Australian Politics Forum - Religiosity and Narcissism

NorthOfNorth

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Religiosity and Narcissism
May 6^th, 2012 at 12:16pm

Is religiosity an expression of narcissistic sensibility?

In an early scene of the move "Samsara", the monk Tashi, is extricated from a cave in which he has been meditating for years. A senior monk fears that Tashi has succumbed to a craving for enlightenment and has strayed from the middle way. This proves to be true, as his desire, once piqued, expresses itself as sexual craving and soon he leaves the monastery after falling in love with Pema - a young, beautiful local woman. His secular life starts off well, but eventually unravels leaving him unable to escape the suffering of samsara and unable to return to his monastic life.

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Yadda Gold Member Offline Posts: 20956 A cat with a view	Re: Religiosity and Narcissism Reply #1 - May 6^th, 2012 at 2:28pm Is Yadda an obsessive ? I guess so. Dictionary; preoccupy = = dominate or engross the mind, to the exclusion of other thoughts.
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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Religiosity and Narcissism Reply #2 - May 6^th, 2012 at 2:45pm Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 2:28pm: Is Yadda an obsessive ? I guess so. Dictionary; preoccupy = = dominate or engross the mind, to the exclusion of other thoughts. And so the monk failed.
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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #3 - May 6^th, 2012 at 2:52pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 2:45pm:

And so the monk failed.

Meditation, is the practice of focusing our attention.

Is learning to keenly focus our attention a failure ?

The monk didn't learn how to control [his] desire, ....that, is a failure, in many of us.

And that particular failure in us, always has a particular cost.

Yes ?

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #4 - May 6^th, 2012 at 2:58pm

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 2:52pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 2:45pm:

And so the monk failed.

Meditation, is the practice of focusing our attention.

Is learning to keenly focus our attention a failure ?

The monk didn't learn how to control [his] desire, ....that, is a failure, in many of us.

And that particular failure in us, always has a particular cost.

Yes ?

The monk failed because his obsession with enlightenment drove him from detachment. His narcissism fuelled his arrogant obsession.

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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #5 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 12:16pm:

Is religiosity an expression of narcissistic sensibility?

In an early scene of the move "Samsara", the monk Tashi, is extricated from a cave in which he has been meditating for years.

A senior monk fears that Tashi has succumbed to a craving for enlightenment and has strayed from the middle way.

This proves to be true, as his desire, once piqued, expresses itself as sexual craving and soon he leaves the monastery after falling in love with Pema - a young, beautiful local woman. His secular life starts off well, but eventually unravels leaving him unable to escape the suffering of samsara and unable to return to his monastic life.

Surely, the attainment of enlightenment [if it can be attained].....
1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.
2/ and seeking enlightenment, is a worthy goal ???

Or, is seeking enlightenment, not a worthy path ? [....i jest]

Isn't to be on the path to enlightenment, to be on the 'correct' path ?

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #6 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:15pm

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.

The middle way, is the common way, the well trodden way ?

Yes ?

Wouldn't seeking enlightenment be a 'goat path' ? less distinct, less well trodden ? i.e. not the 'middle way'.

e.g.
Matthew 7:13
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #7 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Surely, the attainment of enlightenment [if it can be attained].....
1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.
2/ and seeking enlightenment, is a worthy goal ???

Or, is seeking enlightenment, not a worthy path ? [....i jest]

Isn't to be on the path to enlightenment, to be on the 'correct' path ?

The seeking of enlightenment, in the Buddhist tradition, can only be achieved by the cessation of craving, which includes not indulging in ascetic practises that drive the monk from detachment due to obsession.

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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #8 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:23pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Surely, the attainment of enlightenment [if it can be attained].....
1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.
2/ and seeking enlightenment, is a worthy goal ???

Or, is seeking enlightenment, not a worthy path ? [....i jest]

Isn't to be on the path to enlightenment, to be on the 'correct' path ?

The seeking of enlightenment, in the Buddhist tradition, can only be achieved by the cessation of craving, which includes not indulging in ascetic practises that drive the monk from detachment due to obsession.

Yadda paraphrases;

The way, the path, to enlightenment, is to not look for enlightenment.
Because to look for enlightenment, is to express a form of desire or a 'craving' [and this is an 'obsession' too].

???

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #9 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:24pm

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:23pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Surely, the attainment of enlightenment [if it can be attained].....
1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.
2/ and seeking enlightenment, is a worthy goal ???

Or, is seeking enlightenment, not a worthy path ? [....i jest]

Isn't to be on the path to enlightenment, to be on the 'correct' path ?

The seeking of enlightenment, in the Buddhist tradition, can only be achieved by the cessation of craving, which includes not indulging in ascetic practises that drive the monk from detachment due to obsession.

Yadda paraphrases;

The way, the path, to enlightenment, is not to look for enlightenment.
Because to look for enlightenment, is to express a desire or a 'craving' [and this is an 'obsession' too].

???

Hence the Buddhist adage that the middle way is thinner than the edge of a blade.

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Conviction is the art of being certain

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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #10 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:29pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:24pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:23pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Surely, the attainment of enlightenment [if it can be attained].....
1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.
2/ and seeking enlightenment, is a worthy goal ???

Or, is seeking enlightenment, not a worthy path ? [....i jest]

Isn't to be on the path to enlightenment, to be on the 'correct' path ?

The seeking of enlightenment, in the Buddhist tradition, can only be achieved by the cessation of craving, which includes not indulging in ascetic practises that drive the monk from detachment due to obsession.

Yadda paraphrases;

The way, the path, to enlightenment, is not to look for enlightenment.
Because to look for enlightenment, is to express a desire or a 'craving' [and this is an 'obsession' too].

???

Hence the Buddhist adage that the middle way is thinner than the edge of a blade.

Mmmm, that description conjures a sharp visual, ....err, edge. Wink

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #11 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:33pm

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:29pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:24pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:23pm:

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:17pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:08pm:

Surely, the attainment of enlightenment [if it can be attained].....
1/ surely, seeking enlightenment, is NOT a 'middle way'.
2/ and seeking enlightenment, is a worthy goal ???

Or, is seeking enlightenment, not a worthy path ? [....i jest]

Isn't to be on the path to enlightenment, to be on the 'correct' path ?

The seeking of enlightenment, in the Buddhist tradition, can only be achieved by the cessation of craving, which includes not indulging in ascetic practises that drive the monk from detachment due to obsession.

Yadda paraphrases;

The way, the path, to enlightenment, is not to look for enlightenment.
Because to look for enlightenment, is to express a desire or a 'craving' [and this is an 'obsession' too].

???

Hence the Buddhist adage that the middle way is thinner than the edge of a blade.

Mmmm, that description conjures a sharp visual, ....err, edge. Wink

Matthew 19:24
And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.

Grin

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Religiosity and Narcissism Reply #12 - May 6^th, 2012 at 3:51pm Are you detached from religiosity?
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Yadda

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Re: Religiosity and Narcissism
Reply #13 - May 6^th, 2012 at 4:32pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:51pm:

Are you detached from religiosity?

Define religiosity.

Grin

What do you think NoN ?

Is Yadda detached from religiosity?

I do not see myself as religiously ceremonial, but i try to keep the Sabbath.

But i do so, imperfectly, i think.

I've always been a fly by the seat of my pants kinda person, ....just like 'Vivian' [P.W.].

Can you believe that ? Grin

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Religiosity and Narcissism Reply #14 - May 6^th, 2012 at 4:55pm Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 4:32pm: NorthOfNorth wrote on May 6^th, 2012 at 3:51pm: Are you detached from religiosity? Define religiosity. Characterised by excessive religious expression...
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