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Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action (Read 11667 times)

Dnarever

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #105 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:16pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 4:40pm:

Some info to help along. I think you are missing the point of solar panel or solar hot water systems(and other technology and new ones as they emerge) and that it is $100million per year till 2020

It is $1000 each for 100thousand homes per year. That is better incentive but it doesnt run for 10years so does not equal 1mill homes

One Million Roofs Solar Program
Borrowing a term previously used in California to promote solar energy use,54 a Coalition
Government will provide additional ongoing support for the use of solar energy by Australian
families and households.
Our goal is for one million additional solar energy roofs on homes by 2020, including either solar
power or solar water heating systems.
To achieve the goal of one million additional solar energy roofs by 2020, the Coalition will provide an
extra $1000 rebate for either solar panels or solar hot water systems. The program would be capped
at 100,000 rebates per year and would therefore be capped at a total cost of $100 million per year.
The rebate will be on top of existing incentives and will replace the current solar hot water incentive
when it ends. It is intended that the rebate will remain in place until 2020.
Installing an entry level 1kw solar panel on the average household roof will reduce CO2 emissions by
about 1.8 tonnes per year. Similarly, replacing an old peak electric hot water system with a solar hot
water system will reduce CO2 emissions by up to 3 tonnes per year.
Depending on the proportion of rebates provided for solar heating and solar panel, this initiative will
therefore provide an additional annual CO2 emissions reduction of 2.4 to 3 million tonnes by 2020.
Given their solar energy classification, heat pumps will be eligible under the program.
In consultation with the renewable energy sector, we will also consider the inclusion of ceramic fuel
cells and other new domestic technologies which may emerge.

Information from the Direct Action Plan document
http://www.liberal.org.au/~/media/Files/Policies%20and%20Media/Environment/The%2...

Looks like a pretty good scheme if it is affordable and actually goes ahead - I have no idea where they are going to get all the money for their commitments from.

Does this one look like a non core promise?

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progressiveslol

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #106 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:19pm

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:13pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:01pm:

Dsmithy70 wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 4:52pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 4:40pm:

Some info to help along. I think you are missing the point of solar panel or solar hot water systems(and other technology and new ones as they emerge) and that it is $100million per year till 2020

It is $1000 each for 100thousand homes per year. That is better incentive but it doesnt run for 10years so does not equal 1mill homes

One Million Roofs Solar Program
Borrowing a term previously used in California to promote solar energy use,54 a Coalition
Government will provide additional ongoing support for the use of solar energy by Australian
families and households.
Our goal is for one million additional solar energy roofs on homes by 2020, including either solar
power or solar water heating systems.
To achieve the goal of one million additional solar energy roofs by 2020, the Coalition will provide an
extra $1000 rebate for either solar panels or solar hot water systems.The program would be capped
at 100,000 rebates per year and would therefore be capped at a total cost of $100 million per year.
The rebate will be on top of existing incentives and will replace the current solar hot water incentive
when it ends. It is intended that the rebate will remain in place until 2020.
Installing an entry level 1kw solar panel on the average household roof will reduce CO2 emissions by
about 1.8 tonnes per year. Similarly, replacing an old peak electric hot water system with a solar hot
water system will reduce CO2 emissions by up to 3 tonnes per year.
Depending on the proportion of rebates provided for solar heating and solar panel, this initiative will
therefore provide an additional annual CO2 emissions reduction of 2.4 to 3 million tonnes by 2020.
Given their solar energy classification, heat pumps will be eligible under the program.
In consultation with the renewable energy sector, we will also consider the inclusion of ceramic fuel
cells and other new domestic technologies which may emerge.

Where's the 100 million coming from?
Or is that suddenly an insignificant number?

And it's per year???
700 million dollars by 2020

Pretty sure if labor can find the money to put us $200BILLION into debt, then liberals could find the small change of upwards of $1billion

Again, as in the beginning of the thread.

I DON'T GIVE A bugger WHAT LABOR IS OR HAS DONE.

I want to know where Tony is finding his money.

His not introducing new taxes(yeah right but PPL anyone)
His campaigned on COL so surely raising existing taxes is out of the question
Which only leaves cutting funding for current programs to fund these new ones.
Remember the 100 million is only a part of the package, his also giving tax $$ to polluters, he'll have to pay farmers to stop farming their land to plant trees, after all 60% of the plan is soil storage.

So we are getting up there, oh & his going to produce a surplus in his 1st term.

Really Progs, are you that gullible?

You will have to wait like the rest of us. It would be nice to forget what labor has done with putting us into $200Billion debt, but it isnt that easy.

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Dnarever Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 62129 Here Gender:	Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action Reply #107 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:21pm I can see the Liberals getting into power and saying that things are a lot worse than we expected, sorry but we can not keep and of our promises and blame Labor for it.
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progressiveslol

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #108 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:23pm

Dnarever wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:21pm:

I can see the Liberals getting into power and saying that things are a lot worse than we expected, sorry but we can not keep and of out promises blame Labor for it.

May very well happen. Only problem for liberals and I am sure they know it, is that this policy is to replace the well known lie, so will have trouble making the replacement a lie as well. Second, there is a reduction of 5% that they have committed to.

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Gist

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #109 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:29pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:18pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:17pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:13pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:09pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 2:29pm:

1. gravity is not the same. nice try though. Gravity has empirical evidence. Climate science has none.

Wrong again. There are mountains of proof for climate change, some of it on much better footings than the evidence for gravity.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong lolly?

You are not even close to being true.

So you've got nothing? I had no illusions that you did of course. You just keep those fingers firmly stuck in your ears and chanting "lolly, lolly, lolly..."

Nothing. How so. you made the statement you had evidence or the science has empirical evidence. Show us.

I made the claim? Wrong again! I think you will find that YOU made the claim. Look, I've even highlighted it for you because I know how much you love to stand up to anything you've said.

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

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progressiveslol

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #110 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:30pm

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:29pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:18pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:17pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:13pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:09pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 2:29pm:

1. gravity is not the same. nice try though. Gravity has empirical evidence. Climate science has none.

Wrong again. There are mountains of proof for climate change, some of it on much better footings than the evidence for gravity.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong lolly?

You are not even close to being true.

So you've got nothing? I had no illusions that you did of course. You just keep those fingers firmly stuck in your ears and chanting "lolly, lolly, lolly..."

Nothing. How so. you made the statement you had evidence or the science has empirical evidence. Show us.

I made the claim? Wrong again! I think you will find that YOU made the claim. Look, I've even highlighted it for you because I know how much you love to stand up to anything you've said.

So you want the evidence that gravity has empirical evidence?

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Gist

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #111 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:35pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:30pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:29pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:18pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:17pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:13pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:09pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 2:29pm:

1. gravity is not the same. nice try though. Gravity has empirical evidence. Climate science has none.

Wrong again. There are mountains of proof for climate change, some of it on much better footings than the evidence for gravity.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong lolly?

You are not even close to being true.

So you've got nothing? I had no illusions that you did of course. You just keep those fingers firmly stuck in your ears and chanting "lolly, lolly, lolly..."

Nothing. How so. you made the statement you had evidence or the science has empirical evidence. Show us.

I made the claim? Wrong again! I think you will find that YOU made the claim. Look, I've even highlighted it for you because I know how much you love to stand up to anything you've said.

So you want the evidence that gravity has empirical evidence?

Not quite... the original wording was:

Quote:

Scientist cannot definitively prove Gravity as well, are you denying it's existence as well?

And that was your response. So if you want to choose gravity, go ahead - show us your proof of gravity.

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

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progressiveslol

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #112 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:41pm

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:35pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:30pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:29pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:18pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:17pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:13pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:09pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 2:29pm:

1. gravity is not the same. nice try though. Gravity has empirical evidence. Climate science has none.

Wrong again. There are mountains of proof for climate change, some of it on much better footings than the evidence for gravity.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong lolly?

You are not even close to being true.

So you've got nothing? I had no illusions that you did of course. You just keep those fingers firmly stuck in your ears and chanting "lolly, lolly, lolly..."

Nothing. How so. you made the statement you had evidence or the science has empirical evidence. Show us.

I made the claim? Wrong again! I think you will find that YOU made the claim. Look, I've even highlighted it for you because I know how much you love to stand up to anything you've said.

So you want the evidence that gravity has empirical evidence?

Not quite... the original wording was:

Quote:

Scientist cannot definitively prove Gravity as well, are you denying it's existence as well?

And that was your response. So if you want to choose gravity, go ahead - show us your proof of gravity.

Thats fine Gist. I know what empirically testable means, thats what is important to me. Not educating you.

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philperth2010 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21097 Perth Gender:	Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action Reply #113 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:42pm Direct Action will not work.....Why do the right continue to ignore this fact???
Back to top	If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them. Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992) IP Logged

progressiveslol Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 17029	Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action Reply #114 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:43pm philperth2010 wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:42pm: Direct Action will not work.....Why do the right continue to ignore this fact??? Fact lol.
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John Smith Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 78311 Gender:	Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action Reply #115 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:46pm philperth2010 wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:42pm: Direct Action will not work.....Why do the right continue to ignore this fact??? because they can and because they are stuuuuupid ... when they can't bring it in they'll turn around and blame labor ...
Back to top	Our esteemed leader: I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus. IP Logged

Gist

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a human being!

Posts: 5476

Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #116 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:47pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:41pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:35pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:30pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:29pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:18pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:17pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:13pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:09pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 2:29pm:

1. gravity is not the same. nice try though. Gravity has empirical evidence. Climate science has none.

Wrong again. There are mountains of proof for climate change, some of it on much better footings than the evidence for gravity.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong lolly?

You are not even close to being true.

So you've got nothing? I had no illusions that you did of course. You just keep those fingers firmly stuck in your ears and chanting "lolly, lolly, lolly..."

Nothing. How so. you made the statement you had evidence or the science has empirical evidence. Show us.

I made the claim? Wrong again! I think you will find that YOU made the claim. Look, I've even highlighted it for you because I know how much you love to stand up to anything you've said.

So you want the evidence that gravity has empirical evidence?

Not quite... the original wording was:

Quote:

Scientist cannot definitively prove Gravity as well, are you denying it's existence as well?

And that was your response. So if you want to choose gravity, go ahead - show us your proof of gravity.

Thats fine Gist. I know what empirically testable means, thats what is important to me. Not educating you. I was just shooting my mouth off again. I haven't a clue really.

Fixed it for ya. Tongue

"When our military goes to war it should be for purposes and objectives clearly in Australia’s interests, not merely because the Americans want some company" - Malcolm Fraser (2012 Whitlam Oration)

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philperth2010

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #117 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:54pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:43pm:

philperth2010 wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:42pm:

Direct Action will not work.....Why do the right continue to ignore this fact???

Roll Eyes

Fact lol.

When 60% of abatement is set to come from soil sequestration it cannot work.....The science is unproven and will not deliver the reductions the Coalition claim it will.....Soil sequestration is not counted towards the protocol so it is a worthless exercise in futility to pursue this policy to combat climate change.....Unless Abbott can get the protocol changed his direct Action policy is crap!!!

Roll Eyes

http://www.crikey.com.au/2011/05/19/that-was-careless-hunts-climate-policy-just-...

The Coalition has committed to reducing greenhouse gas emissions by five per cent on 2000 levels by 2020. It proposes to achieve this target with a “Direct Action Plan” 1: a competitive grant scheme that would buy greenhouse gas reductions from businesses and farmers. Over the past decade various Australian governments have announced more than seven billion dollars of competitive grant schemes. The Australian National Audit Office (ANAO) and the Grattan Institute have reviewed competitive grant schemes in Australia and found that they:
 Take far longer to achieve their objectives than originally planned
 Achieve much less than expected
 Cost far more than was budgeted.
This analysis finds that the Coalition’s Direct Action Plan will cost far more than is budgeted for and is unlikely to find sufficient greenhouse gas reduction projects in order to reach the Coalition’s emissions reduction target.

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=12322

If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)

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John Smith

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Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #118 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:55pm

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:47pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:41pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:35pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:30pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 6:29pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:18pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:17pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:13pm:

Gist wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 3:09pm:

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 2:29pm:

1. gravity is not the same. nice try though. Gravity has empirical evidence. Climate science has none.

Wrong again. There are mountains of proof for climate change, some of it on much better footings than the evidence for gravity.

Don't you ever get tired of being wrong lolly?

You are not even close to being true.

So you've got nothing? I had no illusions that you did of course. You just keep those fingers firmly stuck in your ears and chanting "lolly, lolly, lolly..."

Nothing. How so. you made the statement you had evidence or the science has empirical evidence. Show us.

I made the claim? Wrong again! I think you will find that YOU made the claim. Look, I've even highlighted it for you because I know how much you love to stand up to anything you've said.

So you want the evidence that gravity has empirical evidence?

Not quite... the original wording was:

Quote:

Scientist cannot definitively prove Gravity as well, are you denying it's existence as well?

And that was your response. So if you want to choose gravity, go ahead - show us your proof of gravity.

Thats fine Gist. I know what empirically testable means, thats what is important to me. Not educating you. I was just shooting my mouth off again. I haven't a clue really.

Fixed it for ya. Tongue

lol

Our esteemed leader:
I hope that bitch who was running their brothels for them gets raped with a cactus.

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Dnarever

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Posts: 62129
Here
Gender: male

Re: Qanda Panel Exposes Direct Action
Reply #119 - Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 7:21pm

progressiveslol wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:23pm:

Dnarever wrote on Jul 3^rd, 2012 at 5:21pm:

I can see the Liberals getting into power and saying that things are a lot worse than we expected, sorry but we can not keep and of out promises blame Labor for it.

The media will hardly even mention the conservatives in terms of honesty in cases like this. They have got away with breaking promises for decades the rabid media crusaides are reserved for Labor.

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