Australian Politics Forum - Lib's Massive Tax Hike

Bam

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #30 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:57pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 10:39am:

Just increase the medicare levy, funnily enough when Bob Baldwin was asked about this today he evaded answering like it was the plague.

The facts are the GST hits lower income earners hardest, raising the medicare levy hits the wealthy the hardest and actually goes to the stated reason for these tax hikes instead of consolidated slush fund Revenue.

Increase the Medicare levy but also abolish the Medicare surcharge for high income earners without private health insurance ... problem solved.

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longweekend58

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #31 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:00pm

Bam wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:57pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 10:39am:

Just increase the medicare levy, funnily enough when Bob Baldwin was asked about this today he evaded answering like it was the plague.

The facts are the GST hits lower income earners hardest, raising the medicare levy hits the wealthy the hardest and actually goes to the stated reason for these tax hikes instead of consolidated slush fund Revenue.

Increase the Medicare levy but also abolish the Medicare surcharge for high income earners without private health insurance ... problem solved.

how is that solving a problem? all you do is reduce a bit of revenue. Increasing the GST with suitable compensation would be a very good idea which you would support if Labor suggested it.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Bam

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #32 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:19pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 10:27am:

Bam wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 9:35am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 7:32am:

____ wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 7:26am:

Numbers crunched on potential GST rise

Calls to lift the GST to 15 per cent could add several thousand dollars to the average household's annual budget.

NSW Premier Mike Baird has broached the idea ahead of Wednesday's federal and state leaders' meeting, but wants to put in place compensation measures to ensure low income earners aren't disadvantaged.

Figures crunched by Curtin University's economics centre and published in The West Australian show a 15 per cent GST would increase the average household's costs by $3987 a year.

Households in the bottom 20 per cent income tier would be $1755 a year worse off while the richest would face an increase of $6307 in costs a year.

Modelling by the University of Canberra's National Centre for Social and Economic Modelling estimates the average household would be up for an extra $2915 a year, the Financial Review reports.

au.finance.yahoo.com/news/numbers-crunched-potential-gst-rise-204508427.html

Leading economists have suggested that households in the low socio-economic bracket could be better off with tax cuts proposed by Baird to compensate them for the increased GST. It's also the fairest way to tax, as everyone pays the same amount of GST regardless of their income. Remember that even at 15%, our GST would still be one of the lowest in the world.

Why do you pay attention to these "leading economists" now? We could use the exact same economists and come up with a completely different outcome. It's all to do with the underlying assumptions. What are these?

It's not a fair tax for several reasons.

Ordinary consumers pay the GST while businesses can pass it on in full, even for items that the business consumes itself. If we abolished this deduction, we could force corporations like Google, Microsoft etc that currently transfer-price their way out of the tax system to pay SOME tax. Input costs that the business marks up could retain the current exemption. But why should businesses be claiming the GST on their toilet paper etc as a deduction? Businesses are consumers too.

It is a highly regressive tax that hits the poor disproportionately hard. Otherwise why would Baird have to discuss compensation measures? Increasing the Medicare levy is an alternative that can also be considered. Few people would disagree with that, especially if it came with sweeteners; the return of bulk billing for many procedures and the introduction of bulk billing dentists.

If you want to get more money for health, then abolish the private health insurance rebate. That would add $5 billion a year to the health budget and eliminate some unnecessary red tape. Redirect that money to reducing the cost of healthcare, and it would reduce the costs to providers so they can cut their premiums at no cost to themselves.

again with the business-hating.

Again with the false motives and the lies.

Quote:

EVERYTHING a business buys is an input cost to its final output.

So? Why must businesses be such protected species when compared to the PAYE tax payer?

All of the unnecessary corporate tax deductions get in the way of reducing the corporate tax rate and add to the compliance costs for businesses.

Quote:

you cannot just arbitrarily take away GST deductions without significantly raising costs on the ultimate product or service.

You're not getting it. Why must a consumption tax be avoided by some consumers and not others? Why must the PAYE taxpayer subsidise the cost of corporate toilet paper?

At the very least, we should have the courage to denounce anyone from the corporate world who calls for an increase in the GST - or for more toll roads, or other similar imposts - on the very simple grounds that they, as corporations, do not actually pay these taxes but just pass it on or can claim deductions but PAYE taxpayers usually get slugged in full. 10% of nothing is nothing, as is 15% of nothing.

Quote:

the GST is a fabulous tax that gets into the cash economy and even the black economy. Even criminals have to buy things and therefore pay tax on it.

Unless you're a tax-dodging corporation. Then you dodge it ALL.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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Bam

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #33 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:32pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:00pm:

Bam wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:57pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 10:39am:

Just increase the medicare levy, funnily enough when Bob Baldwin was asked about this today he evaded answering like it was the plague.

The facts are the GST hits lower income earners hardest, raising the medicare levy hits the wealthy the hardest and actually goes to the stated reason for these tax hikes instead of consolidated slush fund Revenue.

Increase the Medicare levy but also abolish the Medicare surcharge for high income earners without private health insurance ... problem solved.

how is that solving a problem? all you do is reduce a bit of revenue.

Why must freedom of choice for high income earners be punished? I thought individual freedom was something the Liberals were supposed to champion? All this surcharge does is create another vehicle for tax avoidance and make the tax system more complex than it needs to be.

Quote:

Increasing the GST with suitable compensation would be a very good idea which you would support if Labor suggested it.

Rubbish - you are just making up strawman crap. Why do you insist on lying like this?

I focus on POLICIES, not PARTIES. I will denounce Labor policies just as readily if I don't agree with them. Not everyone is like you, pushing the party line for a particular political party. Some people actually know how to think. You should try thinking sometime: you may learn something.

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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.

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longweekend58

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #34 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:34pm

Bam wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:19pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 10:27am:

Bam wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 9:35am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 7:32am:

____ wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 7:26am:

Numbers crunched on potential GST rise

Calls to lift the GST to 15 per cent could add several thousand dollars to the average household's annual budget.

NSW Premier Mike Baird has broached the idea ahead of Wednesday's federal and state leaders' meeting, but wants to put in place compensation measures to ensure low income earners aren't disadvantaged.

Figures crunched by Curtin University's economics centre and published in The West Australian show a 15 per cent GST would increase the average household's costs by $3987 a year.

Households in the bottom 20 per cent income tier would be $1755 a year worse off while the richest would face an increase of $6307 in costs a year.

Modelling by the University of Canberra's National Centre for Social and Economic Modelling estimates the average household would be up for an extra $2915 a year, the Financial Review reports.

au.finance.yahoo.com/news/numbers-crunched-potential-gst-rise-204508427.html

Leading economists have suggested that households in the low socio-economic bracket could be better off with tax cuts proposed by Baird to compensate them for the increased GST. It's also the fairest way to tax, as everyone pays the same amount of GST regardless of their income. Remember that even at 15%, our GST would still be one of the lowest in the world.

Why do you pay attention to these "leading economists" now? We could use the exact same economists and come up with a completely different outcome. It's all to do with the underlying assumptions. What are these?

It's not a fair tax for several reasons.

Ordinary consumers pay the GST while businesses can pass it on in full, even for items that the business consumes itself. If we abolished this deduction, we could force corporations like Google, Microsoft etc that currently transfer-price their way out of the tax system to pay SOME tax. Input costs that the business marks up could retain the current exemption. But why should businesses be claiming the GST on their toilet paper etc as a deduction? Businesses are consumers too.

It is a highly regressive tax that hits the poor disproportionately hard. Otherwise why would Baird have to discuss compensation measures? Increasing the Medicare levy is an alternative that can also be considered. Few people would disagree with that, especially if it came with sweeteners; the return of bulk billing for many procedures and the introduction of bulk billing dentists.

If you want to get more money for health, then abolish the private health insurance rebate. That would add $5 billion a year to the health budget and eliminate some unnecessary red tape. Redirect that money to reducing the cost of healthcare, and it would reduce the costs to providers so they can cut their premiums at no cost to themselves.

again with the business-hating.

Again with the false motives and the lies.

Quote:

EVERYTHING a business buys is an input cost to its final output.

So? Why must businesses be such protected species when compared to the PAYE tax payer?

All of the unnecessary corporate tax deductions get in the way of reducing the corporate tax rate and add to the compliance costs for businesses.

Quote:

you cannot just arbitrarily take away GST deductions without significantly raising costs on the ultimate product or service.

You're not getting it. Why must a consumption tax be avoided by some consumers and not others? Why must the PAYE taxpayer subsidise the cost of corporate toilet paper?

At the very least, we should have the courage to denounce anyone from the corporate world who calls for an increase in the GST - or for more toll roads, or other similar imposts - on the very simple grounds that they, as corporations, do not actually pay these taxes but just pass it on or can claim deductions but PAYE taxpayers usually get slugged in full. 10% of nothing is nothing, as is 15% of nothing.

Quote:

the GST is a fabulous tax that gets into the cash economy and even the black economy. Even criminals have to buy things and therefore pay tax on it.

Unless you're a tax-dodging corporation. Then you dodge it ALL.

you HATE businesses and even this post proves it. Companies and Employees are not even remotely the same thing. Pretending that the taxation arrangements should be similar is ludicrous and rather insane. The notion that business is subsidised by employees is perhaps the dumbest thing you've ever said. Employees are a SUBSET of businesses. NO EMPLOYEES WOULD EXIST if not for businesses. Happy and profitable businesses mean happy and profitable employees.

take away GST deductability and the price over everything would increase 15-30% overnight. REALLY good for employees, right?

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #35 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 6:48pm

Consumption taxes worldwide are targetted at the FINAL CONSUMER, not every piddling step in between. That is why companies only have to pass on GST collected on goods and services they sell to CONSUMERS. up until that stage, all purchases are effectively GST FREE.

now when employees are anything like companies then you have a point, but they arent, because when they do, they re actually companies - the objects of your left-wing hatred.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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John Smith

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #36 - Jul 21^st, 2015 at 8:29pm

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

i get at least 3 tenants a year moving here with shipping containers full of furniture .... funnily enough, they don't pay GST when they bring it in.
And I'm not talking about a dumb wannabe looser like you, I said the rich

here, for your benefit, check out the $400 000 sunnies
http://www.theopticalvisionsite.com/eyewear/25-of-the-most-expensive-eyewear-in-...

by the way dopey, I personally know of a jeweller who would travel OS twice a year every year for at least the last ten years that I knew him, and wear all his purchases back JUST so he could escape taxes, two rings per finger including on each toe, 20 necklaces, he'd wear 3 watches on one arm and 20 bracelets on the other, and then he'd load his wife up with the same... you are deluded if you think it doesn't happen. The more money people have, the greater the extremes they'll go to to hang onto it.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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aquascoot

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #37 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 7:19am

We live in a globalised economy now with free trade agreements everywhere.

The vital fact to keep prosperity growing is this.

PROSPERITY IS CREATED BY THE BUSINESS SECTOR.

any move to increase taxation merely increases the capital requirements of the government sector.

A dollar removed from a consumer and sent to canberra is a dollar not available to be used in the "REAL ECONOMY"

as such, only an economic illiterate would ever call for increased taxation.

Increased taxation kills an economy stone cold dead.

If you want to see what happens when you raise taxes to fix problems , go visit Greece and scavenge in a dumpster.

The answer is quite simple, reduce expenditure, tax cuts and let the individual consumer have some cash from his tax cut to go out and spend in the small business economy.

have the loons forgotten everything, even Rudd with his cash splash recognised that cash and consumer spending in small business is the answer to growth and to employment.

But unlike Rudd, dont borrow it from overseas (inter generational theft), cut government programs and give the battler the money in his own back pocket,

YOU CANT TAX YOUR WAY TO PROSPERITY

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longweekend58

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #38 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 9:55am

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 8:29pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

i get at least 3 tenants a year moving here with shipping containers full of furniture .... funnily enough, they don't pay GST when they bring it in.
And I'm not talking about a dumb wannabe looser like you, I said the rich

here, for your benefit, check out the $400 000 sunnies
http://www.theopticalvisionsite.com/eyewear/25-of-the-most-expensive-eyewear-in-...

by the way dopey, I personally know of a jeweller who would travel OS twice a year every year for at least the last ten years that I knew him, and wear all his purchases back JUST so he could escape taxes, two rings per finger including on each toe, 20 necklaces, he'd wear 3 watches on one arm and 20 bracelets on the other, and then he'd load his wife up with the same... you are deluded if you think it doesn't happen. The more money people have, the greater the extremes they'll go to to hang onto it.

and that is a typical rich person's behaviour? learn to work out what TYPICAL behaviour is and comment on that. You sound like greens_lose when you wank on like this.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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ImSpartacus2

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #39 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:00am

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

Longy, I have a question for you. If I run a business and want to buy a computer for personal use I figure its not going to be too difficult to buy it as a business expense avoiding both the GST and accruing all the deductions and tax breaks that go with that. What do you say?

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ImSpartacus2

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #40 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:05am

aquascoot wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 7:19am:

We live in a globalised economy now with free trade agreements everywhere.

The vital fact to keep prosperity growing is this.

PROSPERITY IS CREATED BY THE BUSINESS SECTOR.

any move to increase taxation merely increases the capital requirements of the government sector.

A dollar removed from a consumer and sent to canberra is a dollar not available to be used in the "REAL ECONOMY"

as such, only an economic illiterate would ever call for increased taxation.

Increased taxation kills an economy stone cold dead.

If you want to see what happens when you raise taxes to fix problems , go visit Greece and scavenge in a dumpster.

The answer is quite simple, reduce expenditure, tax cuts and let the individual consumer have some cash from his tax cut to go out and spend in the small business economy.

have the loons forgotten everything, even Rudd with his cash splash recognised that cash and consumer spending in small business is the answer to growth and to employment.

But unlike Rudd, dont borrow it from overseas (inter generational theft), cut government programs and give the battler the money in his own back pocket,

YOU CANT TAX YOUR WAY TO PROSPERITY

All major economists today say this is wrong. Picketty, Stiglitz, Krugman (the 3 most prominent economists today). Now are you just going to keep repeating the same old thing regardless or are you going to go and research this now and allow it to effect your thinking, because that's what people do who want to get at the truth.

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aquascoot

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #41 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:09am

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:00am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

Longy, I have a question for you. If I run a business and want to buy a computer for personal use I figure its not going to be too difficult to buy it as a business expense avoiding both the GST and accruing all the deductions and tax breaks that go with that. What do you say?

a small business person is ALWAYS working.
every interaction on , say, even Facebook , is part of growing the social network, marketing, promoting.

I would consider it inconceivable that a small business person would not legitimately be able to claim a computer as a business expense.

Whereas a public servant can switch off the brain at 5.00 pm (if indeed he bothered switching it on at 9 am), a small business person has no such luxury.

As a lifter , he is entitled to some help from the government.
As a leaner, the non business person needs to be taxed harder to support the productive elements of the economy.
A rising tide floats all ships.(or lifts them , if you will )

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longweekend58

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #42 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:11am

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:00am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

Longy, I have a question for you. If I run a business and want to buy a computer for personal use I figure its not going to be too difficult to buy it as a business expense avoiding both the GST and accruing all the deductions and tax breaks that go with that. What do you say?

you can do it until such time as you are audited and you need to justify it. That could be problematic. Or are you confused that people might do something illegal? but only company owners right? You've never heard of people cheatingon their PERSONAL taxation?

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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ImSpartacus2

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Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #43 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:19am

aquascoot wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:09am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:00am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

Longy, I have a question for you. If I run a business and want to buy a computer for personal use I figure its not going to be too difficult to buy it as a business expense avoiding both the GST and accruing all the deductions and tax breaks that go with that. What do you say?

a small business person is ALWAYS working.
every interaction on , say, even Facebook , is part of growing the social network, marketing, promoting.

I would consider it inconceivable that a small business person would not legitimately be able to claim a computer as a business expense.

Whereas a public servant can switch off the brain at 5.00 pm (if indeed he bothered switching it on at 9 am), a small business person has no such luxury.

As a lifter , he is entitled to some help from the government.
As a leaner, the non business person needs to be taxed harder to support the productive elements of the economy.
A rising tide floats all ships.(or lifts them , if you will )

Ahh yes, the age of entitlement, ooozes from your post. Tell me when you spend all day every day on this forum is that an example of you "working all the time". Pathetic!!! But I think you answered the question. Small business can easily avoid the GST if they choose (and I would suspect many do in fact choose to do so). Tell me aquascoot, with all the handouts you get and continue to expect from the Aust people, including tax rate cuts, copious tax deductions, and easy mechanisms to avoid paying the GST and little if any income tax, do you ever feel guilty about how much you bludge off the Aust people. And that's only when your wearing your business person;s hat. Add to that your farmer's hat and really!!! talk about the age of entitlement.

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ImSpartacus2

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Australian Politics

Posts: 6913

Re: Lib's Massive Tax Hike
Reply #44 - Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:28am

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:11am:

ImSpartacus2 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2015 at 10:00am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 5:46pm:

John Smith wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 4:03pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:54pm:

stunspore wrote on Jul 21^st, 2015 at 3:45pm:

Many reasons why health care costs are up. However at least one area is easy to fix - medicines. Past reports suggest however with the pharmaceutical guild and free trade policies, medicines are more likely to increase than decrease. This should be an easy political fix.

For the libs who espouse increase in GST - I have yet to see a report where it won't hit the lowest socioeconomic class the hardest. If you have such a document or link, please by all means give it to me. Until then, to say it is fair when it is contrary reports is quite a false statement.

The rich can always avoid GST of course on their expensive purchases by buying overseas. Not an option on the poorest.

yeah... up to $1000, just like you can.

except that the rich can go to farkoffistan, buy a $100 000 diamond ring (for example) and wear it back and not pay any tax on it. Or a $10000 dress, or $10000 sunnies or $100 000 watches or any of an unlimited range of products that they buy overseas because it is cheaper and beause they wear it, or have worn it, do not pay tax on it

yeah beause you can wear a car or a couch or a TV or more than one jacket and of course EVERYONE is buying uber-expensive diamond rings, right? Feel free to find me $10K sunnies.

u r an idiot.

Longy, I have a question for you. If I run a business and want to buy a computer for personal use I figure its not going to be too difficult to buy it as a business expense avoiding both the GST and accruing all the deductions and tax breaks that go with that. What do you say?

you can do it until such time as you are audited and you need to justify it. That could be problematic. Or are you confused that people might do something illegal? but only company owners right? You've never heard of people cheatingon their PERSONAL taxation?

Well you saw scoots justification. He said he's working all the time (even it seems when he's chatting on here). And those who are inclined to fudge the system (and we are all human) will do so. So when you say its an effective tax, in fact its a very discriminatory tax because in practice only impacts on PAYE tax payers. Indeed I remember shortly after the GST came in small business was complaining about the paperwork and sure enough Howard relaxed the accounting requirements significantly. Translation, significantly opened the door for tax avoidance. You see the issue isn't so much about demonising businesspeople for cheating on the tax system but a tax system that makes it easy for them to avoid paying the tax and then increasing that tax and pretending that you're being fair in sharing the tax burden. But none of this matters of course because its so unfair on the small businessman who has to pay penalty rates on weekends and public holidays.

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