Australian Politics Forum - An insider’s story of the global attack on science

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #15 - Jan 28^th, 2014 at 2:12pm

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 8:11am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 6:34am:

Attack on science continues:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/el-nino-tracking-system-in...

It isn’t even to do with AGW, just the La Nina/El Nino cycles.

But anything to do with “climate” or “science” gets attacked these days.

Even good science starts to get splash back when you start dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire and start passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology. What did you really think was going to happen?

Here we go again. It's all a conspiracy. Of course it is. Must be. Roll Eyes

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namnugenot

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #16 - Jan 28^th, 2014 at 3:58pm

# wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 2:12pm:

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 8:11am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 6:34am:

Attack on science continues:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/el-nino-tracking-system-in...

It isn’t even to do with AGW, just the La Nina/El Nino cycles.

But anything to do with “climate” or “science” gets attacked these days.

Even good science starts to get splash back when you start dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire and start passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology. What did you really think was going to happen?

Here we go again. It's all a conspiracy. Of course it is. Must be. Roll Eyes

No you're thinking about the global conspiracy against "science".

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #17 - Jan 29^th, 2014 at 10:47am

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 3:58pm:

# wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 2:12pm:

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 8:11am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 6:34am:

Attack on science continues:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/el-nino-tracking-system-in...

It isn’t even to do with AGW, just the La Nina/El Nino cycles.

But anything to do with “climate” or “science” gets attacked these days.

Even good science starts to get splash back when you start dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire and start passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology. What did you really think was going to happen?

Here we go again. It's all a conspiracy. Of course it is. Must be. Roll Eyes

No you're thinking about the global conspiracy against "science".

I presume you're talking about your: "dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire" and "passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology", which are opinions, none of which you can substantiate. Can you?

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namnugenot

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #18 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:13pm

# wrote on Jan 29^th, 2014 at 10:47am:

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 3:58pm:

# wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 2:12pm:

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 8:11am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 6:34am:

Attack on science continues:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/el-nino-tracking-system-in...

It isn’t even to do with AGW, just the La Nina/El Nino cycles.

But anything to do with “climate” or “science” gets attacked these days.

Even good science starts to get splash back when you start dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire and start passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology. What did you really think was going to happen?

Here we go again. It's all a conspiracy. Of course it is. Must be. Roll Eyes

No you're thinking about the global conspiracy against "science".

I presume you're talking about your: "dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire" and "passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology", which are opinions, none of which you can substantiate. Can you?

That's just for AG Warmists dishonest enough to classify the hodgepoge of faith, conjecture, supposition, ranting and wild speculation as to causation or effects passed off as "facts" as "science". To which my comment applies in full. You want everyone to accept your position while offering zero substantiation and in the same breath as requiring proof to negating something you yourself can't prove. But you see conspirators and blasphemers against your faith everywhere. Roll Eyes

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lee

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #19 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm

# wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2014 at 10:59am:

A decade later, in 1991-92 while at the NZ Meteorological Service, I revised the 7SS using a new homogenisation approach to make New Zealand’s temperature records more accurate, such as adjusting for when temperature gauges were moved to new sites.

A new paper on homogenisation

'Effect of data homogenization on estimate of temperature
trend: a case of Huairou station in Beijing Municipality

Abstract
Daily minimum temperature (Tmin) and maximum
temperature (Tmax) data of Huairou station in Beijing from
1960 to 2008 are examined and adjusted for inhomogeneities
by applying the data of two nearby reference stations. Urban
effects on the linear trends of the original and adjusted tem-
perature series are estimated and compared. Results show that
relocations of station cause obvious discontinuities in the data
series, and one of the discontinuities for Tmin are highly
significant when the station was moved from downtown to
suburb in 1996. The daily Tmin and Tmax data are adjusted
for the inhomogeneities. The mean annual Tmin and Tmax at
Huairou station drop by 1.377°C and 0.271°C respectively
after homogenization. The adjustments for Tmin are larger
than those for Tmax, especially in winter, and the seasonal
differences of the adjustments are generally more obvious for
Tmin than for Tmax. Urban effects on annual mean Tmin and
Tmax trends are
−
0.004°C/10 year and
−
0.035°C/10 year
respectively for the original data, but they increase to
0.388°C/10 year and 0.096°C/10 year respectively for the
adjusted data. The increase is more significant for the annual
mean Tmin series. Urban contributions to the overall trends of
annual mean Tmin and Tmax reach 100% and 28.8% respec-
tively for the adjusted data. Our analysis shows that data
homogenization for the stations moved from downtowns to
suburbs can lead to a significant overestimate of rising trends
of surface air temperature, and this necessitates a careful
evaluation and adjustment for urban biases before the data
are applied in analyses of local and regional climate change.'

http://download.springer.com/static/pdf/243/art%253A10.1007%252Fs00704-013-0894-...
my bold

So homogenisation of data is not necessarily a good thing.

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #20 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:54pm

namnugenot wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:13pm:

# wrote on Jan 29^th, 2014 at 10:47am:

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 3:58pm:

# wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 2:12pm:

namnugenot wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 8:11am:

St George of the Garden wrote on Jan 28^th, 2014 at 6:34am:

Attack on science continues:

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/el-nino-tracking-system-in...

It isn’t even to do with AGW, just the La Nina/El Nino cycles.

But anything to do with “climate” or “science” gets attacked these days.

Even good science starts to get splash back when you start dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire and start passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology. What did you really think was going to happen?

Here we go again. It's all a conspiracy. Of course it is. Must be. Roll Eyes

No you're thinking about the global conspiracy against "science".

I presume you're talking about your: "dressing up self interest in dodgey lab coats for hire" and "passing of sleight of hand as the result of scientific methodology", which are opinions, none of which you can substantiate. Can you?

That's just for AG Warmists dishonest enough to classify the hodgepoge of faith, conjecture, supposition, ranting and wild speculation as to causation or effects passed off as "facts" as "science". To which my comment applies in full. You want everyone to accept your position while offering zero substantiation and in the same breath as requiring proof to negating something you yourself can't prove. But you see conspirators and blasphemers against your faith everywhere. Roll Eyes

Acknowledging my own limitations, I accept the judgement of the best qualified. You, on the other hand, seem convinced that the best qualified are all involved in something nasty.

You've never revealed your qualifications, that you have such insight.

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #21 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

# wrote on Jan 23^rd, 2014 at 10:59am:

A decade later, in 1991-92 while at the NZ Meteorological Service, I revised the 7SS using a new homogenisation approach to make New Zealand’s temperature records more accurate, such as adjusting for when temperature gauges were moved to new sites.

[snip heaps of stuff that neither of us truly understands]

So homogenisation of data is not necessarily a good thing.

Good, bad, necessary; what do you think?

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lee

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #22 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:07pm

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

snip heaps of stuff that neither of us truly understands]

'lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

Our analysis shows that data
homogenization for the stations moved from downtowns to
suburbs can lead to a significant overestimate of rising trends
of surface air temperature

I am sorry you didn't understand this. I can't make it simpler.

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #23 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:14pm

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:07pm:

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

snip heaps of stuff that neither of us truly understands]

'lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

Our analysis shows that data
homogenization for the stations moved from downtowns to
suburbs can lead to a significant overestimate of rising trends
of surface air temperature

I am sorry you didn't understand this. I can't make it simpler.

Do you understand the difference between possibility and probability?

Care to answer the question? # wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

...
So homogenisation of data is not necessarily a good thing.

Good, bad, necessary; what do you think?

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lee

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #24 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:35pm

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:14pm:

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:07pm:

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

snip heaps of stuff that neither of us truly understands]

'lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

Our analysis shows that data
homogenization for the stations moved from downtowns to
suburbs can lead to a significant overestimate of rising trends
of surface air temperature

I am sorry you didn't understand this. I can't make it simpler.

Do you understand the difference between possibility and probability?

Care to answer the question? # wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

...
So homogenisation of data is not necessarily a good thing.

Good, bad, necessary; what do you think?

So Climate Science can only use can, could, should in terms of proving AGW bur not in terms of questioning the data? Rather odd.

Homogenisation can be a good or bad thing - neither makes it necessary.

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #25 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:39pm

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:35pm:

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:14pm:

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 2:07pm:

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

snip heaps of stuff that neither of us truly understands]

'lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

Our analysis shows that data
homogenization for the stations moved from downtowns to
suburbs can lead to a significant overestimate of rising trends
of surface air temperature

I am sorry you didn't understand this. I can't make it simpler.

Do you understand the difference between possibility and probability?

Care to answer the question? # wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:57pm:

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 1:29pm:

...
So homogenisation of data is not necessarily a good thing.

Good, bad, necessary; what do you think?

So Climate Science can only use could, should in terms of proving AGW bur not in terms of questioning the data? Rather odd.

Homogenisation can be a good or bad thing - neither makes it necessary.

You seem to be saying that homogenisation is unnecessary. Can you substantiate that?

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21599 Gender:	Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science Reply #26 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:50pm # wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:39pm: You seem to be saying that homogenisation is unnecessary. Can you substantiate that? My opinion. Can you validate yours, whatever it is?
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#

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #27 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 7:41pm

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:50pm:

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 3:39pm:

You seem to be saying that homogenisation is unnecessary. Can you substantiate that?

My opinion. Can you validate yours, whatever it is?

The OP does that pretty well. You even quoted part of the reason. What exactly is your objection?

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lee Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21599 Gender:	Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science Reply #28 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 8:12pm # wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 7:41pm: The OP does that pretty well. You even quoted part of the reason. What exactly is your objection? So you believe an OP over a peer reviewed paper? That explains it.
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#

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Re: An insider’s story of the global attack on science
Reply #29 - Jan 30^th, 2014 at 8:36pm

lee wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 8:12pm:

# wrote on Jan 30^th, 2014 at 7:41pm:

The OP does that pretty well. You even quoted part of the reason. What exactly is your objection?

So you believe an OP over a peer reviewed paper? That explains it.

What peer reviewed paper say that homogenisation is unnecessary?

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