Australian Politics Forum - Coal seam Gas is safe

adelcrow

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #30 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:17pm

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

And when every last scrap of CSG is burnt and the pollution sent into the atmosphere?..What then?

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longweekend58

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #31 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:17pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 3:42pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:53pm:

Yes it is seepage due to drilling of course, everybody knows and accepts that.

Then rather than natural seepage start using the term "Seepage due to drilling" & see how many fans that wins.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:53pm:

but unfortunately if you want the rainbow you have to have a little bit of rain

LOL you're good, another analogy that brings to mind pleasant thoughts.

Most use the analogy about omlettes and eggs, but in this case we want no one thinking of breakages do we Wink

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:53pm:

whole world face colossal demands for energy in the next century and we have to find ways to ensure we can deliver that.

And yet Dirty is preferred to Clean.

As you say BOTH require R&D to find ways to ensure you can deliver that.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:53pm:

But regarding the point on regulation.
Industry actually gets things done. Self regulation does work because the industry needs it to work, it lives the processes, it knows what needs to change and the public backlash if it doesnt are hugely damaging.

I see your point but remain skeptical

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:53pm:

Statutory public sector regulation?
Hold an inquiry where everyone pi$$es in each other's pockets, nobody has any balls to make a decision and even when they do its left up to some Minister with zero industry knowledge or experience who has only ever worked in the public sector their whole life....

Totally agree

What is the answer, who knows, ant ex industry with hands on is accused of bias, & as we see time & time again pencil pushers have no idea of reality.

'seepage' is a loaded term and like most, used emotively instead of scientifically. CSG drilling is VERY deep and most of the aquifers is goes thru are not potable water anyhow. Supposed 'damage' to aquifers generally does not happen and when there is 'seepage' it is usally to an aquifer that is deep and unusable anyhow.

FACTS... the one thing the CSG debate is dreadfully short of.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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DaS Energy

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #32 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:21pm

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

Bullshit. Uncontrolled fracking opens up drinking water reserves to pollution!

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longweekend58

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #33 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:24pm

adelcrow wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:17pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

And when every last scrap of CSG is burnt and the pollution sent into the atmosphere?..What then?

what a stupid question. how about you provide one... mind you, you would need an answer for about 200 years so you have some time.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #34 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:24pm

DaS Energy wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:21pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

Bullshit. Uncontrolled fracking opens up drinking water reserves to pollution!

no it doesn't. and unlike you, I actually know what I am talking about.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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DaS Energy

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #35 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:14pm

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:24pm:

DaS Energy wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:21pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

Bullshit. Uncontrolled fracking opens up drinking water reserves to pollution!

no it doesn't. and unlike you, I actually know what I am talking about.

BULLSHIT!

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Swagman

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #36 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:21pm

DaS Energy wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:21pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

Bullshit. Uncontrolled fracking opens up drinking water reserves to pollution!

It also causes the curtains to fade.....and there are reports it was on the Grassy Knoll when JFK was blown away.... Cheesy

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Kytro Gold Member Offline Blasphemy: a victimless crime Posts: 3409 Adelaide Gender:	Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report Reply #37 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:38pm Swagman wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 12:08pm: Lots of cash to be made and jobs to create. Sharpen those drills..... The report does not look at overall environmental impacts of using the product, just extracting it.
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Swagman

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #38 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:43pm

Kytro wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:38pm:

Swagman wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 12:08pm:

Lots of cash to be made and jobs to create. Sharpen those drills.....

The report does not look at overall environmental impacts of using the product, just extracting it.

Cleaner than coal. The treehuggers should be happy instead of whinging.

Just goes to show that the eco-socialists don't give a rat's bum about CO2 emissions they just want to stick up the mining corporations.....their hidden agenda

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perceptions_now

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #39 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:46pm

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:24pm:

DaS Energy wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:21pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:14pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

CSG is safe pre se, but only when proper EXTERNAL regulation and monitoring is done. And what many of you could do well is to go a proper industry course and find out exactly what CSG is and how it operates. Most of the nonsense you get from Lock the Gate and others is opinion without information.

Bullshit. Uncontrolled fracking opens up drinking water reserves to pollution!

no it doesn't. and unlike you, I actually know what I am talking about.

"You know this", because that is what "you believe"?

As with everything, no matter what we are told & who is telling us, it needs to be backed up by what is happening, in the REAL WORLD!

And, the real world is telling us -

Family awarded $3 million in first US fracking trial

After three years of legal wrangling, a Texas family has won its case against a company engaged in hydraulic fracturing near their home. The family, which suffered tangible health deterioration after the fracking began, was awarded $3 million.

A Dallas jury ruled Tuesday in favor of the Parr family, which sued Aruba Petroleum in 2011 after each member of the family noticed a decline in health that, their attorneys argued in court, was the result of dozens of gas wells surrounding their home in Wise County, Texas.

The family was awarded nearly $3 million in what is believed to be the first fracking trial in US history.

The Parrs – Bob, Lisa, and their daughter Emma – said their health suffered beginning just months after hydraulic fracturing, or fracking, operations started in their area, which was in 2008. Lisa said her breathing was impaired, and she was inflicted with nausea and headaches. Bob reported suddenly having around three nosebleeds per week, an anomaly compared to the rest of his life, he said. And Emma also reported nosebleeds, as well as nausea and rashes. She was diagnosed with asthma soon after the drilling began.

“We can’t drink our well water,” Bob Parr told Dallas’ FOX 4 in 2011. “We can’t breathe the air without getting sick.”

The lawsuit was definitely not the first levied against a fracking company over health impacts, though it has been common for plaintiffs in such cases to settle with companies along with agreeing to strict gag orders.

“When evidence of fracking’s impacts are shown to an impartial jury in a court of law, they find them to be real and significant,” Earthworks Energy Program Director Bruce Baizel said in a statement. “And it shows why the fracking industry is reluctant to allow lawsuits of this type to go to trial.”

“We hope this lawsuit will make regulators, in Texas and around the country, reexamine their assumptions about fracking’s dangers, and their responsibility to keep the public safe,” Baizel said.

To unleash natural gas deep underground, fracking requires large volumes of water, sand, and chemicals to be pumped underground. This process has been linked to groundwater contamination, seismic activity, and a laundry list of health concerns for humans and the local environment.

http://rt.com/usa/154408-fracking-trial-family-sued/

Plus more at -
https://www.google.com.au/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=a7srVPeZBOTVmQWZ34DIAQ#q=US+Fracking+Law...

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Lobo

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #40 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:52pm

Swagman wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:43pm:

Kytro wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:38pm:

Swagman wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 12:08pm:

Lots of cash to be made and jobs to create. Sharpen those drills.....

The report does not look at overall environmental impacts of using the product, just extracting it.

Cleaner than coal. The treehuggers should be happy instead of whinging.

Just goes to show that the eco-socialists don't give a rat's bum about CO2 emissions they just want to stick up the mining corporations.....their hidden agenda

I see....
So after they've fracked all the gas out of the coal seam, they're going to leave all that coal in the ground.

How thoughtful of them....

Wink

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"What's in store for me in the direction I don't take?"-Jack Kerouac.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 88844 Proud Old White Australian Man Gender:	Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report Reply #41 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 7:49pm "Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report" Yeah - I'd trust those people any day..... "Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as and often better than - statutory requirements." Pardon me while I stop laughing... might take a while.... SHOW ME......
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John Smith

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #42 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 8:19pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 2:29pm:

Actually self regulation in natural gas extraction is just as good as/ and often better than - statutory requirements.

The industry has been consolidating on extraction techniques and found that by shutting off deep dive valves and pumping all of it through 2 specific channels - we get both more gas and also the natural seepage rates reduce down to negligable amounts - certainly comparable to when the process first began large production.

I'd not do down self-regulation smithy, its certainly not companies doing what they like. The industry has very high standards or safety and public concern.

How'd self regulation go for those south American countries ravaged by oil companies?

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #43 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 10:53pm

longweekend58 wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 5:17pm:

'seepage' is a loaded term and like most, used emotively instead of scientifically. CSG drilling is VERY deep and most of the aquifers is goes thru are not potable water anyhow. Supposed 'damage' to aquifers generally does not happen and when there is 'seepage' it is usally to an aquifer that is deep and unusable anyhow.

FACTS... the one thing the CSG debate is dreadfully short of.

So when a fracking pipe into the deep ground bursts and the aquifer that farms pump water form for their stock etc is polluted - we can say it is just one of those things. Right-O....

BTW - if it is so hazardous that it needs to be so far underground or else - why is it permitted at all?

"Da, da, tovarish - vir testing Cherobyl reactor.. is not bad thing.. needing for keeping check on procedure. Now eating your cheese sandwich."

"Comrade, is true that Strontium 90 replace calcium in food? I am throwing sandwich? Is good?"\

"Nyet! Eating and all is good! No thing is going wrong with testing of Chernobyl! Now pull switch!"

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« Last Edit: Oct 1^st, 2014 at 10:58pm by Sir Grappler Truth Teller OAM »

“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
― John Adams

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Kytro

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Re: Coal seam Gas is safe - Govt report
Reply #44 - Oct 1^st, 2014 at 11:15pm

Swagman wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:43pm:

Kytro wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 6:38pm:

Swagman wrote on Oct 1^st, 2014 at 12:08pm:

Lots of cash to be made and jobs to create. Sharpen those drills.....

The report does not look at overall environmental impacts of using the product, just extracting it.

Cleaner than coal. The treehuggers should be happy instead of whinging.

Just goes to show that the eco-socialists don't give a rat's bum about CO2 emissions they just want to stick up the mining corporations.....their hidden agenda

It's not so hidden, though most environmentalists are against further development of non-renewable sources unless it it is the only option.

Partly due to how mining companies have acted in the past when things go wrong - often denying responsibility and trying to avoid paying for the cleanup.

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