Australian Politics Forum - Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!

MOTR

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #15 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 10:00am

Quote:

EVERY day, at least 13 asylum-seekers enter Australia through airports, representing 30 times the number of boat people that are supposedly "flooding" across our maritime borders.

A total of 4768 "plane people" - more than 96 per cent of applicants for refugee status - arrived by aircraft in 2008 on legitimate tourist, business and other visas compared with 161 who arrived by boat during the same period, the Sunday Telegraph reports.

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/national/asylum-seekers-arrive-by-plane-not-boat/story-e6...

I'm sure these stats have changed in recent years, but it is still true the vast majority of our asylum seekers arrive by plane.

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #16 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 10:02am

MOTR wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 9:55am:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 9:29am:

Peter Freedman wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 6:56am:

I have no doubt this topic has been done to death here, just like the "a" one! But I'm new here....

Asylum seekers are a minor molehill turned into a mountain. The number of asylum seekers is tiny. A bit more than NZ, for sure, but no-one wants to go there any more.......

Q1: So why are Australians so het up about this?

About three times as many seekers travel to Australia by plane than by sea. Yet Aussies don't seem to care about the plane people.

Q2: Why?

Q3 Who are the criminals here, the people smugglers or the boatpeople?

Your numbers on those arriving by plane do not match the numbers of plane arrivals in mandatory detention.
Please cite evidence when making outrageous claims!

83.5% of all so called asylum seekers are still claiming centrelink benefits up to 5 years after arriving in Australia.
The Labor and Leftist left out pension payments with centrelink,are they hoping nobody will notice?
Page 26 for this 83.5% still on welfare up to 5 years after arrival-
http://www.immi.gov.au/media/publications/research/_pdf/settlement-outcomes-new-...

3200 out of 3237 boat people surveyed said they disposed of their passport before coming to Australia by boat after flying into Indonesia with a passport.
That is almost 99% of those surveyed who threw away their passports.
A genuine refugee would have no reason to dispose of their passport
Source-http://www.minister.immi.gov.au/media/cb/2012/cb182430.htm

4 boat people were in detention when Labor came to power.

The last point you make and have highlighted is patently untrue.

Bowen: Well, in some cases, documentation is lost, that is fair. In some cases, in many cases, it is destroyed. And the decision maker can take into account the destroying of documents in determining credibility of the claim. But at the end of the day, somebody is a refugee or they're not. I know the Opposition says, ‘Well, if they didn't have documents we'd presume they're not a refugee.' Well, you can't do that under the Refugees Convention. They're a refugee or they're not and an independent decision maker has to make that decision. Are they at risk of persecution if you sent them back to the country they came from? And whether they've got documents or not, that can go to their credibility, but it can't be used to determine whether somebody's a genuine refugee or somebody is simply claiming to be a refugee and they're not

What reason would a genuine refugee have to dispose of their passport?

3200 out of 3237 surveyed that is almost 99% of them said they disposed of their passports before coming here by boat after flying into Indonesia with a passport.

Why do the leftists always avoid the fact that almost 99% of these people dispose of their passports?

The minister sidestepped these questions as well.

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MOTR Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 6646	Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN! Reply #17 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 10:03am FriYAY wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 9:35am: MOTR wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 7:09am: Our xenophobia was successfully exploited by John Howard so the conservatives have been pushing the button ever since. Convenient to ignore Gillard's Malaysia swap, Timor lie. Was she exploiting boat people as well? I agree.
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MOTR

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #18 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 10:10am

My understanding is that the people smugglers require them to destroy their passports. It is ridiculous to assume that DIAC was unable to confirm the identies of all the asylum seekers. I have dealt with the a number of boat arrivals in a professional capacity and their true identity is well known to the government.

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Peter Freedman

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #19 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 11:38am

Right a few facts:

1. I cannot provide sources to my claims because, under forum rules, I am not allowed to yet. As soon as I can, I will.

2.The public debate on asylum seekers has been focusing on boat arrivals, but government figures show that the large majority of asylum applicants arrive by plane.

This statement comes from a highly reputable news source. I can't tell you which, for the reason, see 1. When I can, I will. Until then you'll just have to find it yourself.

3. Australians get het up about boat people because politicians realise causing fear garners votes. If you don't believe this Google: "Hitler Jews" and go from there.

Howard took this path because he was doing what conservatives do.

Labour followed on and seem to be trying to be even nastier.

This is an absolute disgrace, so shameful that no-one should ever vote labor again until the party discovers its conscience again

Oh, yes, I am still a leftie, just one who thinks for himself.

Finally, for now, The criminals are, of course, the people smugglers. The victims are the boat people.

Punishing the victim makes about as much sense as deterring a rapist by constantly violating the woman he raped.

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bobbythefap1 Gold Member Offline Posts: 7026 Listen now to the rain	Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN! Reply #20 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 11:42am You wouldnt expect the media to focus on the facts would you peter haha
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Baronvonrort

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #21 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 12:54pm

Peter Freedman wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 11:38am:

1. I cannot provide sources to my claims because, under forum rules, I am not allowed to yet. As soon as I can, I will.
How convenient,what a load of crap

2.The public debate on asylum seekers has been focusing on boat arrivals, but government figures show that the large majority of asylum applicants arrive by plane.
The government statistics do not show this to be the case and you have been caught out telling lies

This statement comes from a highly reputable news source. I can't tell you which, for the reason, see 1. When I can, I will. Until then you'll just have to find it yourself.
A leftists news source?
The Governments detention statistics do not match the leftist lies

3. Australians get het up about boat people because politicians realise causing fear garners votes. If you don't believe this Google: "Hitler Jews" and go from there.
83.5% of them are still on welfare up to 5 years after arriving,the leftists would prefer to demonise those who point out the facts.

Howard took this path because he was doing what conservatives do.

Labour followed on and seem to be trying to be even nastier.

This is an absolute disgrace, so shameful that no-one should ever vote labor again until the party discovers its conscience again

Oh, yes, I am still a leftie, just one who thinks for himself.

Finally, for now, The criminals are, of course, the people smugglers. The victims are the boat people.
The leftists are useful idiots for the people smugglers

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #22 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 1:08pm

MOTR wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 10:00am:

Quote:

EVERY day, at least 13 asylum-seekers enter Australia through airports, representing 30 times the number of boat people that are supposedly "flooding" across our maritime borders.

A total of 4768 "plane people" - more than 96 per cent of applicants for refugee status - arrived by aircraft in 2008 on legitimate tourist, business and other visas compared with 161 who arrived by boat during the same period, the Sunday Telegraph reports.

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/national/asylum-seekers-arrive-by-plane-not-boat/story-e6...

I'm sure these stats have changed in recent years, but it is still true the vast majority of our asylum seekers arrive by plane.

We have mandatory detention for asylum seekers and your leftist article does not match the detention centre stats for 2008.
About 500 people in detention in 2008 and that includes visa overstayers who cannot claim asylum.
The leftists ignore the facts and pluck any old number from their asses
http://www.immi.gov.au/managing-australias-borders/detention/_pdf/immigration-de...

The leftist will claim most of them are found to be genuine refugees yet they contradict themselves when posting articles-
Quote:

In 2007-08 3978 claims for asylum were rceived and 1930 of these were approved

Some leftists claim 98% are refugees yet your cited article puts the figure at 48%.

I expect the dim witted leftists to ignore the governments statistics.

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... Gold Member Offline Posts: 23673 WA Gender:	Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN! Reply #23 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:05pm
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Uncle Meat

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #24 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:16pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Some leftists claim 98% are refugees yet your cited article puts the figure at 48%.

I expect the dim witted leftists to ignore the governments statistics.

Oh dear, the ignorance of some people is astounding.

"Data relating to the immigration detention population is dynamic and there can be delays in transmission of information from the department's immigration detention network operations.

Variations in figures between this report and previous issues can occur. Due to these issues, data from the current financial year should always be considered provisional."

http://www.immi.gov.au/managing-australias-borders/detention/_pdf/immigration-de...

The majority of boat people are granted refugee status.

(And, ... back in 1999, 97% of applicants from Iraq and 93% of applicants from Afghanistan, seeking asylum without valid visas, were recognised as genuine refugees.)

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Baronvonrort

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #25 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:28pm

Uncle Meat wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:16pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Some leftists claim 98% are refugees yet your cited article puts the figure at 48%.

I expect the dim witted leftists to ignore the governments statistics.

Oh dear, the ignorance of some people is astounding.

"Data relating to the immigration detention population is dynamic and there can be delays in transmission of information from the department's immigration detention network operations.

Variations in figures between this report and previous issues can occur. Due to these issues, data from the current financial year should always be considered provisional."

http://www.immi.gov.au/managing-australias-borders/detention/_pdf/immigration-de...

The majority of boat people are granted refugee status.

(And, ... back in 1999, 97% of applicants from Iraq and 93% of applicants from Afghanistan, seeking asylum without valid visas, were recognised as genuine refugees.)

The article your fellow leftist posted puts the figure at 48% accepted as refugees, that is less than half.

Can the leftists make up their mind or do they just pick a number that sounds good?

Those in detention also include visa overstayers who cannot claim asylum.

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Baronvonrort Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 19466 Gender:	Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN! Reply #26 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:30pm ... wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:05pm: Good video Honky. Do you think the leftist will watch it?
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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #27 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:39pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:30pm:

... wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:05pm:

Good video Honky.

Do you think the leftist will watch it?

Watch it? God no.

Howver, if pressed they will imply they watched it, by way of dropping a few words like "hateful" "bigoted" etc etc. You know the leftist script.

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Uncle Meat

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #28 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:54pm

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:28pm:

Uncle Meat wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:16pm:

Baronvonrort wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 1:08pm:

Some leftists claim 98% are refugees yet your cited article puts the figure at 48%.

I expect the dim witted leftists to ignore the governments statistics.

Oh dear, the ignorance of some people is astounding.

"Data relating to the immigration detention population is dynamic and there can be delays in transmission of information from the department's immigration detention network operations.

Variations in figures between this report and previous issues can occur. Due to these issues, data from the current financial year should always be considered provisional."

http://www.immi.gov.au/managing-australias-borders/detention/_pdf/immigration-de...

The majority of boat people are granted refugee status.

(And, ... back in 1999, 97% of applicants from Iraq and 93% of applicants from Afghanistan, seeking asylum without valid visas, were recognised as genuine refugees.)

The article your fellow leftist posted puts the figure at 48% accepted as refugees, that is less than half.

Can the leftists make up their mind or do they just pick a number that sounds good?

Those in detention also include visa overstayers who cannot claim asylum.

The majority of boat people are granted refugee status.

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olde.sault

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Re: Oh, no, not asylum seekers AGAIN!
Reply #29 - Mar 19^th, 2012 at 2:58pm

Karnal wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 9:52am:

FriYAY wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 9:35am:

MOTR wrote on Mar 19^th, 2012 at 7:09am:

Our xenophobia was successfully exploited by John Howard so the conservatives have been pushing the button ever since.

Convenient to ignore Gillard's Malaysia swap, Timor lie.

Was she exploiting boat people as well? Undecided

Yes, but she was led into it by Tony Abbott and the shockjocks.

After the ETS, it was the one policy area that was polling badly when Gillard took over from Rudd.

Rudd's policy on boat people was to say nothing and just hope it would all go away.

Gillard, following the ministrations of the factional Right (Mark Arbib, etc), was forced to address the issue.

Her first mistake was to announce the East Timor solution without talkling to the right people in East Timor.

Her second mistake was Malaysia.

Her third mistake wasn't a mistake at all, but a High Court ruling that banned offshore processing.

Labor's proposed legislation to work around the ruling was vetoed by Abbott for purely political purposes - what to do?

Comunity processing was the only thing left on the table, and the logical policy choice. It also solved the problem of children in detention.

Malaysia WAS a dud policy, as everybody knew. You didn't have to look too deeply to work out that it was all smoke and mirrors.

However, this issue is smoke and mirrors from all sides. All the Libs have is a mantra: stop the boats.

They won't be able to change the offshore processing decision and restablish Nairu without a majority in the Senate. They won't be able to turn boats back with the Navy's OH&S policies.

They will have their hands as tied as Labor now does. They will not stop any boats.

The senate won't pass Abbott's intention on boat people but he'll call for a double dissolution and that will be the end of the treacherous Greens and most of the Labor clowns who are fiddling while Gillard twists and turns on her axle of lies.

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