Australian Politics Forum - Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)

mantra

Gold Member

Offline

ozpolitic.com

Posts: 10750
Gender: female

Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)
Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 7:26pm

Does anyone really understand how the ETS is going to benefit the environment?

It resembles a $2 company in name only with no substance and will be put on the stock exchange and traded as a bag of hot air.

The carbon tax you can understand. As the price of electricity increases, most of us try to reduce our energy costs and it benefits the environment to some extent.

How will carbon credits benefit anyone aside from the broker and the corporations who have been allocated superfluous credits and will become wealthy on the back of nothing?

Who is capping and measuring how much carbon various companies use? Some governments will be handing out freebies to large corporations who will end up trading them for a profit, but how will that reduce emissions? The cost will be passed onto us.

The scheme has not had any previous success so why does anyone believe it will work this time around?

When an ETS comes into effect - prices will initially reduce, but who's to say that in a couple of years - it won't exceed the presently capped price of $26 p.t. and become more expensive than gold?

Quote:

Under the 'cap and trade' principle, a cap is set on the total amount of greenhouse gases that can be emitted by all participating installations. 'Allowances' for emissions are then auctioned off or allocated for free, and can subsequently be traded. Installations must monitor and report their CO2 emissions, ensuring they hand in enough allowances to the authorities to cover their emissions. If emission exceeds what is permitted by its allowances, an installation must purchase allowances from others. Conversely, if an installation has performed well at reducing its emissions, it can sell its leftover credits. This allows the system to find the most cost-effective ways of reducing emissions without significant government intervention.

Back to top

IP Logged

muso

Gold Member

Offline

Posts: 13151
Gladstone, Queensland
Gender: male

Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)
Reply #1 - Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 8:11pm

It's one of these things that should work if it was applied correctly world-wide.

A company I used to work for installed new technology that resulted in lower CO2-e emissions. With the introduction of the carbon tax, it paid for itself in one year. This actually had the intended benefit of increasing their profit margin while reducing emissions. We're talking millions of dollars per annum.

The first thing that should happen even before introducing an emissions trading scheme is to remove all government subsidies on fossil fuels such as diesel, petrol and coal.

Why should coal mining companies get a tax break where there is no tax break for solar thermal power stations?

Back to top

« Last Edit: Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 8:16pm by muso »

1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

IP Logged

rabbitoh07

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 2783
Gender: male

Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)
Reply #2 - Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 8:41pm

mantra wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Does anyone really understand how the ETS is going to benefit the environment?

Yes. ETS's have been in place and benefitting the environment for decades.

It is a proven strategy to reduce emissions:
http://www.epa.gov/capandtrade/programs.html

Personally - I would prefer to see a straight tax. But you cannot deny that ETS's have been used successfully in the past - so there is no reason to assume they will not work again.

Back to top

IP Logged

Ajax

Gold Member

Offline

CO2 has never controlled
temperature on Earth

Posts: 11070
Australia
Gender: male

Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)
Reply #3 - Jul 23^rd, 2013 at 2:54pm

The carbon tax or the ETS will do nothing to curbe CO2 emissions, infact once its up and running people like Al Gore will make sure CO2 emissions keep on increasing so his company can fleece nations by selling carbon credits to them.

And when that time comes BOY will i rub it into those greenies.

Have a look at the European model which is the one we will be joining.

Its a sham.

Back to top

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

IP Logged

muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS) Reply #4 - Jul 23^rd, 2013 at 3:01pm Well it already has done something for emissions. Coal Fired Power Stations are doing it tough. The traders have the less efficient ones cranked right back, and energy sources from gas turbines and renewables are flat out.
Back to top	1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not IP Logged

Ajax

Gold Member

Offline

CO2 has never controlled
temperature on Earth

Posts: 11070
Australia
Gender: male

Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)
Reply #5 - Jul 23^rd, 2013 at 3:15pm

Quote:

Failed carbon tax pays billions to coal power stations
Generators have received $1 billion in government compensation money in the six months since the carbon price has been in place, the report prepared for lobby group Environment Victoria says.
The report estimates generators will receive between $2.3 billion and $5.4 billion, depending on the future carbon price, unless the compensation system is reviewed.

Which businessman, elite, mogul, would do anything to change that??!!!

FAIL..............................................................

Back to top

1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax
2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos

IP Logged

Dnarever

Gold Member

Offline

Australian Politics

Posts: 62035
Here
Gender: male

Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS)
Reply #6 - Jul 23^rd, 2013 at 4:22pm

rabbitoh07 wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 8:41pm:

mantra wrote on Jul 22^nd, 2013 at 7:26pm:

Does anyone really understand how the ETS is going to benefit the environment?

Yes. ETS's have been in place and benefitting the environment for decades.

It is a proven strategy to reduce emissions:
http://www.epa.gov/capandtrade/programs.html

Personally - I would prefer to see a straight tax. But you cannot deny that ETS's have been used successfully in the past - so there is no reason to assume they will not work again.

Personally - I would prefer to see a straight tax.

Almost a Tony Abbott quote ?

Back to top

IP Logged

Ajax Gold Member Offline CO2 has never controlled temperature on Earth Posts: 11070 Australia Gender:	Re: Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS) Reply #7 - Jul 24^th, 2013 at 1:59pm Plantng more trees will do more than trading carbon credits on the stock exchange.
Back to top	1. There has never been a more serious assault on our standard of living than Anthropogenic Global Warming..Ajax 2. "One hour of freedom is worth more than 40 years of slavery & prison" Regas Feraeos IP Logged