Australian Politics Forum - Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British

ian

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #105 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:00pm

Enquiring mind wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:52pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:13pm:

40,000 years of stagnant progress. Do you think their life expectancy would be any higher if we added another 200 years to the 40,000? You think they would have invented penicillin?

Most of the Eora Sydney Aboriginal population died from smallpox.

Penicillin didn’t do them much good.

and yet their life expectancy is around 65 now. Despite their decisions to make appalling lifestyle choices. Im a realist, cultural collision was inevitable as a result of inevitable colonisation. The stronger culture took over the weaker one, what is strong about the aboriginal culture will survive and will become part of our australian culture. Pretending that aboriginal culture was something that it wasnt doesnt serve their future, the future is assimilation.

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ian

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #106 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:01pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:57pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:54pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:27pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:13pm:

40,000 years of stagnant progress. Do you think their life expectancy would be any higher if we added another 200 years to the 40,000? You think they would have invented penicillin?

'Stagnant progress' is a judgement call. Aboriginals appear to have a grip on death superior to most westerners. A better grip due to their more worldly evolved view.

I know which future I would prefer, what about you? Short harsh brutal life or your current one?

I would rather a connected community with strong links to the environment and a deep spirituality. So I would prefer the more evolved one thanks.

I see. you refuse to answer the question.

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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #107 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:01pm

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:57pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:06pm:

As for Aboriginals electing their own senators, Where is your flexibility. Does everything have to be to your rules?

These matters need rules and the rules need to based on principle. And the principle here is all citizens have the same standing, the same rights and the same vote. Giving aboriginals their own their own senators would obviously give them rights and powers greater than their fellow citizens and I and every other Australian would in principle be opposed to that.

*Equality for all

*as long as I have a bigger chuck of it.

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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British Reply #108 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:03pm Poor deluded little Greenswine has never heard of; ATSIC or Senator Neville Bonner, Aden Ridgeway, Ken Wyatt, Nova Peris or Ernie Bridge, John Ah Kit, Neville Perkins and many others besides. Anytime you feel like addressing the major points go right ahead Greenswine.
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Grendel Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 28080 Gender:	Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British Reply #109 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:06pm Aboriginals can run for preselection right now... Greenswine. You should know that even though you seem to not know of Neville Bonner and the rest.
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____

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #110 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:08pm

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:01pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:57pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:54pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:27pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:13pm:

40,000 years of stagnant progress. Do you think their life expectancy would be any higher if we added another 200 years to the 40,000? You think they would have invented penicillin?

'Stagnant progress' is a judgement call. Aboriginals appear to have a grip on death superior to most westerners. A better grip due to their more worldly evolved view.

I know which future I would prefer, what about you? Short harsh brutal life or your current one?

I would rather a connected community with strong links to the environment and a deep spirituality. So I would prefer the more evolved one thanks.

I see. you refuse to answer the question.

I reject your perimeters. A short life is of no issue in my reality since I view death as an illusion. Life is always life and so can not be short unless it's under the conditions of an illusion. And B, brutal is a judgement call and the description could be applied to any of the two groups depending on how one want's to manipulate their argument.

Bottom line, I did answer. You just didn't accept my decision.

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progressiveslol Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 17029	Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British Reply #111 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:31pm ____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:54pm: progressiveslol wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:51pm: Unsettled by the British. You lefties cant be helped. You are nothing but fwits. night on the grog? im happy for you.... na, whatever.
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ian

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #112 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:34pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:01pm:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:57pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:06pm:

As for Aboriginals electing their own senators, Where is your flexibility. Does everything have to be to your rules?

These matters need rules and the rules need to based on principle. And the principle here is all citizens have the same standing, the same rights and the same vote. Giving aboriginals their own their own senators would obviously give them rights and powers greater than their fellow citizens and I and every other Australian would in principle be opposed to that.

*Equality for all

*as long as I have a bigger chuck of it.

aboriginals have greater opportunities than the rest of us.

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ian

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #113 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:35pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:08pm:

[
I reject your perimeters. A short life is of no issue in my reality since I view death as an illusion. Life is always life and so can not be short unless it's under the conditions of an illusion. And B, brutal is a judgement call and the description could be applied to any of the two groups depending on how one want's to manipulate their argument.

Bottom line, I did answer. You just didn't accept my decision.

I see. You refuse to answer the question.

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Enquiring mind

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #114 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:47pm

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:52pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:21pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:13pm:

40,000 years of stagnant progress. Do you think their life expectancy would be any higher if we added another 200 years to the 40,000? You think they would have invented penicillin?

Life expectancy has risen in every country in the world since 1788.

Penicillin was cultivated by American scientists in the 1940s. Antibiotics are now in every country.

Do you think Aborigines would not have modernised along with every other population in the Asia-Pacific region?

No, I dont think 40,200 years would have seen any more progress than 40,000 without western settlement. Their lives were short, harsh and brutal, that wouldnt have changed.

So were the Celts. So were the Angles and Saxons. For that matter, so were the Romans.

China has never had Western settlement. How do you explain their rise and fall and rise again?

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OldnCrusty

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #115 - Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:56pm

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:01pm:

OldnCrusty wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:57pm:

____ wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 8:06pm:

As for Aboriginals electing their own senators, Where is your flexibility. Does everything have to be to your rules?

These matters need rules and the rules need to based on principle. And the principle here is all citizens have the same standing, the same rights and the same vote. Giving aboriginals their own their own senators would obviously give them rights and powers greater than their fellow citizens and I and every other Australian would in principle be opposed to that.

*Equality for all

*as long as I have a bigger chuck of it.

Eh?

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Enquiring mind

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #116 - Jul 5^th, 2014 at 12:32am

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 11:00pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:52pm:

ian wrote on Jul 4^th, 2014 at 10:13pm:

40,000 years of stagnant progress. Do you think their life expectancy would be any higher if we added another 200 years to the 40,000? You think they would have invented penicillin?

Most of the Eora Sydney Aboriginal population died from smallpox.

Penicillin didn’t do them much good.

and yet their life expectancy is around 65 now. Despite their decisions to make appalling lifestyle choices. Im a realist, cultural collision was inevitable as a result of inevitable colonisation. The stronger culture took over the weaker one, what is strong about the aboriginal culture will survive and will become part of our australian culture. Pretending that aboriginal culture was something that it wasnt doesnt serve their future, the future is assimilation.

By this measure, the Indonesians are the stronger culture because they have a bigger army.

Aboriginal culture was a lot of things, as was 18th century British culture. Neither was perfect or evil.

One just happened to borrow gunpowder from the Chinese before the other.

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adelcrow Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 20133 everywhere Gender:	Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British Reply #117 - Jul 5^th, 2014 at 6:31am Whether modern Aboriginals are their own worst enemies or not isn't the point..Abbott has lied again.
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OldnCrusty

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #118 - Jul 5^th, 2014 at 6:52am

adelcrow wrote on Jul 5^th, 2014 at 6:31am:

Whether modern Aboriginals are their own worst enemies or not isn't the point..Abbott has lied again.

Gee, if the Mad Monk ever comes within cooee of me I will yelling "Liar Liar" at him but what part of the statement in question is a lie?

Maybe a poor choice of a descriptive, both politically and factually, but it is very close to the facts of history and the gist is absolute correct; Britain made an enormous foreign investment into Australia to get things started.

(Britain's motivation and the connect to the context of modern foreign investment is dubious and doubtful, and the logic of the illustration in the Mad Monk's speech is questionable and bizarre, but a lie?)

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OldnCrusty

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Re: Abbott Claims Oz Unsettled B4 British
Reply #119 - Jul 5^th, 2014 at 6:59am

Enquiring mind wrote on Jul 5^th, 2014 at 12:32am:

By this measure, the Indonesians are the stronger culture because they have a bigger army.

Military strength is a very small part of a nation's culture.

Enquiring mind wrote on Jul 5^th, 2014 at 12:32am:

Aboriginal culture was a lot of things, as was 18th century British culture. Neither was perfect or evil.

Enquiring mind wrote on Jul 5^th, 2014 at 12:32am:

One just happened to borrow gunpowder from the Chinese before the other.

Gunpower had nothing to do with the military victory of western culture over the aboriginals nor any other native population. The military victory was the organisational and logistical ability to raise, maintain, transport and sustain long periods of operations.

The same reason Australia could go toe to toe with Indonesia today and probably prevail. Wink

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