of war. Not all soldiers become psychotic like this - most just suffer silently and drive their loved ones away. But all will be permanently damaged to varying degrees. I started a thread a while back arguing that since we are willing send these young men and women to certain and permanent psychological trauma, we should be willing to pay a fair price for that in terms of gold star treatment and support for returned servicemen.



PTSD is not psychosis - it is described as the reaction of a normal human being to abnormal circumstances, and I've shared PTSD 'wards' with cops and rape victims, as well as Diggers.

I'm totally sane and absolutely certified so - the most normal person subjected to extremes (I don't see them as extreme, which is why I 'failed' every PTSD 'exam' and made no progress, yet am a gentle and caring human being) - but let me tell you that at times..... things get rough.

There are many myths surrounding PTSD, including that those who suffer it are crazy - they are not.
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ian
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #17 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:09am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:03am:
ian wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:59pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:56pm:
Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:26pm:
Sadly, this seems to have overflowed with some..... but there have always been such in the military.  I believe I've cited for you before the case of a US 1st Cavalry captain in Vietnam convicted over the deaths of civilians when he was not actually present, on the basis that as the commander he held responsibility (Yamashita Decision), and his (commissioned) subordinate, who was directly responsible, being deemed to be 'mentally insufficient' (dumb) and being discharged from service rather than charged.


PTSD - an absolutely inevitable consequence of sending young men and women off to experience the horrors of war. Not all soldiers become psychotic like this - most just suffer silently and drive their loved ones away. But all will be permanently damaged to varying degrees. I started a thread a while back arguing that since we are willing send these young men and women to certain and permanent psychological trauma, we should be willing to pay a fair price for that in terms of gold star treatment and support for returned servicemen.
Steven Green the person in the OP has been diagnosed with a personality disorder, this wasnt caused by his training or exposure to battle. His actions had nothing to do with PTSD. And PTSD does not cause psychosis.


No doubt - but the question is would he have raped a girl and murdered her entire family if he wasn't sent to war? Seems unlikely given his own testimony that he considered the inhabitants of the country that he was fighting in to not be human.

he has a personality disorder, this is not an illness but a condition. people with these types of ASPD's always twist the story to suit. Who knows what could have triggered a killing spree. he was probably itching to kill a few people and used the fact his mate was killed as an excuse.
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mothra
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #18 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:11am
 
Why is the military accepting people with PD anyway?

What kind of PD does he have? It's a big net.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #19 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:11am
 
I dont know about your study mothra, but its a load of horse puckey.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #20 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:13am
 
ian wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:56pm:
I couldnt accuse you of googling this Grappler. Most people would be lost if this was even mentioned. Also, its good that someone else here has the life experience to get this.


Oh - and Cole was cited amongst the Airborne as being the only recipient of the Medal they were glad to see killed in Holland. He was 'gung ho' and stupid, they say.

It's not all beer and skittles, and what you read is not always what you should hear.  The Sergeant who went in first and ended up 'last man standing' in his small group should have got the Medal.... not Cole.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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mothra
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #21 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:14am
 
ian wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:11am:
I dont know about your study mothra, but its a load of horse puckey.




No. It's not. Hallucinations and flashbacks can present as psychotic type behaviour.

Think of the not few returned service folk who have come home and beaten the crap out of or killing theor [partners and children. They refer to being out of their minds when they did it.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #22 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:17am
 
mothra wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:08am:
PTSD and psychotic Symptoms can co-occur. In clinical terms, PTSD is described as consisting of three clusters of symptoms: re-experiencing symptoms, avoidance symptoms, and hyperarousal symptoms. However, some mental health professionals believe that the experience of psychotic symptoms should be considered as an addition to that list, given that they commonly occur among people with PTSD.

Psychotic Symptoms

Before the relationship between PTSD and psychotic symptoms is discussed, it is first important to describe what would be considered a psychotic symptom.

Psychotic symptoms can be divided into two groups: positive symptoms and negative symptoms.

Positive symptoms are characterized by the presence of unusual feelings, thoughts, or behaviors. Positive symptoms include such experiences as hallucinations or delusions. A hallucination could be hearing voices that no one else can hear, or seeing things that are not really there.

Delusions are ideas that a person believes are true despite the fact that they may be unlikely or odd. For example, people with delusions may believe that the CIA is spying on them, or that aliens are controlling their behaviors or thoughts.

Negative symptoms are characterized by the absence of experience. For example, a person with negative symptoms may not be emotionally expressive. She may have difficulty speaking, may not say anything for days on end, or be unable to persist at simple tasks or activities, such as getting dressed in the morning.

These positive and negative symptoms are often associated with the diagnosis of schizophrenia; however, they are also seen in other disorders, such as PTSD.

Psychotic Symptoms in PTSD

Researchers at the University of Manitoba, Columbia University, and the University of Regina examined the data on 5,877 people from across the United States in order to determine the rates with which people with PTSD experience different psychotic symptoms.

They found that, among people with PTSD, the experience of positive psychotic symptoms was most common.

Approximately 52% of people who reported having PTSD at some point in their lifetime also reported experiencing a positive psychotic symptom.

The most common positive symptoms were:

Believing that other people were spying on or following them (27.5%)

Seeing something that others could not see (19.8%)

Having unusual feelings inside or outside of their bodies, such as feeling as though they were being touched when no one was really there (16.8%)

Believing that they could hear what someone else was thinking (12.4%)

Being bothered by strange smells that no one else could smell (10.3%)

Believing that their behaviors and thoughts were bring controlled by some power or force (10%)
The researchers also found evidence that the more PTSD symptoms a person was experiencing, the greater the likelihood that they would also experience positive psychotic symptoms.

To take their study a step further, the researchers also looked at what traumatic events were most commonly related to the experience of psychotic symptoms. They found the following to be most strongly connected:

Being involved in a fire, flood, or natural disaster

Seeing someone get seriously injured or killed

Experiencing tremendous shock as a result of a traumatic event that happened to a close relative, friend, or significant other

http://ptsd.about.com/od/relatedconditions/a/Psychosis.htm



Don't pay to much attention to academic crap... come sit with the Troopers for a while..... they'll tell you one thing... it's all bulldust for someone's profit, but if they have to play the game to get benefits, they will... and God Speed to them.

I attended a course run by a doctor who didn't believe in stress illnesses - but he was happy to accept the funding.... money speaks all languages...................
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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mothra
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #23 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:17am
 
Psychotic Symptoms in Posttraumatic Stress Disorder


Abstract
Positive psychotic symptoms may be relatively prevalent in posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD). PTSD with secondary psychotic features (PTSD-SP) is an emerging diagnostic entity. Phenomenological, epidemiological, and biological studies support the potential validity of PTSD-SP. Clinicians should inquire about positive symptoms of psychosis not only during an initial diagnostic interview but also during follow-up sessions because many patients are embarrassed about these symptoms as well as about other facets and consequences of the traumatic experience and may need some time in a trusting relationship to disclose these symptoms. More studies are needed to investigate, in particular, the longitudinal course and treatment of psychotic features. Genetic studies may shed light on differentiation of PTSD-SP as well as other PTSD comorbidities. The DBH candidate gene in particular may help shed light on this biological differentiation. Treatment of psychotic symptoms associated with PTSD may involve a combination of an antidepressant plus an antipsychotic agent, analogous to the treatment of major depression with psychotic features. The purpose of this article is to introduce the clinician to the potential for psychotic symptoms to occur as a comorbidity of chronic PTSD. This article will review a definition of psychotic symptoms in the context of PTSD and discuss the relevant literature exploring whether the presence of these symptoms might represent a unique subtype of the disorder. The development of a definition for a psychotic subtype of PTSD might facilitate research of treatment approaches. Regardless, the practicing clinician should be aware of the potential for psychotic symptoms to be part of the complex clinical picture of PTSD.



http://focus.psychiatryonline.org/doi/abs/10.1176/foc.9.3.foc278
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mothra
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #24 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:18am
 
The thing about academics Grap is that note things that are observable.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #25 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:25am
 
ian wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:09am:
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:03am:
ian wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:59pm:
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:56pm:
Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM wrote on Jan 4th, 2016 at 11:26pm:
Sadly, this seems to have overflowed with some..... but there have always been such in the military.  I believe I've cited for you before the case of a US 1st Cavalry captain in Vietnam convicted over the deaths of civilians when he was not actually present, on the basis that as the commander he held responsibility (Yamashita Decision), and his (commissioned) subordinate, who was directly responsible, being deemed to be 'mentally insufficient' (dumb) and being discharged from service rather than charged.


PTSD - an absolutely inevitable consequence of sending young men and women off to experience the horrors of war. Not all soldiers become psychotic like this - most just suffer silently and drive their loved ones away. But all will be permanently damaged to varying degrees. I started a thread a while back arguing that since we are willing send these young men and women to certain and permanent psychological trauma, we should be willing to pay a fair price for that in terms of gold star treatment and support for returned servicemen.
Steven Green the person in the OP has been diagnosed with a personality disorder, this wasnt caused by his training or exposure to battle. His actions had nothing to do with PTSD. And PTSD does not cause psychosis.


No doubt - but the question is would he have raped a girl and murdered her entire family if he wasn't sent to war? Seems unlikely given his own testimony that he considered the inhabitants of the country that he was fighting in to not be human.

he has a personality disorder, this is not an illness but a condition. people with these types of ASPD's always twist the story to suit. Who knows what could have triggered a killing spree. he was probably itching to kill a few people and used the fact his mate was killed as an excuse.


There are a lot of people with personality disorders - many times more than the number of people who rape and murder entire families. If nothing else, the law of averages tells us that this guy probably wouldn't have gone on a rape and murder spree if he wasn't sent into a warzone. Besides that though we also have his own testimony about the war causing this horrific act - for what its worth - but its still more evidence than there is to support the view that he would have engaged in rape and murder if he didn't go to Iraq.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #26 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:33am
 
polite_gandalf wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:25am:
[
There are a lot of people with personality disorders - many times more than the number of people who rape and murder entire families. If nothing else, the law of averages tells us that this guy probably wouldn't have gone on a rape and murder spree if he wasn't sent into a warzone. Besides that though we also have his own testimony about the war causing this horrific act - for what its worth - but its still more evidence than there is to support the view that he would have engaged in rape and murder if he didn't go to Iraq.
Who knows? Im not presuming one way or the other. I do know people with ASPDS lie. And they lie very well.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #27 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:34am
 
British soldiers could face prosecution for crimes committed during Iraq conflict, investigators confirm
Jonathan Owen Saturday 2 January 2016

British soldiers who have served in Iraq may face prosecution for crimes including murder, the head of the unit established by the Ministry of Defence to investigate allegations of torture and unlawful killing in the war-torn country has said.

In his first major interview, Mark Warwick, a former police detective in charge of the Iraq Historic Allegations Team (Ihat), told The Independent that he believed there would be sufficient evidence to justify criminal charges.

“There are serious allegations that we are investigating across the whole range of Ihat investigations, which incorporates homicide, where I feel there is significant evidence to be obtained to put a strong case before the Service Prosecuting Authority  to prosecute and charge,” he said.

Ihat’s caseload of allegations of ill-treatment or unlawful killing by British forces in Iraq between 2003 and 2009 has risen tenfold since it was established. In 2010, it was dealing with cases involving 152 victims. It is now dealing with more than 1,500 victims, according to Ihat’s latest quarterly update. Of these, 280 are victims of alleged unlawful killing by British forces in Iraq, but more than 200 of these cases have yet to be investigated, with just 25 under investigation.

Of 1,235 alleged cases of ill-treatment, including accusations of rape and torture, only 45 are under investigation.

Ihat’s initial target for completion of its investigations was 2016 but this will not be met. And, although the unit is funded until 2019, its work may not be finished by then.



http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-soldiers-could-face-prose...
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #28 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:34am
 
Your studies are horse puckey Mothra.
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Re: Perspective: US soldier thought Iraqis not human
Reply #29 - Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:36am
 
ian wrote on Jan 5th, 2016 at 12:34am:
Your studies are horse puckey Mothra.




No. They're not.

Hvae you ever experienced a flashback? Hallucination? Dissociation?
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