Australian Politics Forum - Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott

Redmond Neck

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #45 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:04pm

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On its face, the IMF assessment might seem harsh. After all, before they were voted out in 2007, Howard and Costello had delivered six budget surpluses in a row.

But they also seriously undermined the structural integrity of the budget by making big spending commitments and giving huge tax cuts, on the basis of a flood of revenue that would inevitably dry up.

“You can sum it up in four words,” says Chris Richardson of Deloitte Access Economics. “Temporary boom, permanent promises.”

For a period money roared in to the economy, as a result of what was happening in China and elsewhere. According to Richardson, this enormous boom made the government of Howard and Costello look better than it was.

“Subsequently we’ve heard the sucking sound as the money’s gone back down the gurgler, which has made Rudd, Gillard and Swan look worse than they were,” he said. “And it’s now making Abbott and Hockey look worse than they are.”

Even more amusing to me was to hear Hockey some months back talking of future tax cuts

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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott Reply #46 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:16pm Maybe Richardson should run for politics if he has all the answers. I'm sure the Truebelievers would find a spot for him.
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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott Reply #47 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:23pm Richardson just said the obvious. Re the sale of the assets—the 90s recession was over and the debt would have been paid over time anyway, just like the current debt, even with the Libs blowing the debt out, will be paid over time. Just like the debt we had at the end of WWII was paid off.
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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott Reply #48 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:26pm Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:16pm: I'm sure the Truebelievers would find a spot for him .....stuff knows they need someone with a bit of economic nouse....
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Redmond Neck

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #49 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:26pm

The fools havent learnt a thing!

Quote:

But he has dropped some hints, saying earlier this month: ''I would like to be in a position to offer tax cuts in our next term … The whole point of getting the budget under control now is so that we can give tax cuts in the not-too-distant future.''

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/prepoll-tax-cuts-planned-to-woo-disaffected-voters-20140530-399v1.html

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St George of the Garden Gold Member Offline http://tinyurl.com/n 3o8m2x Posts: 9809 Gender:	Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott Reply #50 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:28pm More true of the Libs who only have Robb as someone with economic qualifications. On the Labor side Bowen, Swan and Leigh have qualifications, probably others as well.
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Swagman

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #51 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:31pm

Redmond Neck wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:26pm:

The fools havent learnt a thing!

Quote:

But he has dropped some hints, saying earlier this month: ''I would like to be in a position to offer tax cuts in our next term … The whole point of getting the budget under control now is so that we can give tax cuts in the not-too-distant future.''

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/prepoll-tax-cuts-planned-to-woo-disaffected-voters-20140530-399v1.html

Well done Mr Abbott. When you reward something you get more of it.

Reward effort and you get more effort. Smiley

Reward bludgers and you just get more bludgers. Cheesy

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #52 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:43pm

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 12:51pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 12:10pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 11:03am:

Redmond Neck wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 10:42am:

John Hewson, former Liberal leader, economist and now professor with the Crawford School of Public Policy at the Australian National University, underlines the point: “The tax cuts Howard and Costello gave are now costing [the budget] about $30 billion a year, and the deficit’s $40 billion.”

Without those cuts and the $9 billion Hockey gave – unasked for and against the will of treasury – to the Reserve Bank, says Hewson, “the deficit problem wouldn’t exist”.

And that’s without including some $40 billion in tax concessions for superannuation, which accrue overwhelmingly to the wealthiest 20 per cent of taxpayers.

that is rather a simplistic view that typically comes from ivory tower economists. if you reversed those tax cuts almost everyone would be paying around 20% more tax that presently. Current take is around $165Bpa in income tax. to add $30B to it requires increasing income tax by 20%. so why not increase taxes by 30% instead? since increasing income tax seems to not have any impact on the economy according to nutters like this why not make it 40%?

it is a basic tenet of economics - or at least real world economics - is that taxes are a drag on economic growth. they are a necessary evil, but they are an evil just the same. So the answer is in the balance of keeping them as low as possible yet meeting the legitimate needs of govt. Raising taxes is a cheats way of temporarily raising more money but dragging the economy down further. But it is worth noting that cutting expenditure never gets mentioned unless it is about something that affects only the high income earners.

I'd love to see you boofheads explain to low income earners why you are increasing their income tax by 20%.

Another thing that is a drag on the economy is inequality. So let's kill 2 birds with one stone: increase taxes at the highest end where you'll reap most reward with minimal economic damage, and stop trying to cut from the bottom 20%.

There you go, problem solved.

That's not equality. That's targeting a minority. Economic apartheid Cheesy

the minority with majority of the wealth, you mean?

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Swagman Gold Member Offline Beware of cheap imitations...... Posts: 15095 Illawarra NSW Gender:	Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott Reply #53 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax. Better able to pay you say? A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay
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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #54 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:01pm

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm:

The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax.

Better able to pay you say?

A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay Cheesy

The minority that pay the majority of tax because they own the majority of wealth.
And a fitter person generally does work more hours.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #55 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:03pm

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm:

The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax.

Better able to pay you say?

A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay Cheesy

Paying nearly half of your wages in tax is not enough according to piss poor lefties who think we should be taxed even more.

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Redmond Neck

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #56 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:03pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:01pm:

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm:

The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax.

Better able to pay you say?

A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay Cheesy

The minority that pay the majority of tax because they own the majority of wealth.
And a fitter person generally does work more hours.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #57 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:04pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:03pm:

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm:

The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax.

Better able to pay you say?

A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay Cheesy

Paying nearly half of your wages in tax is not enough according to piss poor lefties who think we should be taxed even more.

I'd be happy if top threshold was 50% of wealth, not just income.

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Swagman

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #58 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:05pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:01pm:

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm:

The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax.

Better able to pay you say?

A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay Cheesy

The minority that pay the majority of tax because they own the majority of wealth.

Income is taxed, not wealth.

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:01pm:

And a fitter person generally does work more hours.

Not for the same pay and not forced to do so by Govt.

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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Howards Tax Cuts Undid Abbott
Reply #59 - Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:10pm

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:05pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:01pm:

Swagman wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 1:50pm:

The minority that (already and increasingly) pay the majority of tax.

Better able to pay you say?

A bit like proposing young people are fitter and more able to work longer hours so they should work 60 hour weeks instead of 40 for the same pay Cheesy

The minority that pay the majority of tax because they own the majority of wealth.

Income is taxed, not wealth.

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Jan 3^rd, 2015 at 2:01pm:

And a fitter person generally does work more hours.

Not for the same pay and not forced to do so by Govt.

So what? we are talking about wealth as the key factor for equality.

And government does by not paying welfare to fit people. At least governments that aren't the Howard government who thought everyone ought to have some welfare.

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