Australian Politics Forum - frost this morning, therefore no global warming

freediver

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frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 8:46am

A picture really does say a thousand words. Thanks MOTR.

I have seen the skeptic version a thousand times here on this forum. Of course, they would never use a graph. It is usually something like "on may 10 1964 it was 28 degrees, and on August 16 1996 it was 24 degrees, therefor the earth is cooling". No matter how many times you point out the idiocy, they keep falling for it. Every week there is a different version of the same mistake.

The solar flare plot is also very informative, and very different from the picture painted by the 'skeptics'

http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1338535202/6#6

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« Last Edit: Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 8:52am by freediver »

SkepticsvRealists_500.gif (303 KB | 67 )

People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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mantra Gold Member Offline ozpolitic.com Posts: 10750 Gender:	Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming Reply #1 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 5:12pm This graph - as do most others, only go back a few decades. You need more comprehensive figures covering at least a century or two to ascertain whether this is normal or not. This very same pattern may have been repeated a dozen times over a few centuries.
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MOTR

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #2 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 5:20pm

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 5:12pm:

This graph - as do most others, only go back a few decades.

You need more comprehensive figures covering at least a century or two to ascertain whether this is normal or not.

This very same pattern may have been repeated a dozen times over a few centuries.

Now you're talking reconstructions. There are some instrumental records that go back past 1860 but they are limited.

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« Last Edit: Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 5:25pm by MOTR »

Hunt says Coalition accepts IPCC findings

"What does this mean? It means that we need to do practical things that actually reduce emissions."

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MOTR Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6646	Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming Reply #3 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 5:32pm Graphs play an important role in communicating what is going on. This is another effective graph. It provides three trend lines. One for La Nina years, another for El Nino years and another for years unaffected by either phenomenon.
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mantra

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #4 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

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« Last Edit: Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:57pm by mantra »

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progressiveslol

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #5 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:05pm

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

Not an unusual graph over history. Just looks good until you put CO2 correlation against temperature. You have a correlation for a short period of time, then you have CO2 continuing to go up and temperature staying flat.

The AGW'ers need new fudged graphs to make their point.

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muso

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #6 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

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1523 people like this. The remaining 7,134,765,234 do not

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progressiveslol

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #7 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:42pm

muso wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

Yes those prediction have been done to death. The outcomes just fail to go along with them.

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Uncle Meat

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #8 - Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:43pm

muso wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

Here we go again.

Fear mongering based on speculation.

These AGW disciples are worse than a cult.

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skippy.

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #9 - Jun 3^rd, 2012 at 3:21pm

Uncle Meat wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:43pm:

muso wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

Here we go again.

Fear mongering based on speculation.

These AGW disciples are worse than a cult.

Opposed to ignorance based on, oh yes, IGNORANCE. Roll Eyes

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freedivers other forum- POLITICAL ANIMAL
Click onWWW below

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MOTR

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #10 - Jun 5^th, 2012 at 5:08am

Uncle Meat wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:43pm:

muso wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

Here we go again.

Fear mongering based on speculation.

These AGW disciples are worse than a cult.

All future warnings are based on speculation. 97% of climate scientists are telling us that these outcomes are very likely, but that's not good enough for Uncle Meat. Many of the passengers aboard the Titanic thought the warnings it was going to sink were unjustified. Perhaps when Uncle Meat finishes his Gin and Tonic we can get down to the business of acting on this threat.

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Hunt says Coalition accepts IPCC findings

"What does this mean? It means that we need to do practical things that actually reduce emissions."

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MOTR

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #11 - Jun 5^th, 2012 at 5:14am

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The second graph doesn't include the last decade of warming and may well have a different base period. I've got to get to work, I'll have a look at it when I get back.

The pace of warming is quite unusual and unexplained by anything else other than anthropogenically generated CO2. With only positive feedback effects on the horizon it is time to act.

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Hunt says Coalition accepts IPCC findings

"What does this mean? It means that we need to do practical things that actually reduce emissions."

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progressiveslol

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #12 - Jun 5^th, 2012 at 6:31am

MOTR wrote on Jun 5^th, 2012 at 5:08am:

Uncle Meat wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:43pm:

muso wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

Here we go again.

Fear mongering based on speculation.

These AGW disciples are worse than a cult.

All future warnings are based on speculation. 97% of climate scientists are telling us that these outcomes are very likely, but that's not good enough for Uncle Meat. Many of the passengers aboard the Titanic thought the warnings it was going to sink were unjustified. Perhaps when Uncle Meat finishes his Gin and Tonic we can get down to the business of acting on this threat.

Uncle meat surely knows that your 97% figure is total BS, so not much point trying to use it to lift a failed position.

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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people died for this!

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #13 - Jun 5^th, 2012 at 4:15pm

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

All true, but another example of a complex system is an economy!

Should none of us listen to economists if they predict bad things to come?

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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people died for this!

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Re: frost this morning, therefore no global warming
Reply #14 - Jun 5^th, 2012 at 4:17pm

Uncle Meat wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 11:43pm:

muso wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 9:24pm:

mantra wrote on Jun 2^nd, 2012 at 6:11pm:

MOTR

So the first graph indicates that over 90 years the average temperature has increased by .6 of a degree. The following graph claims that the temperature has increased by nearly 1 degree over 45 years.

It's still a very short period to judge where the temperatures are going especially as they're moving so slowly.

The point is that there is underlying physics that is sound. The predicted Greenhouse Gas emissions for the next 30 or 40 years will almost certainly result in catastrophic effects in terms of reducing crop yields, total crop failures in some cases, changes in weather patterns, a reduction in glacier mass in such mountain ranges as the Himalayas, the Alps and the Rockies. And a reduction in these glaciers' ice mass means considerably less water supply.

Here we go again.

Fear mongering based on speculation.

These AGW disciples are worse than a cult.

UNCLE MEAT DOESN'T LISTEN TO ECONOMISTS WHEN THEY PREDICT DISASTER!

Still touching up the unborn Mr Meat??

Embarrassed

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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