Australian Politics Forum - Domestic violence

sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #240 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:33am

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:28am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:22am:

Maqqa wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 3:47pm:

mothra wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

As for women wanting equality but not wanting to be hit, you need to think about the playing field. Men are, usually, considerably bigger and stronger than women. That is not to say a woman cant deliver a good hit but the chances are if a man then hits a woman in return, he is likely to do much more damage than she did. That is why it is not ok to hit women. It's just not good to wallop someone smaller than you.

Then it should be about big person walloping a smaller person and not about men hitting women because there are some women who are larger than men

As I said - I don't agree with "you can't hit a woman under any condition"

I question "reasonable force" for retaliation

Bottom line is - if the woman did not hit the man then there is no issue about retaliation with reasonable force

DON'T HIT!!! Women or men!!

Scenario 1
If a man hit a woman first - it's assault against the man. She's got to gauge whether to retaliate. He's already broken the law by hitting you so what are the chances he'll hit you more if you retaliate

Scenario 2
If a woman hit a man - it's assault against the woman. He's got to gauge whether he wants to retaliate. If he retaliate then there are some rules around that if he's bigger than her. But then again she might pull a gun on him

There are now prescribed rules for when it's okay to hit someone? Last I checked, if you get assaulted it doesn't give you a free pass to assault back. What are these rules, the 'maqqa playbook on life?' Which is completely juvenile and wrong, may I add.

Like i said, you walk away.

Self defence is an entirely different argument but hitting somebody because they hit you makes you every bit as buggered up as they are.

I'm not actually certain of the law in this case, but I'd imagine both have ability to press charges in this case.

Apparently Maqqa still likes to live in gladiator days where you can go for a dual to the death in the event of being provoked.

Reality is, regardless of which gender is the abusee/abuser, in the event of domestic violence, whether it be physical or emotional, the government role is to provide access to feeling safe, and to general help, and to provide the education to people on when they should seek help. Sure, government can't force the victim to report. That's ultimately up to the victim. But in a coherent society, the victim must have all avenues open to them to seek help if they choose to seek it.

Sure Honky, you know what, perhaps society can't save all people from themselves (by way of a person not acknowledging there is a problem). But society must always provide the tools to allow a person to save themselves, when and if they choose.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #241 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:38am

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:30am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:28am:

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:18am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:14am:

... wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:36pm:

John Smith wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:33pm:

... wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:29pm:

We live in the safest time there has ever been.

I agree it is safer, which is why more than one woman dead a week in this day and age is ridiculous

Well obviously it's not great, but this "any cost if it saves just one life" mentality has gone to absurd lengths.

You can't save everyone from themselves, no matter how much you try.

again blaming the victim.

I see a tremendous amount of that on here.

They really can't help themselves can they.

Domestic violence = feminism gone wild and if it happens it must be the fault of woman. You can't save these domestic violence loving women from themselves.

How crazy.

It's absurd isn't it?

And foremost in the fight against family violence perpetrated against men is feminists.

THese guys don;t know what they are talking about.

But you gotta love their constant counter argument. Everything is about the white man somehow losing control. Whenever a traditionally perceived minority group goes up against the traditionally perceived majority, straight away , 'Oh but what about the counter! Think of the counter!' It's pathetic. Sure, men are victims too, and men will receive the same support from government that women will. But the stats on this don't lie, and hence government messaging is of course going to be on where the stats are.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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mothra

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #242 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:48am

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:38am:

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:30am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:28am:

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:18am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:14am:

... wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:36pm:

John Smith wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:33pm:

... wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:29pm:

We live in the safest time there has ever been.

I agree it is safer, which is why more than one woman dead a week in this day and age is ridiculous

Well obviously it's not great, but this "any cost if it saves just one life" mentality has gone to absurd lengths.

You can't save everyone from themselves, no matter how much you try.

again blaming the victim.

I see a tremendous amount of that on here.

They really can't help themselves can they.

Domestic violence = feminism gone wild and if it happens it must be the fault of woman. You can't save these domestic violence loving women from themselves.

How crazy.

It's absurd isn't it?

And foremost in the fight against family violence perpetrated against men is feminists.

THese guys don;t know what they are talking about.

But you gotta love their constant counter argument. Everything is about the white man somehow losing control. Whenever a traditionally perceived minority group goes up against the traditionally perceived majority, straight away , 'Oh but what about the counter! Think of the counter!' It's pathetic. Sure, men are victims too, and men will receive the same support from government that women will. But the stats on this don't lie, and hence government messaging is of course going to be on where the stats are.

True.

Although we do have a problem with men being abused who do not report because of the stigma associated with being on the recieving end of abuse from a woman.

Whis is why i say feminists are the forefront in dealing with this.

This mindset is a result of the patriarchy. Men cannot be seen to be "weaker" than a woman. To admit to such is emasculating.

This is of course all bullshit ... but do you think your average red blooded bloke is going to tell his mates that he;s being knocked about by the missus?

Feminists fight the patriarchy. We speak out strongly in the defense of men who are also victims to it. Feminists are not anti-men.

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If you can't be a good example, you have to be a horrible warning.

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mothra Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 36060 Gender:	Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated Reply #243 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:54am Feminists are not anti-men ... god i get sick of saying it.
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cods

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #244 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 5:45am

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:24am:

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:22am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:18am:

cods wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 9:36am:

Prime Minister for Canyons wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 9:16am:

So it's OK to hit a woman if she repeatedly hits your triggers?

I would ,like to think....that anyone who is bashed repeatedly ... would know which

BUTTONS NOT TO PUSH..

it isnt rocket science is it??....someone bad and mean uses any excuse I am afraid...

some people take what happens outside the home... home with them and punish their families for it....

look at road rage for instance...its out of control...

this anger/rage is not just in the home...but its there it is doing enormous damage..

*sigh* beyond hilarious garbage.

I think Cods is saying that women who are the victims of violence, despite what some on here would argue, do not tend to provoke.

It is often leveled at women on threads such as these that women "ask for it". Cods is saying that women in such situations are usually well versed in not pushing their partners buttons. That the buttons are pushed regardless of how the woman behaves.

Ah, ok. I took it as cods saying someone who is bashed repeatedly should learn not to push buttons.

In that case, cods, I apologise. Wholeheartedly.

you have to understand what mental fear is imposed by those who start off with bullying.. yes good old bullying mental put downs...most physical violence doesnt start straight away.....it starts with demands....like the control.. wanting to know where you are or who you are with....and then getting angry with that....

its amazing how many women fall for men who want them under their thumb..[they confuse possessiveness with love]and Sad

think they own this person....women fall for it.. because they have this funny idea.. they can change a man....so if he is unhappy its got to be their fault in some way....he begs forgiveness and will never do it again......

and before you know it... its a lifestyle....yes there is fault on bothsides....but its like beating a child... since when has that been OK... because you are bigger...

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cods Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 88048	Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated Reply #245 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 5:50am mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:54am: Feminists are not anti-men ... god i get sick of saying it. I think we should stop the blame game... and get on with finding a cure... because what is happening today is most definitely gaining momentum... it isnt just D.V.. its everywhere....
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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #246 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 8:21am

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:22am:

Maqqa wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 3:47pm:

mothra wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

As for women wanting equality but not wanting to be hit, you need to think about the playing field. Men are, usually, considerably bigger and stronger than women. That is not to say a woman cant deliver a good hit but the chances are if a man then hits a woman in return, he is likely to do much more damage than she did. That is why it is not ok to hit women. It's just not good to wallop someone smaller than you.

Then it should be about big person walloping a smaller person and not about men hitting women because there are some women who are larger than men

As I said - I don't agree with "you can't hit a woman under any condition"

I question "reasonable force" for retaliation

Bottom line is - if the woman did not hit the man then there is no issue about retaliation with reasonable force

DON'T HIT!!! Women or men!!

Scenario 1
If a man hit a woman first - it's assault against the man. She's got to gauge whether to retaliate. He's already broken the law by hitting you so what are the chances he'll hit you more if you retaliate

Scenario 2
If a woman hit a man - it's assault against the woman. He's got to gauge whether he wants to retaliate. If he retaliate then there are some rules around that if he's bigger than her. But then again she might pull a gun on him

There are now prescribed rules for when it's okay to hit someone? Last I checked, if you get assaulted it doesn't give you a free pass to assault back. What are these rules, the 'maqqa playbook on life?' Which is completely juvenile and wrong, may I add.

Last time you checked...pfft.. its obvious youve never checked at all.

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In the fullness of time...

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #247 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 8:30am

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:48am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:38am:

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:30am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:28am:

mothra wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:18am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:14am:

... wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:36pm:

John Smith wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:33pm:

... wrote on Nov 25^th, 2015 at 10:29pm:

We live in the safest time there has ever been.

I agree it is safer, which is why more than one woman dead a week in this day and age is ridiculous

Well obviously it's not great, but this "any cost if it saves just one life" mentality has gone to absurd lengths.

You can't save everyone from themselves, no matter how much you try.

again blaming the victim.

I see a tremendous amount of that on here.

They really can't help themselves can they.

Domestic violence = feminism gone wild and if it happens it must be the fault of woman. You can't save these domestic violence loving women from themselves.

How crazy.

It's absurd isn't it?

And foremost in the fight against family violence perpetrated against men is feminists.

THese guys don;t know what they are talking about.

But you gotta love their constant counter argument. Everything is about the white man somehow losing control. Whenever a traditionally perceived minority group goes up against the traditionally perceived majority, straight away , 'Oh but what about the counter! Think of the counter!' It's pathetic. Sure, men are victims too, and men will receive the same support from government that women will. But the stats on this don't lie, and hence government messaging is of course going to be on where the stats are.

True.

Although we do have a problem with men being abused who do not report because of the stigma associated with being on the recieving end of abuse from a woman.

Whis is why i say feminists are the forefront in dealing with this.

This mindset is a result of the patriarchy. Men cannot be seen to be "weaker" than a woman. To admit to such is emasculating.

This is of course all bullshit ... but do you think your average red blooded bloke is going to tell his mates that he;s being knocked about by the missus?

Feminists fight the patriarchy. We speak out strongly in the defense of men who are also victims to it. Feminists are not anti-men.

Luckily all this fighting feminists supposrdly do on behalf of men is entirely fictional, because we dont want or need female centric solutions for male issues. What works for you does not work for us.

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #248 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 9:00am

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 10:44pm:

... wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 3:21pm:

I'm sure if I spat in your face, I might expect a violent reaction.

Not everybody's family is like yours, Honk.

Some people know how to restrain themselves.

Yes some people do, most people do not. Whether they should or not is debatable.

Regardless ill just assume if i were to spit in someones face theyd probably have a go at me. Thus, i wont spit in anyones face.

But you feel free to, and when they break your jaw for it you can complain that theyre barbarians who cant restrain themselves. Itll be totally worth it.

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« Last Edit: Jan 13^th, 2016 at 9:07am by ... »

In the fullness of time...

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #249 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:07am

... wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 8:21am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:22am:

Maqqa wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 3:47pm:

mothra wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

As for women wanting equality but not wanting to be hit, you need to think about the playing field. Men are, usually, considerably bigger and stronger than women. That is not to say a woman cant deliver a good hit but the chances are if a man then hits a woman in return, he is likely to do much more damage than she did. That is why it is not ok to hit women. It's just not good to wallop someone smaller than you.

Then it should be about big person walloping a smaller person and not about men hitting women because there are some women who are larger than men

As I said - I don't agree with "you can't hit a woman under any condition"

I question "reasonable force" for retaliation

Bottom line is - if the woman did not hit the man then there is no issue about retaliation with reasonable force

DON'T HIT!!! Women or men!!

Scenario 1
If a man hit a woman first - it's assault against the man. She's got to gauge whether to retaliate. He's already broken the law by hitting you so what are the chances he'll hit you more if you retaliate

Scenario 2
If a woman hit a man - it's assault against the woman. He's got to gauge whether he wants to retaliate. If he retaliate then there are some rules around that if he's bigger than her. But then again she might pull a gun on him

There are now prescribed rules for when it's okay to hit someone? Last I checked, if you get assaulted it doesn't give you a free pass to assault back. What are these rules, the 'maqqa playbook on life?' Which is completely juvenile and wrong, may I add.

Last time you checked...pfft.. its obvious youve never checked at all.

So there is a law that allows you to strike back? Show it to me. Pfffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffft.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #250 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:09am

... wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 9:00am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 10:44pm:

... wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 3:21pm:

I'm sure if I spat in your face, I might expect a violent reaction.

Not everybody's family is like yours, Honk.

Some people know how to restrain themselves.

Yes some people do, most people do not. Whether they should or not is debatable.

Regardless ill just assume if i were to spit in someones face theyd probably have a go at me. Thus, i wont spit in anyones face.

But you feel free to, and when they break your jaw for it you can complain that theyre barbarians who cant restrain themselves. Itll be totally worth it.

Why are people spitting in your face? It must be your fault.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #251 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:10am

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:07am:

... wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 8:21am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 2:22am:

Maqqa wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 3:47pm:

mothra wrote on Nov 26^th, 2015 at 2:43pm:

As for women wanting equality but not wanting to be hit, you need to think about the playing field. Men are, usually, considerably bigger and stronger than women. That is not to say a woman cant deliver a good hit but the chances are if a man then hits a woman in return, he is likely to do much more damage than she did. That is why it is not ok to hit women. It's just not good to wallop someone smaller than you.

Then it should be about big person walloping a smaller person and not about men hitting women because there are some women who are larger than men

As I said - I don't agree with "you can't hit a woman under any condition"

I question "reasonable force" for retaliation

Bottom line is - if the woman did not hit the man then there is no issue about retaliation with reasonable force

DON'T HIT!!! Women or men!!

Scenario 1
If a man hit a woman first - it's assault against the man. She's got to gauge whether to retaliate. He's already broken the law by hitting you so what are the chances he'll hit you more if you retaliate

Scenario 2
If a woman hit a man - it's assault against the woman. He's got to gauge whether he wants to retaliate. If he retaliate then there are some rules around that if he's bigger than her. But then again she might pull a gun on him

There are now prescribed rules for when it's okay to hit someone? Last I checked, if you get assaulted it doesn't give you a free pass to assault back. What are these rules, the 'maqqa playbook on life?' Which is completely juvenile and wrong, may I add.

Last time you checked...pfft.. its obvious youve never checked at all.

So there is a law that allows you to strike back? Show it to me. Pfffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffft.

Youve got it backwards.

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In the fullness of time...

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #252 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:11am

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:09am:

... wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 9:00am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 10:44pm:

... wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 3:21pm:

I'm sure if I spat in your face, I might expect a violent reaction.

Not everybody's family is like yours, Honk.

Some people know how to restrain themselves.

Yes some people do, most people do not. Whether they should or not is debatable.

Regardless ill just assume if i were to spit in someones face theyd probably have a go at me. Thus, i wont spit in anyones face.

But you feel free to, and when they break your jaw for it you can complain that theyre barbarians who cant restrain themselves. Itll be totally worth it.

Why are people spitting in your face? It must be your fault.

Stop victim blaming.

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In the fullness of time...

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated
Reply #253 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:16am

... wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:11am:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:09am:

... wrote on Jan 13^th, 2016 at 9:00am:

greggerypeccary wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 10:44pm:

... wrote on Jan 12^th, 2016 at 3:21pm:

I'm sure if I spat in your face, I might expect a violent reaction.

Not everybody's family is like yours, Honk.

Some people know how to restrain themselves.

Yes some people do, most people do not. Whether they should or not is debatable.

Regardless ill just assume if i were to spit in someones face theyd probably have a go at me. Thus, i wont spit in anyones face.

But you feel free to, and when they break your jaw for it you can complain that theyre barbarians who cant restrain themselves. Itll be totally worth it.

Why are people spitting in your face? It must be your fault.

Stop victim blaming.

You brought it on yourself.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: Domestic violence - it's complicated Reply #254 - Jan 13^th, 2016 at 10:22am So there could be justification for spitting in ones face, but never for so much as a slap?
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