Australian Politics Forum - Where is this budget emergency

perceptions_now

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #120 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:21am

Karnal wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 10:45am:

The Libs will do exactly the same as Labor - same deficit, same mistakes, same revenue forecasts, same budget tricks and spin.

You are correct, in so far as there are/will be quite a few similarities, for both Labor & Liberal, including -
Both have Similar SPIN tactics!
They are both Truth inhibited!
Both would have a "once in history", set of negative Global Economic Drivers, in the years ahead!
Neither will be able to restore the Economic status quo, via the usual Keynesian or Austrian solutions!
It is likely that both would continue to run Deficits & mounting Debt OR run the risk of dramatically worsening the Economic outcome!
Neither has any earthly idea, what is really happening, nor do they really want to know!
Neither has the guts to implement change/s that would upset their supporters & lessen their election prospects, including getting rid of things such as Baby Bonuses, Local Councils & lowering Taxes!

That said, we (the Public) must take some responsibility, both here & overseas, for allowing this situation to develop, over a considerable amount of time.

We need to develop some "intestinal fortitude" of our own!
We need to stop simply following the past & our own "beliefs/prejudices"!!
We need to look to what is actually happening now, what are the likely future consequences/outcomes of the actions/inactions that we are now allowing/enforcing on our Pollies AND WE NEED TO START THE CHANGE PROCESS, NOW!!!

I would suggest that start be made, BY KICKING OUT EVERY INCUMBENT & THEREBY SENDING THE ESTABLISHMENT A MESSAGE, THAT CHANGE MUST START NOW!

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #121 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:24am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 9:52am:

The baby bonus was not bad policy.

It was no more than Howard buying our votes - with our own money.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 9:52am:

It assisted families of Australia to transition to a different lifestyle and avoid potential hardships.

It bought votes.

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 9:52am:

Nothing wrong at all with Howard using a budget surplus (which after all came from us paying $120k in taxes through that year) on items to help us a little bit.

From Howard's perspective, buying votes with the voters' own money was brilliant politics. Did it do the nation any good?

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# Gold Member Offline A fool is certain: an ignorant fool, absolutely so Posts: 2603	Re: Where is this budget emergency Reply #122 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:29am Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:09am: ... A guy who has no political party allegiance and has voted for varying parties. ... Your behaviour belies that assertion. Just as I'm undeniably to the Left of centre, you're evidently far, far to the Right.
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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #123 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:32am

perceptions_now wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:21am:

Karnal wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 10:45am:

The Libs will do exactly the same as Labor - same deficit, same mistakes, same revenue forecasts, same budget tricks and spin.

You are correct, in so far as there are/will be quite a few similarities, for both Labor & Liberal, including -
Both have Similar SPIN tactics!
They are both Truth inhibited!
Both would have a "once in history", set of negative Global Economic Drivers, in the years ahead!
Neither will be able to restore the Economic status quo, via the usual Keynesian or Austrian solutions!
It is likely that both would continue to run Deficits & mounting Debt OR run the risk of dramatically worsening the Economic outcome!
Neither has any earthly idea, what is really happening, nor do they really want to know!
Neither has the guts to implement change/s that would upset their supporters & lessen their election prospects, including getting rid of things such as Baby Bonuses, Local Councils & lowering Taxes!

That said, we (the Public) must take some responsibility, both here & overseas, for allowing this situation to develop, over a considerable amount of time.

We need to develop some "intestinal fortitude" of our own!
We need to stop simply following the past & our own "beliefs/prejudices"!!
We need to look to what is actually happening now, what are the likely future consequences/outcomes of the actions/inactions that we are now allowing/enforcing on our Pollies AND WE NEED TO START THE CHANGE PROCESS, NOW!!!

I would suggest that start be made, BY KICKING OUT EVERY INCUMBENT & THEREBY SENDING THE ESTABLISHMENT A MESSAGE, THAT CHANGE MUST START NOW!

Agreed. Unfortunately politicians, aided and abetted by media, have become far too adept at manipulating the herd. The herd decides who will govern.

It seems we're headed for a Murdoch government.

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red baron

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #124 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

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John Smith

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #125 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:55am

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:09am:

John Smith wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 10:55am:

Just admit that you aren't and stop being ashamed of what you are.

A dual national of the UK and Australia who is moving back home but remains very interested in his other nationality's economic and social well being.

A guy who has no political party allegiance and has voted for varying parties.

No shame or hidden agenda in my house.

I don't care who you voted for in Uzbekistan ... when was the last time you voted labor in an Australian Federal election? You cannot claim you vote for different parties and have no allegiance when you've only ever voted for libs at a federal election. Didn't you once say you will never vote for the party that had Hawke as their PM, because Hawke sacked your father? That is not representative of ZERO political allegiance.

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John Smith

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #126 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:58am

# wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:29am:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:09am:

...
A guy who has no political party allegiance and has voted for varying parties.
...

Your behaviour belies that assertion. Just as I'm undeniably to the Left of centre, you're evidently far, far to the Right.

Don't believe him, he has only ever voted liberal in Australian federal elections. He uses the fact that he voted for other parties in the UK as his 'proof' that he isn't a liberal monkey. Never mind the fact that the 'Australian Liberal Party' was never on any UK ballot.

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Our esteemed leader:
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John Smith

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #127 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:58am

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

you have a problem with Chinese money?

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Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Karnal

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #128 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:00pm

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

Ever had a home loan, Red? Or have you always relied on the generosity of Air Force Housing?

Guess how much Australia borrowed to fight the chows over in Nam. Guess how much Australia borrowed to get out of the Depression and fight the Japs up in New Guinea.

We're not fighting slopes anymore, son. We're fighting to stay out of recession. This is the challenge: raise taxes or borrow more money. Same for Labor, same for the Libs.

The Libs are prepared to hock the good China to pay working mums' wages to go off and have kids. You think they'll cut back the debt? You're dreaming.

Every major developed economy in the world has debt, as do most developing countries. Out of all of them, Australia has one of the lowest levels of debt in the world - at the last count, just behind Estonia.

Run a deficit, or raise taxes - that's the only choice. My money's on a tax hike before long - no matter which party gets in.

Back in the 60s, the Libs told us that if we fought the commies over there, we wouldn't have to fight them on our home ground. Now, in 2013, the Libs are more red than Ho Chi Minh.

What a waste of a war that one was. We should have stuck to fighting them over here.

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Karnal

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #129 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:04pm

John Smith wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:58am:

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

you have a problem with Chinese money?

Red's not a big fan of the Chinks. He used to paint his nepalm bombs with "bugger you, Chairman Mao."

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John S

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #130 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:07pm

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

How much a week is it costing you to paid it back?

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John Smith

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #131 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:09pm

Karnal wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:04pm:

John Smith wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:58am:

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

you have a problem with Chinese money?

Red's not a big fan of the Chinks. He used to paint his nepalm bombs with "bugger you, Chairman Mao."

Doubt it ... I think it's more likely that Red would have been safe in his bunker telling others how to do it properly

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Karnal

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #132 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 3:07pm

John Smith wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:09pm:

Karnal wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:04pm:

John Smith wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:58am:

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

you have a problem with Chinese money?

Red's not a big fan of the Chinks. He used to paint his nepalm bombs with "bugger you, Chairman Mao."

Doubt it ... I think it's more likely that Red would have been safe in his bunker telling others how to do it properly

If that 100 million a day was going towards blokes in bunkers telling others who to bomb, I'd say Red would class it as money well spent.

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longweekend58

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #133 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 5:06pm

Karnal wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:00pm:

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

Ever had a home loan, Red? Or have you always relied on the generosity of Air Force Housing?

Guess how much Australia borrowed to fight the chows over in Nam. Guess how much Australia borrowed to get out of the Depression and fight the Japs up in New Guinea.

We're not fighting slopes anymore, son. We're fighting to stay out of recession. This is the challenge: raise taxes or borrow more money. Same for Labor, same for the Libs.

The Libs are prepared to hock the good China to pay working mums' wages to go off and have kids. You think they'll cut back the debt? You're dreaming.

Every major developed economy in the world has debt, as do most developing countries. Out of all of them, Australia has one of the lowest levels of debt in the world - at the last count, just behind Estonia.

Run a deficit, or raise taxes - that's the only choice. My money's on a tax hike before long - no matter which party gets in.

Back in the 60s, the Libs told us that if we fought the commies over there, we wouldn't have to fight them on our home ground. Now, in 2013, the Libs are more red than Ho Chi Minh.

What a waste of a war that one was. We should have stuck to fighting them over here.

What you typically refuse to acknowledge however is that the RATE OF INCREASE in debt in Australia is the third highest in the world. now tell me again why the words best economy needs to be borrowing faster than virtually every other country?

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longweekend58

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Re: Where is this budget emergency
Reply #134 - Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 5:08pm

John S wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 12:07pm:

red baron wrote on Aug 23^rd, 2013 at 11:38am:

Do you call borrowing 100 million dollars a day from the Chinese a good way to go.

The only thing with what is now a 300 billion dollar debt to the Chinese that it will have to be re paid. I don't see any sign of that on the horizon, what I see is Labor borrowing 100 million dollars a day.

Anyone care to refute that? Anyone care to give proof that the money is being repaid?

Bit hard when we are still borrowing at that level.

How much a week is it costing you to paid it back?

$1000 per year per person simply to service the debt. where do you think that money comes from? INCREASE TAXES and.or reduced services.

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