Australian Politics Forum - Should we ignore Geneva Convention

Aussie

Gold Member

Offline

OzPolitic

Posts: 39711
Gender: male

Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention
Reply #60 - Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:47pm

Lafayette wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:41pm:

Aussie wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:37pm:

It does not matter who, specifically. That is entirely irrelevant to my question, one which you ought have no problem or hesitation answering very responsively.

How about using Government force to impose on other people like the US is doing in Arabia on your behalf? What say ye?

It all depends on the reasons why my government is using force on my behalf in the first place. The role of government is to protect my rights from domestic and foreign threats. If a state or group poses a threat to my rights, then my government is obligated to act to protect those rights, using violence if necessary.

My government is, however, obligated to do its utmost to avoid causing civilian or non combatant casualties when it does so.

Oh, I see.......these rights of which you speak, especially when it comes to the tinted Muslims in Arabia, are artificially conditional! So, I can only assume you do not agree that it is intellectual sloth producing a typical result of unintended and perverse consequences that USA government force is used to impose on others (no exceptions.)

Back to top

IP Logged

Soren

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 25654
Gender: male

Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention
Reply #61 - Dec 28^th, 2015 at 6:25pm

Lafayette wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:41pm:

My government is, however, obligated to do its utmost to avoid causing civilian or non combatant casualties when it does so.

Where does that 'obligation' come from?

And why is that 'obligation' not observed by Muslim countries? Just because it wasn't observed by Mohammed?

Explain.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lafayette

Senior Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 316
Gender: male

Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention
Reply #62 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 12:53am

Aussie wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:47pm:

Oh, I see.......these rights of which you speak, especially when it comes to the tinted Muslims in Arabia, are artificially conditional! So, I can only assume you do not agree that it is intellectual sloth producing a typical result of unintended and perverse consequences that USA government force is used to impose on others (no exceptions.)

They aren't conditional at all. Currently my government is fighting ISIL because ISIL is a threat to our interests and to Americans around the world. ISIL's clearly stated goal is to impose an extreme global caliphate on the entire world. Given that ISIL has murdered many Americans and intends to subjugate the rest of us my government has an obligation to us, as citizens, to stop ISIL.

Unintended consequences cannot be an excuse not to defend your citizens. But as I stated before, you must fight in a manner which is less likely to be used as a recruiting tool for further attacks against you now certainly ISIL will try and spin it any way they can but if we are abiding by the Geneva Convention, not putting in massive amounts of ground forces and doing our utmost to avoid civilian and non combatant casualties then we most certainly have fulfilled our obligation whilst still protecting ourselves against the threat.

Back to top

IP Logged

Lafayette

Senior Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 316
Gender: male

Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention
Reply #63 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 12:54am

Soren wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 6:25pm:

Lafayette wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:41pm:

My government is, however, obligated to do its utmost to avoid causing civilian or non combatant casualties when it does so.

Where does that 'obligation' come from?

And why is that 'obligation' not observed by Muslim countries? Just because it wasn't observed by Mohammed?

Explain.

Muhammad did avoid civilian and non combatant casualties. He made it his orders to Muslim armies. But it's really irrelevant to what Muslim countries do today because they, themselves are mostly run by idiots that hate freedom so don't expect me to defend them. They aren't my countries, the US is.

Back to top

IP Logged

Aussie

Gold Member

Offline

OzPolitic

Posts: 39711
Gender: male

Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention
Reply #64 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 9:54am

Lafayette wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 12:53am:

Aussie wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:47pm:

Oh, I see.......these rights of which you speak, especially when it comes to the tinted Muslims in Arabia, are artificially conditional! So, I can only assume you do not agree that it is intellectual sloth producing a typical result of unintended and perverse consequences that USA government force is used to impose on others (no exceptions.)

They aren't conditional at all. Currently my government is fighting ISIL because ISIL is a threat to our interests and to Americans around the world. ISIL's clearly stated goal is to impose an extreme global caliphate on the entire world. Given that ISIL has murdered many Americans and intends to subjugate the rest of us my government has an obligation to us, as citizens, to stop ISIL.

Unintended consequences cannot be an excuse not to defend your citizens. But as I stated before, you must fight in a manner which is less likely to be used as a recruiting tool for further attacks against you now certainly ISIL will try and spin it any way they can but if we are abiding by the Geneva Convention, not putting in massive amounts of ground forces and doing our utmost to avoid civilian and non combatant casualties then we most certainly have fulfilled our obligation whilst still protecting ourselves against the threat.

I guess you have not watched your own propaganda youtube video ~ at about the 7.12 mark. Also note similar comments at 4.00, 5.53 and 6.31. You don't live by your own prayer book.

Back to top

IP Logged

Maqqa

Gold Member

Offline

14% - that low?!

Posts: 16000

Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention
Reply #65 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 10:31am

Lafayette wrote on Dec 29^th, 2015 at 12:54am:

Soren wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 6:25pm:

Lafayette wrote on Dec 28^th, 2015 at 5:41pm:

My government is, however, obligated to do its utmost to avoid causing civilian or non combatant casualties when it does so.

Where does that 'obligation' come from?

And why is that 'obligation' not observed by Muslim countries? Just because it wasn't observed by Mohammed?

Explain.

Muhammad did avoid civilian and non combatant casualties. He made it his orders to Muslim armies. But it's really irrelevant to what Muslim countries do today because they, themselves are mostly run by idiots that hate freedom so don't expect me to defend them. They aren't my countries, the US is.

Muhammad may have - but the guys who followed him didn't

Read about the baby pirates

He converted most of the Arabian Peninsula in 20 years - I doubt that was done by the force of his charisma

Back to top

Bill 14% is not the alcohol content of that wine. It's your poll number

IP Logged

Aussie Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 39711 Gender:	Re: Should we ignore Geneva Convention Reply #66 - Dec 29^th, 2015 at 2:32pm Dunno if Lafayette is still with us, but, just in case........ There's another of these, and at the moment, I can't locate the bugger.
Back to top	IP Logged

Poll
Question: Should we ignore Geneva convention?
Yes 2 (15.4%) No 11 (84.6%) Total votes: 13 « Created by: Maqqa on: Dec 27^th, 2015 at 2:08pm »