Australian Politics Forum - Labor's debt is crippling the nation

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Labor's debt is crippling the nation (Read 5524 times)

sir prince duke alevine Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23619 Gender:	Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation Reply #105 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 9:06am labor are corrupt wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 8:58am: Labor to bring back the carbon tax and increase GST. But they will still increase the debt. LAC, Liberals will increase the GST. Labor will bring back an ETS. No need to tell porkies, please.
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St George of the Garden

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #106 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 9:46am

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 8:15am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 8:14am:

The real locked–in spending was locked in by Howard.

Time the Libs started tackling that!

If that were true, why didn't Labor do something about it?

PHC rebate means tested
Baby Bonus gone
Efficiency dividends imposed on PS that had grown in the Howard years.

The 15% concessionary tax on super payments, resulting in huge tax avoidance by the suer rich, had started to be wound back in the last Labor Budget, Libs reversed that the first thing.

I want Muso as GMod. Bring back Muso!

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Kat

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #107 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 9:03pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:30am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:28am:

Kat wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:15am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:14am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:55am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:51am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:46am:

Swan has a record that many treasurers would be proud of including an ex PM when treasurer.

Yes he spent like an 18 year old blonde bimbo with her first Visa card... Grin

No Howard was a tight arse who got us into trouble the opposite way.

Swan cut back significantly in every budget except for the stimulus period.

You're serious right?

Cheesy

He's also correct.

He had six consecutive deficit budgets..... Cheesy

Couldn't even produce a five cent surplus in his first year following Costello's surplus of $22bn. They don't come more incompetent than that goose Wayne Swan!

Slander away, fool.

The whole world knows you are wrong.

The only ones who believe the crap you post are you neo-con clowns.

No-one else does.

BTW, neither DNA nor I mentioned anything about your idiotic surpluses.

You can reduce expenditure and still be in deficit. Swan did reduce expenditure
which is the point we made. Successfully obviously, or you wouldn't have moved
the goalposts by bringing up surpluses.

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Dnarever

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #108 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 9:58pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 8:11am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 8:09am:

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:36am:

John Smith wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:35am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:28am:

Kat wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:15am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:14am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:55am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:51am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:46am:

Swan has a record that many treasurers would be proud of including an ex PM when treasurer.

Yes he spent like an 18 year old blonde bimbo with her first Visa card... Grin

No Howard was a tight arse who got us into trouble the opposite way.

Swan cut back significantly in every budget except for the stimulus period.

You're serious right?

He's also correct.

Come on Kittykat Swan had six consecutive deficit budgets..... Cheesy

because revenue was falling at a much faster rate than spending . The same problem Abbott is now facing.

BUZZ!!! Wrong again!!! Revenue was rising and was considerably higher than during Howard's last year as PM.

So the current government do not have a problem ? The Libs budget is over $20 billion worse than Labor had and they Blew out by over an extra $10 billion more than budgeted in 3 months.

Technically you are both correct.

The revenue is rising but much less than expected and much less than what the locked in spending is increasing.

The projected revenue was declining in exactly the same manner as has led to the Smokin Joe silly budget blowing out by another $10 Billion because the budget projected income was not realised. i.e. projected income in the budget is falling and has been since the GFC. (actual income dollars are increasing as you say).

And that locked in spending was locked in by Labor, the same party that is now voting against savings measures they advocated before the election and in doing so, are doing their level best to be nothing more than spiteful obstructionists.

And that locked in spending was locked in by Labor,

No it was mostly inherited from Howard / Costello in the manner in which they had geared the economy. They were giving away future income in the form of tax reductions based on the belief that ecanomic Growth would remain at record levels forever.

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John Smith

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #109 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 10:59pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:36am:

John Smith wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:35am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:28am:

Kat wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:15am:

longweekend58 wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 7:14am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:55am:

Swagman wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:51am:

Dnarever wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:46am:

Swan has a record that many treasurers would be proud of including an ex PM when treasurer.

Yes he spent like an 18 year old blonde bimbo with her first Visa card... Grin

No Howard was a tight arse who got us into trouble the opposite way.

Swan cut back significantly in every budget except for the stimulus period.

You're serious right?

Cheesy

He's also correct.

Come on Kittykat Swan had six consecutive deficit budgets..... Cheesy

because revenue was falling at a much faster rate than spending . The same problem Abbott is now facing.

BUZZ!!! Wrong again!!! Revenue was rising and was considerably higher than during Howard's last year as PM.

haven't you got a village to inhabit? Even Hockey has admited that revenue is falling Cheesy

$6.2 billion hit in just over six months, with the midyear economic update set to forecast $379.5 billion in receipts, down from the $385.7 billion forecast in the May budget.

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/joe-hockeys-budget-update-...

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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John Smith

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #110 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 11:02pm

Armchair_Politician wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 8:11am:

Locked in spending? Grin

Aren't the adults in charge? anything that was locked in can be unlocked. The carbon tax was locked in wasn't it? Idiot

Labor isn't voting against anything it advocated before the election, you're confusing labor with libs... you want to see obstructionists look no further than abbotts refusal to support legislation that would allow 3rd party processing of asylum seekers Cheesy

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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crocodile

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #111 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 11:15pm

Bias_2012 wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 8:29pm:

You missed one percepts

External Debt to GDP Ratio - Australia: 146.29% (a rise of 53.8% since early 2011)

http://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

Not good all that money disappearing overseas just when we need it. Is this the debt that's costing us $700 million a month just in interest ? I think it might be. I don't think the Labor party would give a damn, they'll just lay it on future generations to pay it off. Future generations will need to wake up, but no one should hold their breath waiting for that to happen

Did you notice the communist running Greece now? I heard he's a Greek Aussie! Probably had plenty of Labor party mentors. Good Bye Greece

There's a couple of problems with this assessment. Firstly, the quoted figures are gross debt levels. This ignores the fact that Australian citizens are also recipients of foreign capital inflows as well as outflows. The difference is the net figure.

http://www.aph.gov.au/About_Parliament/Parliamentary_Departments/Parliamentary_L...

Accordingly, the position is actually $865 billion or 54.6% of GDP.

Most of the foreign debt is in private hands and is a component of net private debt. Net private debt is around 145% of GDP, far higher than the public debt that seems to be on everybody's mind.

It's not very intuitive to complain about the debt without knowing what comprises the debt. Some will be in the form of bank liabilities tied up in private household mortgages. As long as the asset value remains above the loan value and the holder of the debt can afford the repayments it's not really a big deal.

Some will be dividends owing to foreign owners that have invested in Australian entities. An unfortunate fact of life in a resource rich country with a small capital base is that we rely on foreign investment to get major projects up and running. Like all investors, they assume they will profit from the deal. In the process we get to share it.

Some will be businesses investing in entities outside of Australia. The reverse of the above. A large capital outlay with the expectation of a payback with profits attached. As long as the investment is used to procure an income sufficient to meet the repayments and return a profit it is a good thing.

Naturally some too will be disasters and disappointments. It's not all bad unless something crashes in a big way.

Many factors contribute to the escalation of private debt. In no particular order some of these include:
1. Negative current account ( Imports > exports )
2. Government budget surpluses
3. Currency devaluation for foreign denominated debts
4. Low profits from external investments.

At one a half times a years production and a relatively small public debt it only looks scary because the numbers are big. So is the economy.

« Last Edit: Jan 29^th, 2015 at 6:58am by crocodile »

Very funny Scotty, now beam down my clothes.

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crocodile

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #112 - Jan 28^th, 2015 at 11:25pm

perceptions_now wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 10:24pm:

Bias_2012 wrote on Jan 27^th, 2015 at 8:29pm:

You missed one percepts

External Debt to GDP Ratio - Australia: 146.29% (a rise of 53.8% since early 2011)

http://www.usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html

Not good all that money disappearing overseas just when we need it. Is this the debt that's costing us $700 million a month just in interest ? I think it might be. I don't think the Labor party would give a damn, they'll just lay it on future generations to pay it off. Future generations will need to wake up, but no one should hold their breath waiting for that to happen

Did you notice the communist running Greece now? I heard he's a Greek Aussie! Probably had plenty of Labor party mentors. Good Bye Greece

Sorry for the delay, it's been a busy day!

In fact, External Debt is not one that I missed, I just wouldn't include it in with the sort of information I gave, in my post (Reply 74) on this thread earlier today.

The basic reason being, my earlier post was primarily about "Australian Government Debt" & related issues, whereas the External Debt is described as follows -
External debt (or foreign debt) is the total debt a country owes to foreign creditors.
The debtors can be the government, corporations or citizens of that country.

In other words, External Debt (or foreign debt) is the total Debt a country owes to foreign creditors, by Governments, Business & individuals.

What I was referring to was purely Government Debt and did not include Business &/or Private individuals Debt, as the Australian Public are not responsible for the Debts of those Businesses &/or Private individuals!

True, they are not but policies can certainly eat into private savings and escalate debt levels

I hope that helps.

As for the Greeks, their cause is lost & it has been, for a while.

Not sure about that. I see that the newly sworn in Alexis Tsiprahs is pressuring the Germans to forgive 50% of Greek debt or they will abandon the Euro. If he sticks to his guns I can only a see a win for the Greeks. He either gets half his debt gone or returns to the drachma. Either way, the Eurozone are the biggest losers in the whole common currency fiasco.

Very funny Scotty, now beam down my clothes.

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Bias_2012

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Re: Labor's debt is crippling the nation
Reply #113 - Jan 29^th, 2015 at 9:41am

crocodile wrote on Jan 28^th, 2015 at 11:25pm:

As for the Greeks, their cause is lost & it has been, for a while.

Not sure about that. I see that the newly sworn in Alexis Tsiprahs is pressuring the Germans to forgive 50% of Greek debt or they will abandon the Euro. If he sticks to his guns I can only a see a win for the Greeks. He either gets half his debt gone or returns to the drachma. Either way, the Eurozone are the biggest losers in the whole common currency fiasco.

We'll see what happens ... I agree however with his policy of retaining public assets in he hands of the people saving them from the ruthless plunder of shareholders of private companies, not to mention the fact that the people save themselves from losing ownership and sovereignty of the assets

I'm not so rightwing on this issue, because national assets in public hands has more advantages for a nation than just a "feel good" socialist reason

The Libs and Labs made a big mistake privatising our utilities, we're paying for it now and we'll pay very dearly for it in the future

Our Lives Are Governed By The Feast & Famine Variable

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Oh, that's funny!!! Not a chance. No, hell no! That's a joke, right? All of the above. « Last Modified by: Armchair_Politician on: Jan 27^th, 2015 at 7:03am »