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Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45 (Read 2619 times)
imcrookonit
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Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Jul 23rd, 2014 at 6:42am
 
‘Past it’ over 45s told to retrain

    The Australian
    July 23, 2014


EMPLOYERS regard workers as over the hill at 45, Age Discrimination Commissioner Susan Ryan said yesterday as she criticised Australia’s “deeply ageist’’ culture.      Sad

Warning they risked years on the dole queue, Ms Ryan urged middle-aged workers to retrain and upskill early to prolong their careers.

Four out of 10 workers who lose their job in their 50s or 60s will spend at least two years on the dole, she said.

One in five of the over-50s on Newstart have been out of work for at least four years.      Sad

“People who are 45 should start thinking about the future and check their need to retrain if they are in a dying industry,’’ Ms Ryan told The Australian.

“After 45, it’s harder and harder to find a job.’’

In a speech to be delivered to the CPA Australia in Melbourne today, Ms Ryan will say there is “no point’’ in the federal government raising the pension age to 70 by 2030 without “attitudinal change’’ towards older workers.      Wink

“There is no point requiring people to work longer if age discrimination prevents them from getting a job,’’ her speech will say.    

“Our culture is deeply ageist … age discrimination in the workplace is still a huge problem.

“Given the skills shortages in our economy, and the very low birthrate that means fewer young workers coming on to the market, the failure of business to use the talent pool of older workers is irrational and self-­defeating.’’

Ms Ryan said the over-50s control 40 per cent of Australia’s wealth, with discretionary spending power of $218 billion.

She will meet Australian Public Service Commissioner Stephen Sedgwick this week to push for recruitment targets for over-50s workers, as well as those with disabilities, in government departments.

She said the public service should take the lead in providing career opportunities for disadvantaged workers.

Ms Ryan said older workers were being targeted in redundancy programs.

“When redundancies are offered, there is a fair bit of pressure on people in their 50s and 60s to take one,’’ she said.   Sad

“The unspoken thing is, ‘You’ve had a good run, move over’.

“But it would be better to restructure the person’s job to include a lot of mentoring and training for young people.

“The young person will have the IT skills but young people don’t have the corporate knowledge and client relationship experience that you get when you’ve been working for ­decades.’’
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imcrookonit
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #1 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 6:47am
 
Now hear is a good idea, how about leaving the pension age at 65.  Yes I know it won't happen, put it up to 70.      Angry    
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President Elect, The Mechanic
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #2 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 7:48am
 
like Ms Ryan says..

UPSKILL...

too many people just sit back in their jobs and think that they'll never lose or leave their jobs..

then WHAM...

unemployed and feeling sorry for themselves...

well SKILL UP...

im always looking ahead to see what other jobs are out there and what I would need to get one of those jobs if needed..

I have skilled up over the years to get myself numerous jobs if ever the need... you never know whats just around the corner..
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Q

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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #3 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 8:02am
 
I retrained and moved into a complete different occupation at 56.
I am on reasonable money, it can be done.

But you have to have a good attitude.
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #4 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 10:32am
 
You have to move with the times and re-train/up skill.

I expect I will have to re-train 4-5 times in the next 2-3 decades.
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #5 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:01am
 
It is all well and good to make glib remarks about retraining, but anyone that says that really has no idea what is going on. Unemployed people are least able to retrain to change career even though they are most likely in need of a career change.

Retraining is not a realistic option for the unemployed if they already have other qualifications. Training costs MONEY. Full price must be paid - no subsidies - if other qualifications of equivalent or higher level are already held. Money is a commodity in desperately short supply for the unemployed.

Inability to access retraining due to the prohibitive cost is a major barrier to re-entering the workforce for the unemployed.
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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #6 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:03am
 
Quote:
Now hear is a good idea, how about leaving the pension age at 65.  Yes I know it won't happen, put it up to 70.      Angry    

Or no fixed retirement age, but after 40-45 years in the workforce.
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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #7 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:29am
 
Bam wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:01am:
It is all well and good to make glib remarks about retraining, but anyone that says that really has no idea what is going on. Unemployed people are least able to retrain to change career even though they are most likely in need of a career change.

Retraining is not a realistic option for the unemployed if they already have other qualifications. Training costs MONEY. Full price must be paid - no subsidies - if other qualifications of equivalent or higher level are already held. Money is a commodity in desperately short supply for the unemployed.
Inability to access retraining due to the prohibitive cost is a major barrier to re-entering the workforce for the unemployed.



Not necessarily - I'm doing an apprenticeship, completely unrelated to anything I had done before, and I'm getting paid to do it.
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In the fullness of time...
 
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #8 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:45am
 
Bam wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:03am:
Quote:
Now hear is a good idea, how about leaving the pension age at 65.  Yes I know it won't happen, put it up to 70.      Angry    

Or no fixed retirement age, but after 40-45 years in the workforce.


nice thought but impractical.  how do your define 'in the workforce'? number of hours worked or number of years? full-time or part time?  and anyhow, the retirement age doesn't even exist. it is JUST the age for the pension and nothing more.
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #9 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 1:18pm
 
Quote:
Now hear is a good idea, how about leaving the pension age at 65.  Yes I know it won't happen, put it up to 70.      Angry    


Just reduce it to 45 Crook
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Bam
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #10 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 1:52pm
 
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:45am:
Bam wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:03am:
Quote:
Now hear is a good idea, how about leaving the pension age at 65.  Yes I know it won't happen, put it up to 70.      Angry    

Or no fixed retirement age, but after 40-45 years in the workforce.


nice thought but impractical.  how do your define 'in the workforce'? number of hours worked or number of years? full-time or part time?  and anyhow, the retirement age doesn't even exist. it is JUST the age for the pension and nothing more.

I agree the idea has some holes in it, but the reasoning is simple - someone who has been unemployed waits longer for the pension than someone who has worked continuously. The pension age would be 65 to 70 (with exact age dependent on number of years spent unemployed).

Discuss.
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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #11 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 2:31pm
 
Bam wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 1:52pm:
longweekend58 wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:45am:
Bam wrote on Jul 23rd, 2014 at 11:03am:
Quote:
Now hear is a good idea, how about leaving the pension age at 65.  Yes I know it won't happen, put it up to 70.      Angry    

Or no fixed retirement age, but after 40-45 years in the workforce.


nice thought but impractical.  how do your define 'in the workforce'? number of hours worked or number of years? full-time or part time?  and anyhow, the retirement age doesn't even exist. it is JUST the age for the pension and nothing more.

I agree the idea has some holes in it, but the reasoning is simple - someone who has been unemployed waits longer for the pension than someone who has worked continuously. The pension age would be 65 to 70 (with exact age dependent on number of years spent unemployed).

Discuss.


it is full of holes.  what about the stay-at-home mother who has saved the govt a fortune in childcare rebates and has spent a long time 'unemployed'.  how about defining employment...  does working one hour a month define you as employed for this definition?

I know what you are trying to do but I see no rational or fair method of implementing it. 

And another point... why should it be just the aged pension? why shouldn't ALL welfare payament be depenedant on time in the workforce>?
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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longweekend58
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #12 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 2:42pm
 
or even more importantly, should the vote be denied to all those unemployed or those who have not yet given 10 years of paid employment?
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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."
 
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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #13 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 7:36pm
 
Quote:
‘Past it’ over 45s told to retrain

    The Australian
    July 23, 2014


EMPLOYERS regard workers as over the hill at 45, Age Discrimination Commissioner Susan Ryan said yesterday as she criticised Australia’s “deeply ageist’’ culture.      Sad 
I'm not sure our culture is ageist...  but some people in hiring positions certainly are.


Warning they risked years on the dole queue, Ms Ryan urged middle-aged workers to retrain and upskill early to prolong their careers. 
Early?  like before you know you are going to get dumped?  Or while you are training the Indians who will get your job? Or....  most people have no idea they are going to be axed and when and upskilling is not as simple as some make out...  sometimes it would be downskilling and then your Cv will kill you when they see your upskills there in black and white.


Four out of 10 workers who lose their job in their 50s or 60s will spend at least two years on the dole, she said. 
Or more.
  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

One in five of the over-50s on Newstart have been out of work for at least four years.      Sad
yep or more....


“People who are 45 should start thinking about the future and check their need to retrain if they are in a dying industry,’’ Ms Ryan told The Australian. 
Like what?  IT, no one would think that is a dying industry.  What other industries are going to die in the future?  Got a crystal ball perhaps?


“After 45, it’s harder and harder to find a job.’’ 
Why?  You are still young enough to be fit and active and experienced enough to have skills and a good work ethic.


In a speech to be delivered to the CPA Australia in Melbourne today, Ms Ryan will say there is “no point’’ in the federal government raising the pension age to 70 by 2030 without “attitudinal change’’ towards older workers.      Wink 
yep, but I'm betting it won't happen and that many people now unemployed over 55 will never get a job before retirement age certainly not a full time job.


“There is no point requiring people to work longer if age discrimination prevents them from getting a job,’’ her speech will say. 
 So having stated the bleeding obvious, what is the solution? 


“Our culture is deeply ageist … age discrimination in the workplace is still a huge problem. 
Why? Too many young people in recruitment agencies perhaps?


“Given the skills shortages in our economy, and the very low birthrate that means fewer young workers coming on to the market, the failure of business to use the talent pool of older workers is irrational and self-­defeating.’’
yep but it keeps happening, the question is why...  and the why isn't just some vague term like culture.


Ms Ryan said the over-50s control 40 per cent of Australia’s wealth, with discretionary spending power of $218 billion. 
Not if they are unemployed....


She will meet Australian Public Service Commissioner Stephen Sedgwick this week to push for recruitment targets for over-50s workers, as well as those with disabilities, in government departments.
LOL, good luck with that.


She said the public service should take the lead in providing career opportunities for disadvantaged workers. 
By doing what?


Ms Ryan said older workers were being targeted in redundancy programs. 
As per usual...


“When redundancies are offered, there is a fair bit of pressure on people in their 50s and 60s to take one,’’ she said.   Sad 
And these days unless they have a nest egg and financial security already mapped out till retirement they would be stupid to take it.


“The unspoken thing is, ‘You’ve had a good run, move over’. 
They mean roll over...  and die.


“But it would be better to restructure the person’s job to include a lot of mentoring and training for young people. 
Oh dear....


“The young person will have the IT skills
oh dear...
but young people don’t have the corporate knowledge and client relationship experience that you get when you’ve been working for ­decades.’’ 
Nice bit of stereotyping and short sightedness... and she's supposed to be helping the older worker?

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Re: Past It, Your Over The Hill At Age 45
Reply #14 - Jul 23rd, 2014 at 7:49pm
 
Maybe we need to re-train 'employers' so that they actually have the skills and abilities to see what is a valuable contribution and what is not.

I've seen 'managers' come and go - they all have no idea.

Maybe the entire enterprise would be better off without them.

The greatest 'skills deficiency' is with management - you need only look at the Australian government to know that.  Think how many jobs could be created by getting rid of those useless mouths in the middle and actually employing people who will simply do the job.

We went off the rails here and elsewhere by relying on book larnin'....
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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