Australian Politics Forum - Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British

OldnCrusty

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #60 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:45pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:24pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:17pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 6:42pm:

You along with Abbott are classifying unsettled in very narrow westernised terms.
Aboriginals were prior invasion, more evolved than current Australians.

of course they were, marrying 8 year old girls, killing infants as a method of population control, circumcision practises which agonisingly killed 1 in 10. Mass extermination of species due to hunting practises which basically involved starting bushfires to catch their prey. No written language, no wheel, never invented any musical instrument because they couldnt work out to put holes in a hollowed out tree limb. At least housing was cheap.

40,000 plus years on a functioning society on the board compared to 200 years and a major extinction occurring around us, a spiritually vacant and divided society to boot.

40,000 plus years on a barely functioning society compared to 200 years to establish one of the best democracy, richest equitable economies, healthiest longest living, happiest most egalitarian society on Earth.

(There has been a few failures where some individuals despite an abundance of riches who became manic depressive pessimists Roll Eyes

)

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #61 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:47pm

polite_gandalf wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 5:52pm:

Lionel Edriess wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 5:30pm:

Gee! Just like the colonisation of Europe, the Americas, England before it became Britain or the UK, Spain, Germany, China - etc.

Key difference, the indigenous population in those other countries are not still suffering as a result of the invasions.

Remedying the suffering of the Aborigines is directly related to acknowledging and addressing the enormous destruction wrought by the invasion and occupation of their land.

In short, Tony's comments just perpetuates the problem.

Oh, so it was all roses before whitey turned up? Romantic fantasy. Theır life was barbaric and violent.

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adelcrow Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20133 everywhere Gender:	Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British Reply #62 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:48pm Wow...Abbott is a racist git...really..whose surprised?
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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #63 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:49pm

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:43pm:

Aussie wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 5:09pm:

Dear Tony,

We owe our existence to an invasion of an occupied Land, easy military defeat of the Natives, appalling subsequent treatment of them, and British Colonisation.

Yours faithfully,

Aussie.

Feel free to hand over your house and land and disposable income every week to some Abo's.

Being honest about a situation is not hoisting the white flag and surrendering ... it's a step in the right direction if finding a solution with the highest intent for all is centre of the agenda.

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OldnCrusty

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #64 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:54pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:39pm:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:32pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:14pm:

Your queen apologies for the atrocities committed against my people. Seems she isn't as proud as you are.

How long before Aboriginals receive a similar apology.

You can give the aboriginals as many specific and heartfelt apologies as you like and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

You can give the aboriginals a $1mil each and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

I want all Australians to be happy and successful. This current Us and Them history, the Racist whites versus the Good Peaceful Bush Custodian Aboriginal diatribe is not helpful. The truth of the matter it is just part of the human story with all its human failing. Build a bridge and get over it; address the current issues, fix the current issues and move on.

Ignoring the core issues doesn't serve any purpose besides showing the naivety of the party.

-How about guaranteeing Aboriginals a couple of seats in the senate, Senators voted in by Aboriginals.
-All parties designing a treaty
etc etc.

What core issue? The issue you want? The issue the Aboriginals define? And I suppose you are going to tell me if we rewrite history so the aboriginals are the good guys and the White guy are evil racist bastards then the aboriginal will live happily ever after.

"-How about guaranteeing Aboriginals a couple of seats in the senate, Senators voted in by Aboriginals."
Because they are just Australians like every one else. Or do you think I've got a great claim over Australia's wealth and the govt's attention than the last refugee off a boat.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #65 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:57pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:49pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:43pm:

Aussie wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 5:09pm:

Dear Tony,

We owe our existence to an invasion of an occupied Land, easy military defeat of the Natives, appalling subsequent treatment of them, and British Colonisation.

Yours faithfully,

Aussie.

Feel free to hand over your house and land and disposable income every week to some Abo's.

Being honest about a situation is not hoisting the white flag and surrendering ... it's a step in the right direction if finding a solution with the highest intent for all is centre of the agenda.

Just as I thought, you'll do anything to avoid handing over your "stolen" items. But, that's not what this is about, is it. It's about some perceived moral suporiority. Some how, trendies have convinced themselves that feeling guilt over some past "injustice" makes them better human beings while doing nothing about ammending that guilt. Somehow, you can feel really, really good about feeling really, really bad. Cheesy

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austranger

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #66 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:57pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:39pm:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:32pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:14pm:

Your queen apologies for the atrocities committed against my people. Seems she isn't as proud as you are.

How long before Aboriginals receive a similar apology.

You can give the aboriginals as many specific and heartfelt apologies as you like and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

You can give the aboriginals a $1mil each and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

I want all Australians to be happy and successful. This current Us and Them history, the Racist whites versus the Good Peaceful Bush Custodian Aboriginal diatribe is not helpful. The truth of the matter it is just part of the human story with all its human failing. Build a bridge and get over it; address the current issues, fix the current issues and move on.

Ignoring the core issues doesn't serve any purpose besides showing the naivety of the party.

-How about guaranteeing Aboriginals a couple of seats in the senate, Senators voted in by Aboriginals.
-All parties designing a treaty
etc etc.

Sorry Greeny, that's RACIST!

History simply is, you can't rewrite it. Our ancestors did what was common at the time, the Indig' did what they did at the time, and the result is the Australia we have today.
I see no logical reason why Indig' should be put above the rest of us, what next, recognition in the Constitution for each culture and race that helped form Oz?
Most of their problems today have been and are self inflicted, we've thrown literally $BILLIONS$ at them to no avail. Until such time as the Indig take control for and of themselves then there is no way anyone can force them to grow up and come into the 21st century with the rest of us.
Unlike the majority here I've been there and done that, I've seen their lives close up and personal, and I've talked at length to their Elders and losers, their city ones and country mobs. There's a good wave of progress starting out there, very slowly, hard to see, two steps forward and one back all the time, but it does exist. It's being resisted by the losers and no-hopers of course, and hijacked left right and centre by all the power hungry or blind and stupid, but it's a beginning that will in time succeed, I hope.
The most common wish amongst those starters is that all the do-gooders and idealists and apologists would just shut the f**k up and get out of their way!
I wish them luck!

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Lionel Edriess

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #67 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:58pm

Jesus, what's so hard about it!

We won, they lost, so drink a big cup of cement, harden the f-up and get on with it!

We've already said sorry, there's no work in the bush (whether you're black OR white) and school doesn't prepare you for the real world.

Let's face it, if you live in Kikatinalong, you'll never get a job irrespective of colour. If you're over 50, it's unlikely you'll get another job - irrespective of colour.

Welcome to the real world.

Sheesh!

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Toughen up, Australia!

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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #68 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:01pm

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:45pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:24pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:17pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 6:42pm:

You along with Abbott are classifying unsettled in very narrow westernised terms.
Aboriginals were prior invasion, more evolved than current Australians.

of course they were, marrying 8 year old girls, killing infants as a method of population control, circumcision practises which agonisingly killed 1 in 10. Mass extermination of species due to hunting practises which basically involved starting bushfires to catch their prey. No written language, no wheel, never invented any musical instrument because they couldnt work out to put holes in a hollowed out tree limb. At least housing was cheap.

40,000 plus years on a functioning society on the board compared to 200 years and a major extinction occurring around us, a spiritually vacant and divided society to boot.

40,000 plus years on a barely functioning society compared to 200 years to establish one of the best democracy, richest equitable economies, healthiest longest living, happiest most egalitarian society on Earth.

(There has been a few failures where some individuals despite an abundance of riches who became manic depressive pessimists Roll Eyes

)

We are far from rich since the current wealth is illusionary and temporary. It's like pinching someone else's credit card and using it to promote a false lifestyle.

Best democratic ... it's rife with financial crime.

Long living, how is that a measure of quality of society when we shove aged people into homes and starve them of food and love. Some, their only treat are kerosine baths.

Happiest ... bull. We have a society who have their heads down on phones so to avoid conversation.

Egalitarian ... we are funding concentration camps, and sending refugees back to be killed. We demonise minority groups ... we have a government attempting to divide this society and turn it on itself.

Sorry I don't have a pair of rose coloured glasses.

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Aussie

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #69 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:02pm

Lionel Edriess wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:58pm:

Jesus, what's so hard about it!

We won, they lost, so drink a big cup of cement, harden the f-up and get on with it!

We've already said sorry, there's no work in the bush (whether you're black OR white) and school doesn't prepare you for the real world.

Let's face it, if you live in Kikatinalong, you'll never get a job irrespective of colour. If you're over 50, it's unlikely you'll get another job - irrespective of colour.

Welcome to the real world.

Sheesh!

Yeas, all of that is true Mr Lionel, but what Abbott said (which is what this Thread is about) is not.

Quote:

"I guess our country owes its existence to a form of foreign investment by the British government in the then unsettled or, um, scarcely settled, Great South Land."

That is crap, and takes us back to pre Mabo and into the Howard era of denial.

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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #70 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:06pm

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:54pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:39pm:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:32pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:14pm:

Your queen apologies for the atrocities committed against my people. Seems she isn't as proud as you are.

How long before Aboriginals receive a similar apology.

You can give the aboriginals as many specific and heartfelt apologies as you like and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

You can give the aboriginals a $1mil each and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

I want all Australians to be happy and successful. This current Us and Them history, the Racist whites versus the Good Peaceful Bush Custodian Aboriginal diatribe is not helpful. The truth of the matter it is just part of the human story with all its human failing. Build a bridge and get over it; address the current issues, fix the current issues and move on.

Ignoring the core issues doesn't serve any purpose besides showing the naivety of the party.

-How about guaranteeing Aboriginals a couple of seats in the senate, Senators voted in by Aboriginals.
-All parties designing a treaty
etc etc.

What core issue? The issue you want? The issue the Aboriginals define? And I suppose you are going to tell me if we rewrite history so the aboriginals are the good guys and the White guy are evil racist bastards then the aboriginal will live happily ever after.

"-How about guaranteeing Aboriginals a couple of seats in the senate, Senators voted in by Aboriginals."
Because they are just Australians like every one else. Or do you think I've got a great claim over Australia's wealth and the govt's attention than the last refugee off a boat.

Core issues I suspect what they are yet Aboriginals are probably better to speak for themselves.

As for Aboriginals electing their own senators, Where is your flexibility. Does everything have to be to your rules?

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aquascoot Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 38143 Gender:	Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British Reply #71 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:09pm Morrison needs to run a resettlement program for non patriots
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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #72 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:13pm

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:57pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:49pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:43pm:

Aussie wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 5:09pm:

Dear Tony,

We owe our existence to an invasion of an occupied Land, easy military defeat of the Natives, appalling subsequent treatment of them, and British Colonisation.

Yours faithfully,

Aussie.

Feel free to hand over your house and land and disposable income every week to some Abo's.

Being honest about a situation is not hoisting the white flag and surrendering ... it's a step in the right direction if finding a solution with the highest intent for all is centre of the agenda.

Just as I thought, you'll do anything to avoid handing over your "stolen" items. But, that's not what this is about, is it. It's about some perceived moral suporiority. Some how, trendies have convinced themselves that feeling guilt over some past "injustice" makes them better human beings while doing nothing about ammending that guilt. Somehow, you can feel really, really good about feeling really, really bad. Cheesy

I'm a tree hugging socialist ... happy for everything to be owned by the society if that is a step in our evolution. Handing over my current trinkets is not a prerequisite in having a position within this thread. How about debating the topic rather than debating who should debate the topic.

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Postmodern Trendoid III

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #73 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:15pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:13pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:57pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:49pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:43pm:

Aussie wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 5:09pm:

Dear Tony,

We owe our existence to an invasion of an occupied Land, easy military defeat of the Natives, appalling subsequent treatment of them, and British Colonisation.

Yours faithfully,

Aussie.

Feel free to hand over your house and land and disposable income every week to some Abo's.

Being honest about a situation is not hoisting the white flag and surrendering ... it's a step in the right direction if finding a solution with the highest intent for all is centre of the agenda.

Just as I thought, you'll do anything to avoid handing over your "stolen" items. But, that's not what this is about, is it. It's about some perceived moral suporiority. Some how, trendies have convinced themselves that feeling guilt over some past "injustice" makes them better human beings while doing nothing about ammending that guilt. Somehow, you can feel really, really good about feeling really, really bad. Cheesy

I'm a tree hugging socialist ... happy for everything to be owned by the society if that is a step in our evolution. Handing over my current trinkets is not a prerequisite in having a position within this thread. How about debating the topic rather than debating who should debate the topic.

I am debating the topic. Trendies need to lead by example. It's the next logical step. If what you own is not really yours, then give it back.

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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #74 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:19pm

austranger wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:57pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:39pm:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:32pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 7:14pm:

Your queen apologies for the atrocities committed against my people. Seems she isn't as proud as you are.

How long before Aboriginals receive a similar apology.

You can give the aboriginals as many specific and heartfelt apologies as you like and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

You can give the aboriginals a $1mil each and they'll have five minutes with a warm inner glow and wake to the same problems they have now.

I want all Australians to be happy and successful. This current Us and Them history, the Racist whites versus the Good Peaceful Bush Custodian Aboriginal diatribe is not helpful. The truth of the matter it is just part of the human story with all its human failing. Build a bridge and get over it; address the current issues, fix the current issues and move on.

Ignoring the core issues doesn't serve any purpose besides showing the naivety of the party.

-How about guaranteeing Aboriginals a couple of seats in the senate, Senators voted in by Aboriginals.
-All parties designing a treaty
etc etc.

Sorry Greeny, that's RACIST!

History simply is, you can't rewrite it. Our ancestors did what was common at the time, the Indig' did what they did at the time, and the result is the Australia we have today.
I see no logical reason why Indig' should be put above the rest of us, what next, recognition in the Constitution for each culture and race that helped form Oz?
Most of their problems today have been and are self inflicted, we've thrown literally $BILLIONS$ at them to no avail. Until such time as the Indig take control for and of themselves then there is no way anyone can force them to grow up and come into the 21st century with the rest of us.
Unlike the majority here I've been there and done that, I've seen their lives close up and personal, and I've talked at length to their Elders and losers, their city ones and country mobs. There's a good wave of progress starting out there, very slowly, hard to see, two steps forward and one back all the time, but it does exist. It's being resisted by the losers and no-hopers of course, and hijacked left right and centre by all the power hungry or blind and stupid, but it's a beginning that will in time succeed, I hope.
The most common wish amongst those starters is that all the do-gooders and idealists and apologists would just shut the f**k up and get out of their way!
I wish them luck!

History is always written by the victors and so are not a true reflection of what actually occurred.
Part of the issue is Aboriginals are voiceless and by cementing one or two senator seats would be a step in the direction of setting up a situation where we all can be working to a common aim rather than working against each other.

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