Australian Politics Forum - Rudd smacked down on Bible verse

Quantum

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #45 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:51am

Dnarever wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:33am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:25am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

RightSadFred wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Dnarubbish

I know most topics are beyond you, like picking an issue which might gain and lose votes, but you need to ask Rudd why he goes down these paths, he is your leader of the party you worship.

The article was just anti Labor or anti gay marrage spin with no substance. Watch the debate and judge for yourself.

The technicalities in the article were all swayed to suite a false conclusion. Rudd had done well to counter the bible quote with another to refute the claim and the quote he used was relevant and correct.

The argument of lining up two quotes from the bible and saying that one was fair dinkum and the other was just a social statement of the day is ludicrous, maybe they were both just a social comment on the day or possibly neither. It is just how the author wants to spin it.

Rudds following statement saying that Human condition and social positions change about sums it up.

I think it obvious that there was nothing of value on this topic in that article. It was someone's view supported by bending biblical meaning to suit his pre conceived opinion.

The only person bending the bible is Rudd, and most Christians know that.

The bible is like any other topic; it has a mainstream view, then it has many smaller alternative views. Does every scientist believe in climate change? Does every scientist believe that vaccinations are safe? Does every scientist believe that fluoride in water is good for you? No matter the topic, there will always be someone who has a different opinion. Usually most people hold to the mainstream view that the majority of experts support. However, many people who will believe the experts on other issues will happily dismiss the mainstream when it comes to biblical studies. Several people may spend 50 years doing bible reaserch, trying to understand the historical context and looking at all possible views, yet people will happily dismiss that reaserch by finding a verse through google and saying that their interpretation is as good as anyone else's. Rudd totally missed what Paul was saying, but since Rudd also missed what the gospel is on about in his next sentence that is hardly surprising.

Rudd showed every Christian on Monday that he has not read the bible. He complelty misquoted it, and gave one of the weakess summaries of the gospel ever made. He is clearly trying to walk a line of saying "I'm a Christian" while grabbing votes from the non Christians as well. And isn't that what the real question was about? It had nothing to do with gay marriage, but instead was about Christians in Australia not sure anymore on what he actually believes. He says one thing, but he also says and does another and people are now confused on where he stands. His answer on Monday only highlighted these two sides of Kevin. Until Monday he seemed like a Christian trying to win the non Christian vote. After Q&A he seems like a non Christian trying to keep the Christian vote by simply saying "I'm a committed Christian, I just don't follow Christ or believe the bible". His response would have lost him as many votes as he picked up.

Rudd showed every Christian on Monday that he has not read the bible.

"Paul said in the new testament slaves be obedient to your masters"

It was a real good guess then !!!!

This is enough to show how credible your view of this is.

Rudd also said that the bible says slavery is a natural condition, hence his reference to Paul. But the quotation from Paul is not saying slavery is good. The argument Paul is making is that now that you have been saved in Christ, be content in that and live your life for God. Whatever your postion in life, live it in a way that reflects the love you have in Jesus. It was not in itself a comment on slavery.

You can pretend that Rudd is a biblical expert, but most Christians and certainly those who study the bible are not going to be convinced by his answer. He really showed his ignorance of it when he gave his understanding of the gospel. If Rudd can get the main focus of the bible wrong, then that gives the impression that he has not read it at all.

I think the fact that you will simple takes Rudd's word for it over those who are calling him out on his comments says more about your credibility. Your pro Rudd view in the face of any opposition to his comments only makes one believe that had Rudd even said that the bible claims that Muhammad is to be worshiped, you would still defend his comments to the end.

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buzzanddidj

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #46 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:00am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:45am:

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for

you are all one in Christ Jesus

.

Galatians 3:28

For God shows no partiality

Romans 2:11

Do you have the page number for God's reference to "human garbage" and "shoe-shiners"
( ... that we are right to turn our backs on)
in that life manual of yours ?

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'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

- Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi

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longweekend58

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #47 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:51am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:33am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:25am:

Dnarever wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 9:45am:

RightSadFred wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 9:31am:

Dnarubbish

I know most topics are beyond you, like picking an issue which might gain and lose votes, but you need to ask Rudd why he goes down these paths, he is your leader of the party you worship.

The article was just anti Labor or anti gay marrage spin with no substance. Watch the debate and judge for yourself.

The technicalities in the article were all swayed to suite a false conclusion. Rudd had done well to counter the bible quote with another to refute the claim and the quote he used was relevant and correct.

The argument of lining up two quotes from the bible and saying that one was fair dinkum and the other was just a social statement of the day is ludicrous, maybe they were both just a social comment on the day or possibly neither. It is just how the author wants to spin it.

Rudds following statement saying that Human condition and social positions change about sums it up.

I think it obvious that there was nothing of value on this topic in that article. It was someone's view supported by bending biblical meaning to suit his pre conceived opinion.

The only person bending the bible is Rudd, and most Christians know that.

The bible is like any other topic; it has a mainstream view, then it has many smaller alternative views. Does every scientist believe in climate change? Does every scientist believe that vaccinations are safe? Does every scientist believe that fluoride in water is good for you? No matter the topic, there will always be someone who has a different opinion. Usually most people hold to the mainstream view that the majority of experts support. However, many people who will believe the experts on other issues will happily dismiss the mainstream when it comes to biblical studies. Several people may spend 50 years doing bible reaserch, trying to understand the historical context and looking at all possible views, yet people will happily dismiss that reaserch by finding a verse through google and saying that their interpretation is as good as anyone else's. Rudd totally missed what Paul was saying, but since Rudd also missed what the gospel is on about in his next sentence that is hardly surprising.

Rudd showed every Christian on Monday that he has not read the bible. He complelty misquoted it, and gave one of the weakess summaries of the gospel ever made. He is clearly trying to walk a line of saying "I'm a Christian" while grabbing votes from the non Christians as well. And isn't that what the real question was about? It had nothing to do with gay marriage, but instead was about Christians in Australia not sure anymore on what he actually believes. He says one thing, but he also says and does another and people are now confused on where he stands. His answer on Monday only highlighted these two sides of Kevin. Until Monday he seemed like a Christian trying to win the non Christian vote. After Q&A he seems like a non Christian trying to keep the Christian vote by simply saying "I'm a committed Christian, I just don't follow Christ or believe the bible". His response would have lost him as many votes as he picked up.

Rudd showed every Christian on Monday that he has not read the bible.

"Paul said in the new testament slaves be obedient to your masters"

It was a real good guess then !!!!

This is enough to show how credible your view of this is.

Rudd also said that the bible says slavery is a natural condition, hence his reference to Paul. But the quotation from Paul is not saying slavery is good. The argument Paul is making is that now that you have been saved in Christ, be content in that and live your life for God. Whatever your postion in life, live it in a way that reflects the love you have in Jesus. It was not in itself a comment on slavery.

You can pretend that Rudd is a biblical expert, but most Christians and certainly those who study the bible are not going to be convinced by his answer. He really showed his ignorance of it when he gave his understanding of the gospel. If Rudd can get the main focus of the bible wrong, then that gives the impression that he has not read it at all.

I think the fact that you will simple takes Rudd's word for it over those who are calling him out on his comments says more about your credibility. Your pro Rudd view in the face of any opposition to his comments only makes one believe that had Rudd even said that the bible claims that Muhammad is to be worshiped, you would still defend his comments to the end.

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Quantum

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #48 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

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Verge

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #49 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am

Rudd's comments received huge support.

Get over it, its about the only thing this whole election he delievered a convincing, strong and dominant performance in.

Move on, pastor got smacked, and anyone who wants to argue the bible will run into so many issues because according to it you cant put cattle of different breeds in the same paddock, cant cut your hair and plenty of other crap that isnt relevant.

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And why not, if you will permit me; why shouldn’t I, if you will permit me; spend my first week as prime minister, should that happen, on this, on your, country - Abbott with the Garma People Aug 13

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John Smith

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #50 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:24am

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

yeah ... I'm sure it was ... as if you and longstupidone were ever going to agree with anything he said.

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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longweekend58

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #51 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:30am

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

I think that that is possibly the worst indictment on his character. I've said in the past that Rudd doesn't believe in anything other than himself. Now, I suspect that may in fact be literally true.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #52 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:33am

John Smith wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:24am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

yeah ... I'm sure it was ... as if you and longstupidone were ever going to agree with anything he said.

this is an issue that transcends petty politics. it is the stuff of LIFE. And Quantum and I are both very disappointed to find that Rudd really doesn't understand the bible or relationship with God very well - if at all. I would be just as disappointed and in fact more so, if Abbott said the same thing. Does Rudd actually believe in anything at all beyond himself?

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #53 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:34am

buzzanddidj wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:50am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:21am:

Christians the world over are good people.

Fred Phelps, Sr.

Charles Coughlin

Jim Jones

Marshall Herff Applewhite, Jr.

Paul Jennings Hill

Michael Bray

Matthew Hale

Pat Robertson

David Koresh

Sun Myung Moon

Benny Hinn

George Pell

Fred Nile

The entire membership of the Ku-Klux-Klan

Wow 12 guys to slander a billion people eh?

I could highlight the excessive amounts of homosexials who are pedophiles if I were inclined to do so but it would be unfair.

Your hatred and dislike of the Church is very clear through and completely unwarranted.

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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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Quantum

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #54 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:40am

John Smith wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:24am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

yeah ... I'm sure it was ... as if you and longstupidone were ever going to agree with anything he said.

My disappointment is in someone who claims to be a committed Christian, but clearly forgot what the gospel is actually about. Not everything is about politics.

His answer wasn't actually very good. The question was as to how Christians can know what he believes when he has changed his position on many things. The answer he gave only supported this doubt that many Christians have about him. What does he actually believe as a Christian when he doesn't believe the bible and he doesn't hold to Christ as the centre of the gospel.

For non Christians this is a non issue and I understand that. But his answer did not help with the doubts that many people in this country have as to what he actually believes. Instead, it only reinforced them.

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longweekend58

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #55 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:43am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:34am:

buzzanddidj wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:50am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 10:21am:

Christians the world over are good people.

Fred Phelps, Sr.

Charles Coughlin

Jim Jones

Marshall Herff Applewhite, Jr.

Paul Jennings Hill

Michael Bray

Matthew Hale

Pat Robertson

David Koresh

Sun Myung Moon

Benny Hinn

George Pell

Fred Nile

The entire membership of the Ku-Klux-Klan

Wow 12 guys to slander a billion people eh?

I could highlight the excessive amounts of homosexials who are pedophiles if I were inclined to do so but it would be unfair.

Your hatred and dislike of the Church is very clear through and completely unwarranted.

take a look at that one for a slight on gay behaviour.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/gay-activists-in-germany-silent-on-alliance-with-pedophiles-in-1980s-a-919119.html

and this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1556756

two can play your silly game buzzard.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #56 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:45am

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:40am:

John Smith wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:24am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

yeah ... I'm sure it was ... as if you and longstupidone were ever going to agree with anything he said.

My disappointment is in someone who claims to be a committed Christian, but clearly forgot what the gospel is actually about. Not everything is about politics.

His answer wasn't actually very good. The question was as to how Christians can know what he believes when he has changed his position on many things. The answer he gave only supported this doubt that many Christians have about him. What does he actually believe as a Christian when he doesn't believe the bible and he doesn't hold to Christ as the centre of the gospel.

For non Christians this is a non issue and I understand that. But his answer did not help with the doubts that many people in this country have as to what he actually believes. Instead, it only reinforced them.

and that is the key point. And we all know that in a couple months when rudd has quit parliament that these same people who are supporting him now will come to similar conclusions. What does Rudd believe in? Just himself.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Verge

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #57 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:51am

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:45am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:40am:

John Smith wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:24am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

yeah ... I'm sure it was ... as if you and longstupidone were ever going to agree with anything he said.

My disappointment is in someone who claims to be a committed Christian, but clearly forgot what the gospel is actually about. Not everything is about politics.

His answer wasn't actually very good. The question was as to how Christians can know what he believes when he has changed his position on many things. The answer he gave only supported this doubt that many Christians have about him. What does he actually believe as a Christian when he doesn't believe the bible and he doesn't hold to Christ as the centre of the gospel.

For non Christians this is a non issue and I understand that. But his answer did not help with the doubts that many people in this country have as to what he actually believes. Instead, it only reinforced them.

and that is the key point. And we all know that in a couple months when rudd has quit parliament that these same people who are supporting him now will come to similar conclusions. What does Rudd believe in? Just himself.

Rudd made his position very clear. He considers homosexuality a normal condition. By considering it normal, he believes it should be recognised as equal, as people dont get to choose who they fall in love with, and that should be recognised the same.

Why was this lost on you?

It was probably the most clear message he has delievered on anything.

Or was it because Rudd said something, and you distrust him that you automatically assume he was saying something else or he didnt really believe what he said?

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And why not, if you will permit me; why shouldn’t I, if you will permit me; spend my first week as prime minister, should that happen, on this, on your, country - Abbott with the Garma People Aug 13

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Verge

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #58 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:54am

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:30am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

I think that that is possibly the worst indictment on his character. I've said in the past that Rudd doesn't believe in anything other than himself. Now, I suspect that may in fact be literally true.

But you yourself have used christanity as a reason for opposing same sex marriage. Are you not using your religious beliefs to justify your political position on this matter?

I too have used my christian beliefs in my support of gay marriage.

We all have done it mate, Abbott as well (are we forgetting the abortion issue from when he was health minister).

To pretend otherwise shows how low you will sink to throw some mud.

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And why not, if you will permit me; why shouldn’t I, if you will permit me; spend my first week as prime minister, should that happen, on this, on your, country - Abbott with the Garma People Aug 13

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longweekend58

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Re: Rudd smacked down on Bible verse
Reply #59 - Sep 4^th, 2013 at 12:01pm

Verge wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:51am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:45am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:40am:

John Smith wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:24am:

Quantum wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:21am:

longweekend58 wrote on Sep 4^th, 2013 at 11:02am:

I was very disappointed in Rudd because most genuine Christians don't let politics get in the way of their religious beliefs or actions. The parliamentary Christian Fellowship is an example. But for Rudd, everything is about him and his wishes and his promotion. And you are right quantum. His understanding of the Gospel has shown that his understanding of the basic tenet of the Bible is flawed and very poor. I don't think he has the slightest clue.

Yes, he really got this one wrong. I know for a lot of non Christians his answer was good, and that in fine and understandable. If you are not a Christian the bible is surely irrelevant so who cares if his answers fit with it. But I'm sure many Christians picked up on the fact that he essentially took Christ out of Christian in a response to a question as to why Christians can trust him. For someone like him who confesses to be a Christian (plus as a politician in an election week of a nation that has millions of Christians), that was madness. Yes polictians should not let their beliefs get in the way of politics, but as you said, he has let politics get in the way of his own beliefs. Very disappointing.

yeah ... I'm sure it was ... as if you and longstupidone were ever going to agree with anything he said.

My disappointment is in someone who claims to be a committed Christian, but clearly forgot what the gospel is actually about. Not everything is about politics.

His answer wasn't actually very good. The question was as to how Christians can know what he believes when he has changed his position on many things. The answer he gave only supported this doubt that many Christians have about him. What does he actually believe as a Christian when he doesn't believe the bible and he doesn't hold to Christ as the centre of the gospel.

For non Christians this is a non issue and I understand that. But his answer did not help with the doubts that many people in this country have as to what he actually believes. Instead, it only reinforced them.

and that is the key point. And we all know that in a couple months when rudd has quit parliament that these same people who are supporting him now will come to similar conclusions. What does Rudd believe in? Just himself.

Rudd made his position very clear. He considers homosexuality a normal condition. By considering it normal, he believes it should be recognised as equal, as people dont get to choose who they fall in love with, and that should be recognised the same.

Why was this lost on you?

It was probably the most clear message he has delievered on anything.

Or was it because Rudd said something, and you distrust him that you automatically assume he was saying something else or he didnt really believe what he said?

He was asked this in a biblical context and it was an epic fail. I know you don't care what the Bible says and that is your right, but I do and apparently, so does Quantum. Rudd has always claimed to be a biblical Christian but with this issue he showed that he really knows little of what the Biblevsays on this issue but more disturbingly that he knows even less about the Gospel which is THE CENTRAL TENET. this is not about homosexuality. It is about how Rudd has no beliefs other than in himself.

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