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How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty. (Read 11999 times)
Swagman
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #30 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:21pm
 
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:01pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Yes and as it's now 2014 so even the youngest child would now be at least 24 years old so nobody should be living in poverty.... 


that doesn't make your comment any more correct .. it was wrong before your pissy excuse, and its wrong after it.


What pissy excuse would you be referring to?

It was Bob Hawke's words not mine.  I guess Bob was indeed 'pissy' plenty of times so you're half right.
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Swagman
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #31 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:32pm
 
Gnads wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 11:30am:
Swagman wrote on Jan 2nd, 2014 at 3:44pm:
Laugh till you cry wrote on Jan 2nd, 2014 at 3:06pm:
Abbotts and their ilk don't want the wretched to ever have a positive cash flow and a savings balance, otherwise Abbotts and their ilk will lose control over the wretched and the ship of state would become unstable from loss of ballast


Actually the opposite is more true.

Shorten and his ilk don't want the wretched to ever have a positive cash flow and a savings balance otherwise they would have no one to pitch their socialism to.

Abbott's Ilk is the minority that pay the majority of tax but it's the majority that pay the minority of tax that in effect rule in our flawed democracy (Ochlocracy actually)

Abbott and his ilk are slaves of the masses.


Now that is pizz funny .... Roll Eyes they have more outs for minimising (dodging) tax than any PAYG working class people.



It's funny but it's true.

The top 25 per cent of income earners pay 67.9 per cent of net income tax.  (Source ATO 2010-2011 Tax stats)

Arguably, the top 25% are "Abbott and his ilk"

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Sir lastnail
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #32 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:46pm
 
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:07pm:
Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 10:16am:
yes they claim interest payments and other expenses against the income from their totally unrelated day jobs


income and expenses are not split into categories ... total expenses come off total income .. you should learn how our tax system works. If you work as a teacher earning $80k a year, and moonlight as a stripper earning another $20k you don't pay tax on 60k and then 20k . .. you pay tax on the total 80 k. Expenses work the same way.

Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 10:16am:
They bid up prices at auctions and are willing to pay more than others simply because they can claim for interest payments where as joe owner occupier isn't allowed this privilege

Did your psychic tell you that? I know many investor owners, and not a single one has ever bid up the price s/he pays, each and every single one tries to get the property for a cheaply as they can.

Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 10:16am:
Kind of sucks doesn't it but the corruption goes on 


it also sucks that you can be so bitter about investors in the property market ... that doesn't mean we get rid of you now does it!


Yes they just bid that little bit extra knowing they get concessions that owner occupiers don't get like the deduction of interest payments against the income from their day job and costs of repairs and maintenance Sad

And try and operate on a level playing for a change instead of using a legalized tax avoidance racket to gain a competitive edge Sad



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"If you take out Saddam, I guarantee you that it will have enormous positive reverberations on the region..." - Benjamin Netanyahu in 1995
 
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Sir lastnail
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #33 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:57pm
 
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:21pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:01pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Yes and as it's now 2014 so even the youngest child would now be at least 24 years old so nobody should be living in poverty.... 


that doesn't make your comment any more correct .. it was wrong before your pissy excuse, and its wrong after it.


What pissy excuse would you be referring to?

It was Bob Hawke's words not mine.  I guess Bob was indeed 'pissy' plenty of times so you're half right.


Bob Hawke has gone to china so many times he has lost count. Every time he goes to china he sells off an additional bit of Australia to them.

Well I suppose he has nothing else to sell to them except a one off fire sale of our land and resources Sad
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"If you take out Saddam, I guarantee you that it will have enormous positive reverberations on the region..." - Benjamin Netanyahu in 1995
 
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Laugh till you cry
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #34 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 2:13pm
 
Bob should be selling the Chinese the hordes of Australian wretched huddled masses as cheap labour.
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John Smith
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #35 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 2:49pm
 
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:21pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:01pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Yes and as it's now 2014 so even the youngest child would now be at least 24 years old so nobody should be living in poverty.... 


that doesn't make your comment any more correct .. it was wrong before your pissy excuse, and its wrong after it.


What pissy excuse would you be referring to?

It was Bob Hawke's words not mine.  I guess Bob was indeed 'pissy' plenty of times so you're half right.


what excuse? 'that they would now be 24yrs old' ... you were wrong when accredited Hawke with saying no one will live in poverty, and no attempts at muddying the waters by you will change that
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I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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John Smith
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #36 - Jan 3rd, 2014 at 2:52pm
 
Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:46pm:
Yes they just bid that little bit extra knowing they get concessions that owner occupiers don't get like the deduction of interest payments against the income from their day job and costs of repairs and maintenance


no, they bid what they need to bid to buy the property ... the majority of bidders will pull out once the bidding reaches a certain limit .. it has nothing to do with claiming deductions, it's all a question of how much you want a property

Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:46pm:
And try and operate on a level playing for a change instead of using a legalized tax avoidance racket to gain a competitive edge

what, in this world, operates on a level palying field? NOTHING ... the pretty girl will get the job over the fat girl, the guy whose dad is connected will get the better job ... NOTHING on this planet has a level playing field.
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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.
 
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Bam
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #37 - Jan 4th, 2014 at 11:57am
 
Grappler Racist Filth wrote on Jan 1st, 2014 at 5:09pm:
500 members needed for the Grappler Party... who's on first?  We gotta get cracking....

Right, that does it. I've been thinking about this for some time now.

We simply must organise a political party. A political party that is committed to making a real difference to the lives of the unemployed in this country.

What the unemployed in this country need more than anything is a job. Not false promises of work. Not lies. Not exploitation. Not handouts. Not being victims of discrimination or hate crimes. Not being passed over for employment because they are out of work. A job. And not just a few thousand jobs when there's over a million people in this country right now who need work and cannot find it. Enough jobs so that every unemployed person in this country who wants a job can get one at the same time. These jobs need not be full time; even a part time job can be of immense benefit to someone who has none.

We must remove the numerous barriers that prevent the unemployed from finding work. Make it illegal to discriminate against the unemployed when hiring. Remove tax deductions for placing job ads unless the employer meets a quota of interviewing at least one unemployed person in four for each advertised position. Remove the restriction on education that prevents a skilled person from making a career change if they are unable to find work in their industry after six months out of work.

It is ineffective to pay subsidies to job seekers who find work because it is not the job seeker not looking that is the problem, it's employers who won't hire them. Therefore, do not pay subsidies to job seekers just because they find work. (However, subsidies which cover necessary startup costs like new work clothing must be retained.) Job seekers will be better off just from finding work. Instead, pay subsidies to employers who hire unemployed people - similar to the subsidies that Keating introduced in his Working Nation plan.

To create enough jobs to go around, we need to rethink employment in this country. A 35-hour working week. Overtime penalty rates for all employees. End the $70 billion a year of free labour that employees give their employers, often unwillingly. Forced unpaid work for other people is slavery by definition. But there needs to be give and take. Penalty rates for working weekends need to be reimplemented so staff costs on weekends can be reduced yet people are still paid more for working weekends if they also worked during the week. If overtime penalty rates were mandatory, weekend penalty rates can safely be abolished because they can be covered by the mandatory overtime penalty rates when this is applicable.

Abolishing weekend penalty rates will adversely affect young people, particularly full-time students who need these to survive. Therefore, to address this shortfall, youth allowance for full-time students living away from home should be increased by $50 a week so they aren't forced to work long hours each week in employment and studies just so they can put food on the table.

Newstart should also be increased by $50 a week because it is manifestly inadequate as it is. It is unjustifiable in a country that is supposedly as rich as Australia that our unemployed are paid a rate that in real terms is less than comparable income support in other comparable countries. It's not as if we can't afford to begrudge the unemployed a little more. It's only selfishness and greed that prevents this. Also note that if the unemployed are in work, less income support would be paid out so it is affordable.

We should also look at the taxation system at the low end of the tax scales and its interaction with the welfare system. Income support gets withdrawn at 60 cents in the dollar at the same time that tax takes away more money at 19 cents in the dollar. 67.6 cents in the dollar is the result. This is much higher than the top marginal tax rate. The highest government impost on income falls on those who can least afford it.

These and other inequities occur because the unemployed are under-represented in the parliaments of this country. That has to change.

So let's do this, and be silent no more.
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« Last Edit: Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:04pm by Bam »  

You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Grappler Racist Filth
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #38 - Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:17pm
 
Bam is right.  The same pretty much applies to pensioners.  I get $156 free of reduction, then after that it is 50c in the dollar plus tax at 15% (age bracket) - otherwise at 19%.

Now I have zero objection to going to work full time - make me an offer for a change.  I apply for every job I can do - the moment they hear:-

Age - 64

Not in a a job at the moment.

It's gimlet eyes and 'we'll call you'.. followed by the silence of the lame - they're lame losers who have no idea in reality - since they fail to see that not having more people in work means those people will buy less and therefore their business will not flourish as well.  Even those better off will not have the residual cash since they will be paying the way, and rightly so, of those they have cut out of a job by even applying for a second job.

UTTER STUPIDITY.

Now - when you all wake up - I'll be happy to stand for Il Presidente, Benevolent Diktator, Defender of the People, Upholder of the Rights of All, and Fat Cat with a Bahamas Retirement Account (oops - delete that).... and Father to the Revolution.
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“Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passion, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.”
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Grappler Racist Filth
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #39 - Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:21pm
 
AND all those 'high paying tax payers.. who BTW do NOT pay the majority of the Tax Take - but ONLY a proportionately higher percentage as is right... could get on just as well on a flat tax system of say 20% for all - PROVIDED THEY TOOK A COMMENSURATE DROP IN GROSS INCOME.

They will NOT do that  because it is a STATUS SYMBOL to have the big salary and then whine about paying the big tax.

You know what I have to say to that?  bugger 'EM!  Let 'em get a real job for a change and learn how business works from the bottom up - that way they might make a success of it instead of the current disaster it is.

ALSO - average weekly earning of wage and salary earners is $1490 or so.... hads up those who get that?

The figures are fudged - and besides - those fat cats have ensured that many of the lower paid workers are out of a job so they can bloody well pay their way with higher taxation.

Productivity for all or take it on the chin... I say nationalise the lot.....
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Bam
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #40 - Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:24pm
 
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:32pm:
It's funny but it's true.

The top 25 per cent of income earners pay 67.9 per cent of net income tax.  (Source ATO 2010-2011 Tax stats)

Arguably, the top 25% are "Abbott and his ilk"


They pay the most tax because they also hold most of the wealth. According to the ABS, the top 20% have 60.8% of the wealth and the bottom 60% only hold 18% of total net worth.
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You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to hold opinions that you can defend through sound, reasoned argument.
 
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Gnads
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #41 - Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:27pm
 
Sir lastnail wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:57pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:21pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:01pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Yes and as it's now 2014 so even the youngest child would now be at least 24 years old so nobody should be living in poverty.... 


that doesn't make your comment any more correct .. it was wrong before your pissy excuse, and its wrong after it.


What pissy excuse would you be referring to?

It was Bob Hawke's words not mine.  I guess Bob was indeed 'pissy' plenty of times so you're half right.


Bob Hawke has gone to china so many times he has lost count. Every time he goes to china he sells off an additional bit of Australia to them.

Well I suppose he has nothing else to sell to them except a one off fire sale of our land and resources Sad


He's not in the hunt compared to Twiggy, Gina & Clive..... & our northern cattlemen aren't averse to taking big money selling out to Indonesian & other foreign interests.

Mind you that is also helped by the inconsistency of the ACCC & FIRB.
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"When you are dead, you do not know you are dead. It's only painful and difficult for others. The same applies when you are stupid." ~ Ricky Gervais
 
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Swagman
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #42 - Jan 5th, 2014 at 10:28am
 
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 2:49pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:21pm:
John Smith wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:01pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 9:05am:
Yes and as it's now 2014 so even the youngest child would now be at least 24 years old so nobody should be living in poverty.... 


that doesn't make your comment any more correct .. it was wrong before your pissy excuse, and its wrong after it.


What pissy excuse would you be referring to?

It was Bob Hawke's words not mine.  I guess Bob was indeed 'pissy' plenty of times so you're half right.


what excuse? 'that they would now be 24yrs old' ... you were wrong when accredited Hawke with saying no one will live in poverty, and no attempts at muddying the waters by you will change that


Sorry Smithy I forgot that it takes a degree of perceptiveness to work out that the children Hawke was referring to would no longer be children...

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Swagman
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #43 - Jan 5th, 2014 at 10:41am
 
Bam wrote on Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:24pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:32pm:
It's funny but it's true.

The top 25 per cent of income earners pay 67.9 per cent of net income tax.  (Source ATO 2010-2011 Tax stats)

Arguably, the top 25% are "Abbott and his ilk"


They pay the most tax because they also hold most of the wealth. According to the ABS, the top 20% have 60.8% of the wealth and the bottom 60% only hold 18% of total net worth.


So what's your point?

It's ok to steal from the guy next door just because he works harder and earns more?

If you work hard and earn more you will accumulate wealth.  If you don't you won't.  That's why the 'gap' between rich and poor widens.

The more the so-called rich earn the better off the mob is because it can steal more.

It's not in the Mob's interest to kill the golden goose but it certainly tries with its petty politics of envy.

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« Last Edit: Jan 5th, 2014 at 10:46am by Swagman »  
 
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Re: How Many Australians Are Living In Poverty.
Reply #44 - Jan 5th, 2014 at 11:06am
 
Swagman wrote on Jan 5th, 2014 at 10:41am:
Bam wrote on Jan 4th, 2014 at 12:24pm:
Swagman wrote on Jan 3rd, 2014 at 1:32pm:
It's funny but it's true.

The top 25 per cent of income earners pay 67.9 per cent of net income tax.  (Source ATO 2010-2011 Tax stats)

Arguably, the top 25% are "Abbott and his ilk"


They pay the most tax because they also hold most of the wealth. According to the ABS, the top 20% have 60.8% of the wealth and the bottom 60% only hold 18% of total net worth.


So what's your point?

It's ok to steal from the guy next door just because he works harder and earns more?

If you work hard and earn more you will accumulate wealth.  If you don't you won't.  That's why the 'gap' between rich and poor widens.

The more the so-called rich earn the better off the mob is because it can steal more.

It's not in the Mob's interest to kill the golden goose but it certainly tries with its petty politics of envy.




Ensuring that the well-off pay their fair share of tax, and ensuring that the most disadvantaged get an ADEQUATE amount of assistance, is NOT 'stealing'.

Never was, never will be.

Why do you begrudge anything to anyone but the already well-off, Swagman? It seems to be a constant theme in your posts.
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