Australian Politics Forum - why attacking Abbott won't work

sexy_beast

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #15 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:45pm

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:32pm:

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:22pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:11pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 1:53pm:

I disagree. Abbott is the one problem the Libs have as a credible alternative. The electorate might hate Labor, but they have not warmed to Abbott.

Labor need to sell their own policies - but the fears in the electorate about Abbott are already there.

Put simply, Tony Abbott is not one of us. He's a DLP company man, and has been all his life.

Attacking Abbott WILL work, but it won't get Labor over the line. People want them out so much they're prepared to risk Abbott.

Alas, Australia will get the government it deserves.

The LIBs put in Nelson and Turnbull - the 2PP and the personal preferences was incredibly low

with Abbott in - the 2PP are now 10 points ahead

Yes, but the electorate are reacting against Labor. They're not voting FOR Abbott.

They're reacting to the ousting of Rudd and the "no carbon tax" line. They don't trust Gillard.

But they've never liked Abbott too much either, and I'd trust him even less.

Abbott is tricky. He's an intellectual, and Australians hate intellectuals. He's on the far-right. He's a denialist fossil fuel man. He's got sinister connections to the Catholic hierarchy.

Abbott is not the man for the current age, and people know this.

Still, he'll get their vote, so there's no need for you to worry.

Then why have you supported him, and berrated Gillard for her lying?

Because I support Matty 100%, Sexy. It's an old-fashioned value called loyalty.

I wish Matty knew about it.

Still, his return will be thunderous. I live in hope.

Will someone, anyone, please please tell me who he is?!

This forum is so confusing.

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Enquiring mind

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #16 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:46pm

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:43pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:10pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 1:53pm:

I disagree. Abbott is the one problem the Libs have as a credible alternative. The electorate might hate Labor, but they have not warmed to Abbott.

Labor need to sell their own policies - but the fears in the electorate about Abbott are already there.

Put simply, Tony Abbott is not one of us. He's a DLP company man, and has been all his life.

Attacking Abbott WILL work, but it won't get Labor over the line. People want them out so much they're prepared to risk Abbott.

Alas, Australia will get the government it deserves.

The LIBs put in Nelson and Turnbull - the 2PP and the personal preferences was incredibly low

with Abbott in - the 2PP are now 10 points ahead

And both were leader whilst the most popular PM in history was in office.

Put either of those decent thoughtful men in the position now & the Coalition would be 30 points ahead, not 10 & losing ground.

why would we want to be 30 points ahead when 10 is more than enough?

Why would you want a sensible alternative vision for Australia when you can just mouth platitudes and get elected?

This isn't just a question for Abbott, it's a question for the very possibility of democracy in this country.

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Dsmithy70

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #17 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:47pm

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:42pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:36pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:29pm:

The only thing Abbott has done is simplified the attack on Labor. He's turned complex problems into one-liners, and he's riding a sense of resentment and a mistrust of politicians as a whole.

That's quite funny, at the Q&A session that Julie Bishop had the other month with a room of about 100 AUS/USA people she mentioned this.

I can't remember the topic now, but she said that there was a discussion and added -

"Tony just wanted 1 line to go with for the Press, he wasn't interested in the detail he said because it will get lost in the message. He wanted it so it was clear to the Public, that's Tony's strength."

That's exactly the thing that worries me about the guy.
His potential to fly off the handle without getting the detail.

Certainly he's improving in this area

Media savvy is not something that he excelled as Rudd - but neither did any of the previous LIB leaders

Well he better improve pretty quickly, less than 12 months to go.

As much as Abbott hopes the general public will "Maintain the RAGE" against Gillard therefore allowing him to be a policy & detail free zone, he is sadly mistaken.

Average Joe may not give a toss about politics for 2 years & 46 weeks but once the election is called they want to know what you stand for & how your going to pay for it.

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REBELLION is not what most people think it is.
REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself.
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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #18 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:47pm

Oh yeah, old Matty.

I have been on here very periodically for some time now because of work - hence only weekends I get that much time.

Matty was a 21 year old guy who lived at home if I recall rightly.
I assume from Karnal's message he has been banned or gone elsewhere etc.

Used to start every topic with a very random question of "Why am I not moderate?" or words to that effect?

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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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sexy_beast

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #19 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:48pm

Labor's main problem is Gillard. People just don't trust her, and they never will. It wouldn't matter who the Libs had as leader, Gillard just won't win them the election. That's ALL it comes down to. If they put in another leader, the polls would be tighter. 55-45 is an absolute hiding. It's telling that Labor actually celebrated a 53-47 poll a few weeks ago.

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #20 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:46pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:43pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:10pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 1:53pm:

I disagree. Abbott is the one problem the Libs have as a credible alternative. The electorate might hate Labor, but they have not warmed to Abbott.

Labor need to sell their own policies - but the fears in the electorate about Abbott are already there.

Put simply, Tony Abbott is not one of us. He's a DLP company man, and has been all his life.

Attacking Abbott WILL work, but it won't get Labor over the line. People want them out so much they're prepared to risk Abbott.

Alas, Australia will get the government it deserves.

The LIBs put in Nelson and Turnbull - the 2PP and the personal preferences was incredibly low

with Abbott in - the 2PP are now 10 points ahead

And both were leader whilst the most popular PM in history was in office.

Put either of those decent thoughtful men in the position now & the Coalition would be 30 points ahead, not 10 & losing ground.

why would we want to be 30 points ahead when 10 is more than enough?

Why would you want a sensible alternative vision for Australia when you can just mouth platitudes and get elected?

This isn't just a question for Abbott, it's a question for the very possibility of democracy in this country.

Such as "Hope", "Change" and "Yes we can!" you mean?
Sure I've seen someone do that before?

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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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sexy_beast

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #21 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:47pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:42pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:36pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:29pm:

The only thing Abbott has done is simplified the attack on Labor. He's turned complex problems into one-liners, and he's riding a sense of resentment and a mistrust of politicians as a whole.

That's quite funny, at the Q&A session that Julie Bishop had the other month with a room of about 100 AUS/USA people she mentioned this.

I can't remember the topic now, but she said that there was a discussion and added -

"Tony just wanted 1 line to go with for the Press, he wasn't interested in the detail he said because it will get lost in the message. He wanted it so it was clear to the Public, that's Tony's strength."

That's exactly the thing that worries me about the guy.
His potential to fly off the handle without getting the detail.

Certainly he's improving in this area

Media savvy is not something that he excelled as Rudd - but neither did any of the previous LIB leaders

Well he better improve pretty quickly, less than 12 months to go.

As much as Abbott hopes the general public will "Maintain the RAGE" against Gillard therefore allowing him to be a policy & detail free zone, he is sadly mistaken.

Average Joe may not give a toss about politics for 2 years & 46 weeks but once the election is called they want to know what you stand for & how your going to pay for it.

I disagree. People couldn't have cared less about what Rudd stood before the 2007 election. All they cared about was Workchoices.

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Enquiring mind

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #22 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:45pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:32pm:

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:22pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:11pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 1:53pm:

I disagree. Abbott is the one problem the Libs have as a credible alternative. The electorate might hate Labor, but they have not warmed to Abbott.

Labor need to sell their own policies - but the fears in the electorate about Abbott are already there.

Put simply, Tony Abbott is not one of us. He's a DLP company man, and has been all his life.

Attacking Abbott WILL work, but it won't get Labor over the line. People want them out so much they're prepared to risk Abbott.

Alas, Australia will get the government it deserves.

The LIBs put in Nelson and Turnbull - the 2PP and the personal preferences was incredibly low

with Abbott in - the 2PP are now 10 points ahead

Yes, but the electorate are reacting against Labor. They're not voting FOR Abbott.

They're reacting to the ousting of Rudd and the "no carbon tax" line. They don't trust Gillard.

But they've never liked Abbott too much either, and I'd trust him even less.

Abbott is tricky. He's an intellectual, and Australians hate intellectuals. He's on the far-right. He's a denialist fossil fuel man. He's got sinister connections to the Catholic hierarchy.

Abbott is not the man for the current age, and people know this.

Still, he'll get their vote, so there's no need for you to worry.

Then why have you supported him, and berrated Gillard for her lying?

Because I support Matty 100%, Sexy. It's an old-fashioned value called loyalty.

I wish Matty knew about it.

Still, his return will be thunderous. I live in hope.

Will someone, anyone, please please tell me who he is?!

This forum is so confusing.

I know, Sexy. Maybe you could write to him c/o the Dunedin post office.

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sexy_beast

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #23 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:50pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:47pm:

Oh yeah, old Matty.

I have been on here very periodically for some time now because of work - hence only weekends I get that much time.

Matty was a 21 year old guy who lived at home if I recall rightly.
I assume from Karnal's message he has been banned or gone elsewhere etc.

Used to start every topic with a very random question of "Why am I not moderate?" or words to that effect?

Was he left or right/ Liberal or Labor?

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sexy_beast

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #24 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:50pm

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm:

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:45pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:32pm:

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:22pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:11pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 1:53pm:

I disagree. Abbott is the one problem the Libs have as a credible alternative. The electorate might hate Labor, but they have not warmed to Abbott.

Labor need to sell their own policies - but the fears in the electorate about Abbott are already there.

Put simply, Tony Abbott is not one of us. He's a DLP company man, and has been all his life.

Attacking Abbott WILL work, but it won't get Labor over the line. People want them out so much they're prepared to risk Abbott.

Alas, Australia will get the government it deserves.

The LIBs put in Nelson and Turnbull - the 2PP and the personal preferences was incredibly low

with Abbott in - the 2PP are now 10 points ahead

Yes, but the electorate are reacting against Labor. They're not voting FOR Abbott.

They're reacting to the ousting of Rudd and the "no carbon tax" line. They don't trust Gillard.

But they've never liked Abbott too much either, and I'd trust him even less.

Abbott is tricky. He's an intellectual, and Australians hate intellectuals. He's on the far-right. He's a denialist fossil fuel man. He's got sinister connections to the Catholic hierarchy.

Abbott is not the man for the current age, and people know this.

Still, he'll get their vote, so there's no need for you to worry.

Then why have you supported him, and berrated Gillard for her lying?

Because I support Matty 100%, Sexy. It's an old-fashioned value called loyalty.

I wish Matty knew about it.

Still, his return will be thunderous. I live in hope.

Will someone, anyone, please please tell me who he is?!

This forum is so confusing.

I know, Sexy. Maybe you could write to him c/o the Dunedin post office.

See this isn't making any sense to me. I sense deliberately so.

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Enquiring mind

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #25 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:51pm

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:47pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:42pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:36pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:29pm:

The only thing Abbott has done is simplified the attack on Labor. He's turned complex problems into one-liners, and he's riding a sense of resentment and a mistrust of politicians as a whole.

That's quite funny, at the Q&A session that Julie Bishop had the other month with a room of about 100 AUS/USA people she mentioned this.

I can't remember the topic now, but she said that there was a discussion and added -

"Tony just wanted 1 line to go with for the Press, he wasn't interested in the detail he said because it will get lost in the message. He wanted it so it was clear to the Public, that's Tony's strength."

That's exactly the thing that worries me about the guy.
His potential to fly off the handle without getting the detail.

Certainly he's improving in this area

Media savvy is not something that he excelled as Rudd - but neither did any of the previous LIB leaders

Well he better improve pretty quickly, less than 12 months to go.

As much as Abbott hopes the general public will "Maintain the RAGE" against Gillard therefore allowing him to be a policy & detail free zone, he is sadly mistaken.

Average Joe may not give a toss about politics for 2 years & 46 weeks but once the election is called they want to know what you stand for & how your going to pay for it.

I disagree. People couldn't have cared less about what Rudd stood before the 2007 election. All they cared about was Workchoices.

There was a lot more to it than that. Back then, believe it or not, people also wanted something done about climate change.

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #26 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:51pm

sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:50pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:47pm:

Oh yeah, old Matty.

I have been on here very periodically for some time now because of work - hence only weekends I get that much time.

Matty was a 21 year old guy who lived at home if I recall rightly.
I assume from Karnal's message he has been banned or gone elsewhere etc.

Used to start every topic with a very random question of "Why am I not moderate?" or words to that effect?

Was he left or right/ Liberal or Labor?

bugger knows.
My care factor on all that nonsense is not very high.
I remember very little about it, only the endless absurd questions on threads from him.

I rarely come on here these days.

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Anyone who lives within their means suffers from a lack of imagination - Oscar Wilde

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Dsmithy70 Gold Member Offline ire futuis vobismetipsis Posts: 13147 Newy Gender:	Re: why attacking Abbott won't work Reply #27 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:52pm Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm: Such as "Hope", "Change" and "Yes we can!" you mean? Sure I've seen someone do that before? LOL, so he had no policies or agenda like Abbott, nothing it was all a surprise?
Back to top	REBELLION is not what most people think it is. REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself. Gavin Nascimento IP Logged

Enquiring mind

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Re: why attacking Abbott won't work
Reply #28 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:52pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:49pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:46pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:43pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:10pm:

Maqqa wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:08pm:

Enquiring mind wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 1:53pm:

I disagree. Abbott is the one problem the Libs have as a credible alternative. The electorate might hate Labor, but they have not warmed to Abbott.

Labor need to sell their own policies - but the fears in the electorate about Abbott are already there.

Put simply, Tony Abbott is not one of us. He's a DLP company man, and has been all his life.

Attacking Abbott WILL work, but it won't get Labor over the line. People want them out so much they're prepared to risk Abbott.

Alas, Australia will get the government it deserves.

The LIBs put in Nelson and Turnbull - the 2PP and the personal preferences was incredibly low

with Abbott in - the 2PP are now 10 points ahead

And both were leader whilst the most popular PM in history was in office.

Put either of those decent thoughtful men in the position now & the Coalition would be 30 points ahead, not 10 & losing ground.

why would we want to be 30 points ahead when 10 is more than enough?

Why would you want a sensible alternative vision for Australia when you can just mouth platitudes and get elected?

This isn't just a question for Abbott, it's a question for the very possibility of democracy in this country.

Such as "Hope", "Change" and "Yes we can!" you mean?
Sure I've seen someone do that before?

Sure, but it sounded much nicer than wars on terror and axes of evil.

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Dsmithy70 Gold Member Offline ire futuis vobismetipsis Posts: 13147 Newy Gender:	Re: why attacking Abbott won't work Reply #29 - Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:53pm sexy_beast wrote on Sep 10^th, 2012 at 2:50pm: See this isn't making any sense to me. I sense deliberately so. bugger off then
Back to top	REBELLION is not what most people think it is. REBELLION is when you turn off the TV & start educating & thinking for yourself. Gavin Nascimento IP Logged