Australian Politics Forum - You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next

lee

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #15 - Dec 9^th, 2015 at 10:59am

Yep. Map of the ozone hole 2 October 15.

Perhaps you can tell me how with the Sun hitting the hole at an oblique angle, it could impact on sunburn on Australians, or indeed the penguins, seeing as the Sun doesn't shine through the hole.

You know- Sun's rays almost parallel after 150 million kms.

So where are these dangerous UV's hitting?

'The amount of UV radiation reaching the earth varies depending on the directness of the sun’s rays, time of day, time of year, the location’s latitude, cloud cover, and the amount of dust, haze and pollution in the air.'

http://enhs.umn.edu/current/5103/uv/character.html

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The_Barnacle

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #16 - Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:07am

lee wrote on Dec 9^th, 2015 at 10:59am:

Perhaps you can tell me how with the Sun hitting the hole at an oblique angle, it could impact on sunburn on Australians, or indeed the penguins, seeing as the Sun doesn't shine through the hole.

You know- Sun's rays almost parallel after 150 million kms.

So where are these dangerous UV's hitting?

Because when the hole gets big enough it can get as far north as Australia
http://www.theozonehole.com/2013ozonehole.htm

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20130518.jpg (72 KB | 47 )

The Right Wing only believe in free speech when they agree with what is being said.

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21590 Gender:	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #17 - Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:24am You notice that is in the 'green', 300 Dobson Units. 'The average amount of ozone in the atmosphere is roughly 300 Dobson Units' http://ozonewatch.gsfc.nasa.gov/facts/dobson_SH.html So about average. Scary huh? And the rest of Australia is 250 DU? Weird.
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The_Barnacle

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #18 - Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:47am

Ok I concede that my graphic didn't demonstrate the dangers of ozone depletion.

Quote:

The ozone layer is depleted in two ways. Firstly, the ozone layer in the mid-latitude (e.g. over Australia) is thinned, leading to more UV radiation reaching the earth. Data collected in the upper atmosphere have shown that there has been a general thinning of the ozone layer over most of the globe. This includes a five to nine per cent depletion over Australia since the 1960s, which has increased the risk that Australians already face from over-exposure to UV radiation resulting from our outdoor lifestyle. Secondly, the ozone layer over Antarctica is dramatically thinned in spring, leading to the `ozone hole

https://www.environment.gov.au/protection/ozone/ozone-science/ozone-layer

Surely Lee even you have to admit that the eradication of CFCs to prevent any additional damage to the ozone layer has been a win for science and for society in general.

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The Right Wing only believe in free speech when they agree with what is being said.

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lee

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #19 - Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:53am

The_Barnacle wrote on Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:47am:

any additional damage to the ozone layer has been a win for science

That's only if you believe that ozone had never got that low before. 60 years of data is not enough, I think.

Try as I might I can't find any historical figures for ozone over Australia.
Surely that should be the benchmark.

Edit:
It was only in May that NASA said the ozone hole was finally closing up.

And then-

'“While the current ozone hole is larger than in recent years, the area occupied by this year’s hole is consistent with our understanding of ozone depletion chemistry and consistent with colder than average weather conditions in Earth’s stratosphere, which help drive ozone depletion,” said Paul A. Newman, chief scientist for Earth Sciences at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Maryland.'

http://research.noaa.gov/News/NewsArchive/LatestNews/TabId/684/ArtMID/1768/Artic...

So natural variation plays a part.

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« Last Edit: Dec 9^th, 2015 at 12:00pm by lee »

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #20 - Dec 10^th, 2015 at 5:03pm

lee wrote on Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:53am:

The_Barnacle wrote on Dec 9^th, 2015 at 11:47am:

any additional damage to the ozone layer has been a win for science

That's only if you believe that ozone had never got that low before. 60 years of data is not enough, I think.

Try as I might I can't find any historical figures for ozone over Australia.
Surely that should be the benchmark.

Edit:
It was only in May that NASA said the ozone hole was finally closing up.

And then-

'“While the current ozone hole is larger than in recent years, the area occupied by this year’s hole is consistent with our understanding of ozone depletion chemistry and consistent with colder than average weather conditions in Earth’s stratosphere, which help drive ozone depletion,” said Paul A. Newman, chief scientist for Earth Sciences at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Maryland.'

http://research.noaa.gov/News/NewsArchive/LatestNews/TabId/684/ArtMID/1768/Artic...

So natural variation plays a part.

No respect for the calculus that gave you civlisation and new money tryhard-upper-middle-class status Cheesy

go the tryhards that voted for howard and abbott still pretending they knew what conservatism meant Shocked

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21590 Gender:	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #21 - Dec 10^th, 2015 at 5:32pm BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Dec 10^th, 2015 at 5:03pm: No respect for the calculus that gave you civlisation Newsflash - Calculus can solve natural variation.
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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #22 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:02am lee wrote on Dec 10^th, 2015 at 5:32pm: BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Dec 10^th, 2015 at 5:03pm: No respect for the calculus that gave you civlisation Newsflash - Calculus can solve natural variation. Bro, is burning fossil fuels natural variation?
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Emma Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 9853 OZ Gender:	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #23 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:12am I would say ..NO. Not on the scale undertaken by us human beings.
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abdullah Full Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 195 Gender:	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #24 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:43am Emma wrote on Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:12am: I would say ..NO. Not on the scale undertaken by us human beings. No surprises there I guess that you would say that.
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BatteriesNotIncluded Gold Member Offline MediocrityNET: because people died for this! Posts: 26966	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #25 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 4:20am abdullah wrote on Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:43am: Emma wrote on Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:12am: I would say ..NO. Not on the scale undertaken by us human beings. No surprises there I guess that you would say that. No surprises: but but but that's what terrorism is
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abdullah

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #26 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 4:23am

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Dec 12^th, 2015 at 4:20am:

abdullah wrote on Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:43am:

Emma wrote on Dec 12^th, 2015 at 2:12am:

I would say ..NO. Not on the scale undertaken by us human beings.

No surprises there I guess that you would say that.

No surprises: but but but that's what terrorism is http://indiandefence.com/styles/smilies/newspark/terrorist.gif

really

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Jovial Monk Gold Member Offline Dogs not cats! Posts: 51474 Gender:	Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next Reply #27 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 9:13am Even Margaret Thatcher, a chemist before entering politics could see the harm being done to the ozone layer.
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lee

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #28 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 5:01pm

' In bringing this about, Mrs Thatcher played an important part. It is not widely appreciated, however, that there was a dramatic twist to her story. In 2003, towards the end of her last book, Statecraft, in a passage headed "Hot Air and Global Warming", she issued what amounts to an almost complete recantation of her earlier views.

She voiced precisely the fundamental doubts about the warming scare that have since become familiar to us. Pouring scorn on the "doomsters", she questioned the main scientific assumptions used to drive the scare, from the conviction that the chief force shaping world climate is CO2, rather than natural factors such as solar activity, to exaggerated claims about rising sea levels. She mocked Al Gore and the futility of "costly and economically damaging" schemes to reduce CO2 emissions. She cited the 2.5C rise in temperatures during the Medieval Warm Period as having had almost entirely beneficial effects. She pointed out that the dangers of a world getting colder are far worse than those of a CO2-enriched world growing warmer. She recognised how distortions of the science had been used to mask an anti-capitalist, Left-wing political agenda which posed a serious threat to the progress and prosperity of mankind. '

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/christopherbooker/7823477/Was-Marg...

I guess you could read the book to refute it. Or just shoot the messenger.

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Bobby.

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Re: You have been lied to your entire life. AGW next
Reply #29 - Dec 12^th, 2015 at 5:34pm

Snow in summer:

http://www.weatherzone.com.au/news/summer-snow-delighting-tasmanians-and-visitor...

Quote:

Summer snow delighting Tasmanians and visitors

Saturday December 12, 2015 - 13:39 EDT
Audience submitted image
Snow on the way up kunanyi/Mount Wellington. - Audience submitted

As the summer solstice nears, Tasmanians have woken to the sight of a winter wonderland.

Low temperatures saw light snow falls around the state, with the Central Highlands receiving the most snow.

Hobart's Mount Wellington also received a light dusting as snow fell down to as low as 600 metres, with a strong cold front forcing a significant drop in temperatures overnight, the Bureau of Meteorology's Tim Bolden said.

"The coldest of the air really came through around two, three o'clock this morning," he said.

"That brought an increase in the shower activity, so we did see snow fall down to the 600-metre level last night.

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