Jan wrote on Feb 25^th, 2012 at 9:16pm:


Aha! Now that statement alone infers that you that the 10-15 micron band is classified as radio waves.  That reinforces to me that you don't actually have a clue. Please stop pretending that you do.  You said previously that you were studying RF.

Jan wrote on Feb 25^th, 2012 at 2:39pm:


13 years, and you don't yet know the difference between radio waves and infrared radiation?  Maybe you should study something for which you have more aptitude, such as needlepoint.  Did this study of RF consist entirely of listening to demodulated RF on the 108-118MHz broadcast band?

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er no. 10-15 microns is actually infrared as I said previously. Most of the "cosmic radiation" is not actually electromagnetic radiation at all, with the exception of x-rays and gamma radiation. X-rays have a wavelength measured in nanometres or sub nanometres.

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Oh boy- Worse than I thought. He's a looney or he's suffering from advanced Alzheimers.  I think he means nanometres.

I'll have a look at his website if I get a chance. If that was a sample of his "knowledge" I hate to think what's on there. Maybe this site would be interested in featuring it:

http://www.crank.net/

I'll refer it if it's funny enough.

OK, Let's take a CO2 molecule in the upper atmosphere. Longwave infrared radiation from the Earth hits that molecule, it absorbs the radiation and the electrons in the C=O double bonds get excited. At certain frequencies, you get something like a symmetrical stretching, at other frequencies you get an asymmetrical stretching, and you can also get bending of the molecule for other IR wavelengths.

The energy is then given off in all directions. A bit like a dandelion seed head. The stem represents the original photon of IR radiation and the seeds represent the possible directions that the IR can be re-emitted. What that means is that some of the energy ends up going back down to Earth while some of it still heads out into space.

If you had no CO2 molecules (or other GHG's) then all the longwave radiation would head out to space. The presence of Greenhouse gases means that a portion of that heat energy stays in the Earth's lower atmosphere, causing the temperature to be warmer than it would otherwise.

If we look at the atmosphere as a large series of layers, we can express this effect mathematically starting from the ground and working your way up through progressively thinner and thinner atmosphere. Above a certain level, the water vapour component becomes negligible because the colder the atmosphere, the lower its water dewpoint.  I have a feeling that you wouldn't benefit from the maths, but I'll go through it if you like.

People have this preconception about anthropogenic global warming being somehow different from the natural  greenhouse effect. It isn't. Basically if you add CO2 to the atmosphere, you'll get an increased warming effect.

OK, so far so good. The equation that expresses the effect that greenhouse gases have on heat transfer is called the Radiative Forcing equation.

∆F =      5.35 ln(C/Co) in Watts per square metre.

Notice that the relationship between carbon dioxide and radiative forcing is logarithmic (ln is the natural log) so that increased concentrations have a progressively smaller warming effect.
That's why we generally talk in terms of warming effect for a doubling of CO2.

There are similar Radiative forcing equations for the other greenhouse gases.

Of course that's not everything yet. If it was just for CO2, you'd get a warming of around 1 degree for a doubling of CO2 concentration.

Doctor Jolly wrote on Feb 24^th, 2012 at 11:00am:


Anyone who still believes the crap about CO2 etc are ignorant of our planet and how it works and has worked.

We are carbon based creatures, and the entire planet WORKS on carbon. Previous ice ages have been in response to carbon increases ... ie When there were NO carbon producing industries, cattle stations, energy production, waste disposal, ad infinitum ...

OR it could be the perturbations of other celestial bodies passing our orbital path, but CO2 is the brainchild of the elite as another 'diversion' and a way to create more economic woes by emptying OUR pockets and filling theirs.

Yeah right! And it was YOUR OWN post altered first ... you can deny all you like but you know and I know you asked me what I knew about FORCING not transfer, simple as that. At no time did I even think about transfer, or answer it, because that is not what you asked. and I can't access your posts as you can mine.

Indirect measurements of OH using methyl chloroform have established that the globally weighted average OH concentration in the troposphere is roughly 106 radicals per cubic centimetre (Prinn et al., 2001; Krol and Lelieveld, 2003). A similar average concentration is derived using 14CO (Quay et al., 2000), although the spatial weighting here is different. Note that methods to infer global or hemispheric average OH concentrations may be insensitive to compensating regional OH changes such as OH increases over continents and decreases over oceans (Lelieveld et al., 2002). In addition, the quoted absolute OH concentrations (but not their relative trends) depend on the choice of weighting (e.g., Lawrence et al., 2001). While the global average OH concentration appears fairly well defined by these indirect methods, the temporal trends in OH are more difficult to discern since they require long-term measurements, optimal inverse methods and very accurate calibrations, model transports and methyl chloroform emissions data. From AGAGE methyl chloroform measurements,

It was bloody cold in Paramatta yesterday , so all that's crap and part of a global conspiracy. CO2 is good for your health. I have some for breakfast every morning. Don't talk technical sh1t with me mate. You're just trying to confuse me.

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LOL even the government paid 'experts?' show more humility than you do and admit 'they' could be wrong ... as I said previously nothing is caste in concrete.