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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #120 - May 26^th, 2012 at 12:56pm

mozzaok wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:54pm:

Quote:

Granted the term "race" has morphed over the years. Perhaps it is time it was more tightly defined or dropped altogether.

- Glee

Spot on Glee, you saying it has morphed is spot on, it has become a lot more encompassing than 18th century ideas of race being restricted to Caucusoid, Negroid, or Mongoloid, were, and I think how it is used today works reasonably well, and most people do understand it as it is currently understood, which is why I said where people try to limit it's meaning back to that of 100 years ago or more, usually do so because of their own personal agenda, and their desire to self justify.

Still fails the test though. Jewish is a religion not a race.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #121 - May 26^th, 2012 at 12:58pm

mantra wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:55pm:

Sir Spot of Borg wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:41pm:

mantra wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:15pm:

The Jews and the Muslims are both descendants of Abraham.

Abraham is a fictional character. That is not an acceptable answer.

SOB

That's strange. I thought he was mentioned in the Bible - maybe the OT. To those who are religious - the Bible, Quran and the Siddur/Tanakh or whatever it's called, all contain real life characters. Surely Abraham gets a mention somewhere?

Fictional characters cannot be used to define a lineage except maybe micky mouse. If you are religious you can believe whatever you want but it doesnt negate facts and you cant use it in place of facts.

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #122 - May 26^th, 2012 at 12:58pm

mozzaok wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:54pm:

Quote:

Granted the term "race" has morphed over the years. Perhaps it is time it was more tightly defined or dropped altogether.

- Glee

Spot on Glee, you saying it has morphed is spot on, it has become a lot more encompassing than 18th century ideas of race being restricted to Caucusoid, Negroid, or Mongoloid, were, and I think how it is used today works reasonably well, and most people do understand it as it is currently understood, which is why I said where people try to limit it's meaning back to that of 100 years ago or more, usually do so because of their own personal agenda, and their desire to self justify.

To add to that, calling someone "jew boy" is racially insulting.
You are not attacking his argument, you are not making any point, you are merely attempting to insult him based on him being Jewish.

That is bigotry. Nothing else.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #123 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:05pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:58pm:

mozzaok wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:54pm:

Quote:

Granted the term "race" has morphed over the years. Perhaps it is time it was more tightly defined or dropped altogether.

- Glee

Spot on Glee, you saying it has morphed is spot on, it has become a lot more encompassing than 18th century ideas of race being restricted to Caucusoid, Negroid, or Mongoloid, were, and I think how it is used today works reasonably well, and most people do understand it as it is currently understood, which is why I said where people try to limit it's meaning back to that of 100 years ago or more, usually do so because of their own personal agenda, and their desire to self justify.

To add to that, calling someone "jew boy" is racially insulting.
You are not attacking his argument, you are not making any point, you are merely attempting to insult him based on him being Jewish.

That is bigotry. Nothing else.

Unlike calling ppl "stupid" and "idiot" and "uneducated" and "asshole" etcetc etcetc

oh and "beaner" whatever that is

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glee

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #124 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:06pm

mozzaok wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:54pm:

Quote:

Granted the term "race" has morphed over the years. Perhaps it is time it was more tightly defined or dropped altogether.

- Glee

Spot on Glee, you saying it has morphed is spot on, it has become a lot more encompassing than 18th century ideas of race being restricted to Caucusoid, Negroid, or Mongoloid, were, and I think how it is used today works reasonably well, and most people do understand it as it is currently understood, which is why I said where people try to limit it's meaning back to that of 100 years ago or more, usually do so because of their own personal agenda, and their desire to self justify.

I think the way it works today is confusing to be honest. I would be more than happy to see the "race" dropped out of the term "racial vilification" and just keep the "vilification". At least that way we concentrate on the individual and not the collective.

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Andrei.Hicks Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 23818 Carlsbad, CA Gender:	Re: Anti-Semitism Reply #125 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm Nope. Totally different. None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion. Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable. If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.
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glee

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #126 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:23pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Is calling refugees that come by boat "human garbage" the same thing?

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #127 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:30pm

glee wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:23pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Is calling refugees that come by boat "human garbage" the same thing?

Nope.
That is assessing them on their economic value to the country, what they are bringing to the country, disease,crime, problems etc.

It makes no reference at all to their ethnic heritage or racial or religious grouping.
Refugees for example who come to England I would class in similar terms and some are ethnically and racially the same as me.

So no, it is not racial vilification in any way.

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muso

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #128 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:34pm

mantra wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:22pm:

glee wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:19pm:

Still not a race, like Muslim is not a race. Anyone can convert to either. Sammy Davis Junior became a Jew by conversion didn't he?

True - but both religions are basically comprised of people predominantly being Arab in ancestry.

That's incorrect. Most Muslims are not Arabs and very few jews are Arabs. Arabs form a minority of the Muslim population.

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MOTR

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #129 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:37pm

glee wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:23pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Is calling refugees that come by boat "human garbage" the same thing?

Yes it's the same thing in my book.

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muso

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #130 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:40pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Attacking anybody because of their religion is unacceptable, however criticising a religion is ok.

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Sir Spot of Borg

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #131 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:40pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Unacceptable to you that is. Thing is the way anyone uses a racial epithet in this forum is to insult the person it is being used on. It is not in fact insulting a whole race. Same as calling someone an idiot. Meant to insult the person in question. Ppl here all like to insult each other. Its what they do.

Races or religions in another context are used on this forum to refer to a group of ppl. In context to discuss them. EG when discussing xtian atrocities, muslim atrocities or jewish atrocities. Everyone knows that the group referred to is the one committing the atrocities not ALL of that race or religion. Of course there are idiots who cant tell the difference or pretend not to be able to tell the difference.

you know full well that it isnt meant in an all encompassing way like freediver does about muslims.

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glee

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #132 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:41pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:30pm:

glee wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:23pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Is calling refugees that come by boat "human garbage" the same thing?

Nope.
That is assessing them on their economic value to the country, what they are bringing to the country, disease,crime, problems etc.

It makes no reference at all to their ethnic heritage or racial or religious grouping.
Refugees for example who come to England I would class in similar terms and some are ethnically and racially the same as me.

So no, it is not racial vilification in any way.

And you have proof of that?

Seems to me Andrei that you cherry pick what is vilification and what is not, based on your own biases/bigotry and not on any other reason.

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MOTR

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #133 - May 26^th, 2012 at 1:42pm

muso wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:34pm:

mantra wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:22pm:

glee wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 12:19pm:

Still not a race, like Muslim is not a race. Anyone can convert to either. Sammy Davis Junior became a Jew by conversion didn't he?

True - but both religions are basically comprised of people predominantly being Arab in ancestry.

That's incorrect. Most Muslims are not Arabs and very few jews are Arabs. Arabs form a minority of the Muslim population.

A question I find interesting is which people have closer blood links to the people who inhabited Israel 2000 years ago. The Palestinians or the Jewish immigrants?

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nairbe

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Re: Anti-Semitism
Reply #134 - May 26^th, 2012 at 2:41pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:30pm:

glee wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:23pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on May 26^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Nope.
Totally different.
None of those singles out a group or person to insult purely based on their heritage/race/religion.

Attacking someone because they are Jewish is bigotry and unacceptable.

If you need the difference explained to you then you have a long way to go to understand.

Is calling refugees that come by boat "human garbage" the same thing?

Nope.
That is assessing them on their economic value to the country, what they are bringing to the country, disease,crime, problems etc.

It makes no reference at all to their ethnic heritage or racial or religious grouping.
Refugees for example who come to England I would class in similar terms and some are ethnically and racially the same as me.

So no, it is not racial vilification in any way.

This is a demonstration of pure bigotry. Selective in it's understanding and subjective in it's selection. You truly are a completely self absorbed person. It really is sad.

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