Australian Politics Forum - Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas

Ajax

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Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Jun 7^th, 2015 at 11:58am

In the generations to come when they look back at the great con job of Anthropogenic Global Warming, they must surely think we were a dumb peoples to fall for such a scam.

Especially when we have proved that there is no hot spot the signature of computer model AGW.

The oceans aren't warming at the alarming rate of the computer model forecasts.

The medieval warm period was deliberatly changed in Manns hockey stick.

Climate gate, etc etc.

Quote:

Thanks To The IPCC, the Public Doesn’t Know Water Vapor Is Most Important Greenhouse Gas

Guest Blogger / February 8, 2015

Guest Opinion: Dr. Tim Ball

It is not surprising that Roe and Baker explained in a 2007 Science paper that, “The envelope of uncertainty in climate projections has not narrowed appreciably over the past 30 years, despite tremendous increases in computing power, in observations, and in the number of scientists studying the problem.” The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) wasn’t designed to improve the uncertainty. Rather, it was mandated, designed and operated to isolate human effects.

The IPCC let the public believe they are examining the entire climate system. From a climate mechanism perspective, they only look at one or two very minor components. It is like describing a car and how it operates by ignoring the engine, transmission, and wheels while focusing on one nut on the right rear wheel. They are only looking at one thread on the nut, human CO2.

Read the rest here
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2015/02/08/thanks-to-the-ipcc-the-public-doesnt-know-...

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« Last Edit: Jun 7^th, 2015 at 12:18pm by Ajax »

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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Marla

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #1 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 12:25pm

"As recently as Monday Feb 5, 2007, the presumptuous Dr. Tim Ball was still advertising himself as “the first Canadian PhD in climatology.”

Ball is a Canadian climate change skeptic and was previously a "scientific advisor" to the oil industry-backed organization, Friends of Science.[4] Ball is a member of the Board of Research Advisors of the Frontier Centre for Public Policy, a Canadian free-market think tank which is predominantly funded by foundations and corporations.*

*Such as the Koch Brothers.

You do try, Ajax. You do try.

http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/7vmoge/weathering-fights

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I like takin' Tuinal. It keeps me edgy and mean. I'm a teenage schizoid I'm a teenage dope fiend

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21376 Gender:	Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas Reply #2 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 12:27pm Oh, no the evil Koch Bros. Getting more like the Marx Bros. Gee, even Desmogblog doesn't have that info on their website. And if there were a smear to be had they would be in it.
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John_Taverner

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #3 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 1:44pm

Ajax, I'd like to humbly thank you for pointing out what absolutely no Climate Scientists already knew. The only people in the world that know that elusive fact are school kids.

Water vapour is the most important greenhouse gas in the troposphere.

Now tell me this in all your wisdom:

What about the upper troposphere where the the temperature is anything from about minus 40 to minus 70?

What is the water dewpoint likely to be at that altitude?
What happens to the CO2 concentration at that altitude?
Which is the most important greenhouse gas at that altitude?

Ajax, I think I found one of your old school broadcasts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBaVwwuErmU

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« Last Edit: Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:02pm by John_Taverner »

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Ajax

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #4 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:18pm

Marla wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 12:25pm:

"As recently as Monday Feb 5, 2007, the presumptuous Dr. Tim Ball was still advertising himself as “the first Canadian PhD in climatology.”

Ball is a Canadian climate change skeptic and was previously a "scientific advisor" to the oil industry-backed organization, Friends of Science.[4] Ball is a member of the Board of Research Advisors of the Frontier Centre for Public Policy, a Canadian free-market think tank which is predominantly funded by foundations and corporations.*

*Such as the Koch Brothers.

You do try, Ajax. You do try.

http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/7vmoge/weathering-fights

Arrhhh Miss Muffet your back again with news from the dailyshow about the kotch brothers.

That's really sweet dear, now have you anything of interest to say........................??????? Roll Eyes

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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Ajax

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #5 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:24pm

John_Taverner wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 1:44pm:

Ajax, I'd like to humbly thank you for pointing out what absolutely no Climate Scientists already knew. The only people in the world that know that elusive fact are school kids.

Water vapour is the most important greenhouse gas in the troposphere.

Now tell me this in all your wisdom:

What about the upper troposphere where the the temperature is anything from about minus 40 to minus 70?

What is the water dewpoint likely to be at that altitude?
What happens to the CO2 concentration at that altitude?
Which is the most important greenhouse gas at that altitude?

Ajax, I think I found one of your old school broadcasts:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBaVwwuErmU

Johno Johno Johno, you really like pushing snake oil on to unsuspecting victims don't you mate.....!!!!!

Like I told you johno most Aussies can smell snake oil from kilometres away mate.......!!!!!

So Johno take your snake oil and stick it where it fits mate......!!!!!!!

What are you going to tell us Johno that more CO2 increases the greenhouse effect......?????

Quote:

The effectiveness of CO2 as a greenhouse gas becomes ever more marginal with greater concentration

Anthony Watts / May 8, 2013

Team Sisyphus uniform design - back
Team Sisyphus uniform design – back (Photo credit: nicomachus)

The political target of limiting the effect of Man-made global warming to only +2⁰C can never be attained.

Guest essay by Ed Hoskins

According to well understood physical parameters, the effectiveness of CO2 as a greenhouse gas diminishes logarithmically with increasing concentration and from the current level of ~390 ppmv, (parts per million by volume). Accordingly only ~5% of the effectiveness of CO2 as a greenhouse gas remains beyond the current level.

This inconvenient fact is well understood in the climate science community. It can be accurately modeled using the Modtran program maintained and supported at the University of Chicago.

The logarithmic diminution of the effect of CO2 is probably the reason why there was no runaway greenhouse warming from CO2 in earlier eons when CO2 levels were known to be at levels of several thousands ppmv.

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Remarkably, IPCC Published reports , (TAR3), do actually acknowledge that the effective temperature increase caused by growing concentrations of CO2 in the atmosphere radically diminishes with increasing concentrations. This information is in their report. It is well disguised for any lay reader, (Chapter 6. Radiative Forcing of Climate Change: section 6.3.4 Total Well-Mixed Greenhouse Gas Forcing Estimate).

The diminishing percentage effectiveness of CO2 as a greenhouse gas as acknowledged by the IPCC and its concomitant diminishing temperature effect are as follows:

increment cumulative

0-100 ppmv: according to David Archibald / Modtran data ~2.22°C ~2.22°C

100-200 ppmv: plants die below this level of CO2 +~0.29°C ~2.51°C

200-300 ppmv: noted as the preindustrial CO2 level +~0.14°C ~2.65°C

300-400 ppmv: current level IPCC attributes all as Man-made +~0.06°C ~2.71°C

400-600 ppmv: business as usual till 2100 +~0.08°C ~2.79°C

Read the rest here
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/05/08/the-effectiveness-of-co2-as-a-greenhouse-g...

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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John_Taverner

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #6 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:40pm

Ajax wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:24pm:

Johno Johno Johno, you really like pushing snake oil on to unsuspecting victims don't you mate.....!!!!!

Like I told you johno most Aussies can smell snake oil from kilometres away mate.......!!!!!

So Johno take your snake oil and stick it where it fits mate......!!!!!!!

What are you going to tell us Johno that more CO2 increases the greenhouse effect......?????

Ajax, you really amaze me. You tell me all these things that Climatology 101 Students learn about. Radiative forcing is logarithmic! Who'd have thunk?

You mean it's kinda like this? :

ΔF= 5.35 x ln (C/C₀Wm^-2)

So it's not linear! Wow what a revelation! No climate scientist in the world knew that amazing fact before you brought it up.

Ajax, this is getting tedious really interesting. Tell me what other examples of elementary climatology you have for our amazement. You are so smart, you must feel so lonely.

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Ajax

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #7 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:52pm

John_Taverner wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:40pm:

Ajax wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:24pm:

Johno Johno Johno, you really like pushing snake oil on to unsuspecting victims don't you mate.....!!!!!

Like I told you johno most Aussies can smell snake oil from kilometres away mate.......!!!!!

So Johno take your snake oil and stick it where it fits mate......!!!!!!!

What are you going to tell us Johno that more CO2 increases the greenhouse effect......?????

Ajax, you really amaze me. You tell me all these things that Climatology 101 Students learn about. Radiative forcing is logarithmic! Who'd have thunk?

You mean it's kinda like this? :

ΔF= 5.35 x ln (C/C₀Wm^-2)

So it's not linear! Wow what a revelation! No climate scientist in the world knew that amazing fact before you brought it up.

Ajax, this is getting tedious really interesting. Tell me what other examples of elementary climatology you have for our amazement. You are so smart, you must feel so lonely.

Johno I'm not a climatologist like you my friend, and while you maybe able to smooth graphs and molest data as only an alarmist from the religious school of climatology can it doesn't make you one bit smarter than anyone of us on this forum.

You have simply learned some procedures and ofcourse have built some experience on them but this doesn't make smarter than anyone else, especially when you resort to text book explanations.

Give most people enough information about any subject and at the end of the day they will be able to tell if it is real or if someone is taking them for a ride.

You don't have to be an expert like yourself to be able to work that one out.

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1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

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John_Taverner

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #8 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 6:48pm

Ajax wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:52pm:

... while you maybe able to smooth graphs and molest data as only an alarmist from the religious school of climatology can it doesn't make you one bit smarter than anyone of us on this forum.

Your hero Bob Tisdale, the retired car salesman is the one who smoothed the data. Is he an alarmist? You don't even understand the point I was making.

Quote:

You have simply learned some procedures and ofcourse have built some experience on them but this doesn't make smarter than anyone else, especially when you resort to text book explanations.

I know that you are not very good in the book larnin department, but you need to understand that science has nothing to do with rote learning without understanding.

Quote:

Give most people enough information about any subject and at the end of the day they will be able to tell if it is real or if someone is taking them for a ride.

You don't have to be an expert like yourself to be able to work that one out.

In your case it's like following a football team. You root for the Denialists, so you only accept information from them.

Conventional scientists you would term as "warmists" or "alarmists". It's a useful way for the purveyors of doubt to prevent you from using real science as a source.

I don't expect you to accept that, because you are too far gone. You are hooked on WUWT, Joanne Nova and the like. If not, prove me wrong.

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lee

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #9 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 7:37pm

When sceptics first started talking about 'the pause' the alarmist at first pooh-poohed them. Then the IPCC discovered 'the pause' and 'warmists' have been writing papers to explain 'the pause'.

Now a 'warmist' has come out and said 'the pause' is all wrong; despite a number of datasets showing 'the pause'.

It is the 'warmists' who have instigated the claim 'deniers'.

And now you turn around and claim the moral high ground.

You really are deluded.

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John_Taverner

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #10 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 8:12pm

Call them for what they are - qualified climate scientists (warmists) versus a mixed rabble including radio presenters, computer scientists, childrens TV presenters, retired car salesmen and mining executives plus one or two professional liars like Lindzen, Singer and Spencer (anything but sceptics). The latter group have previously sold their souls to big tobacco, and now turn their hands to Global climate change denial using exactly the same techniques.

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21376 Gender:	Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas Reply #11 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 8:18pm Like Naomi Oreskes, Historian of Science?
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John_Taverner Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 2217 Gender:	Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas Reply #12 - Jun 7^th, 2015 at 8:26pm I don't think she has actually done any climate science. She started off as a mining geologist actually. Her claim to fame was the book and film "Merchants of Doubt" You don't need to be a climatologist to recognise a rogue when you see one.
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Marla

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Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas
Reply #13 - Jun 8^th, 2015 at 12:21am

Ajax wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:18pm:

That's really sweet dear, now have you anything of interest to say........................??????? Roll Eyes

First off, I'm not your "dear" copy and paste Bat Boy. Two, try to read between your own lines. I have no doubt you are nothing more than a some of big oil shill shoveling propaganda that has been debunked so many times that you are either perpetually ignorant or being paid to post the garbage that you do.

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I like takin' Tuinal. It keeps me edgy and mean. I'm a teenage schizoid I'm a teenage dope fiend

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Marla Gold Member Offline A joint a day keeps the MAGA away Posts: 15035 Colorado Gender:	Re: Water Vapor is the most important greenhouse gas Reply #14 - Jun 8^th, 2015 at 12:23am Ajax wrote on Jun 7^th, 2015 at 2:24pm: Like I told you johno most Aussies can smell snake oil from kilometres away mate.......!!!!! So...most of your fellow countrymen can smell you from kilometers away. Isn't that what you're really trying to say here, Bat boy?
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