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Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World (Read 6303 times)
Kytro
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Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:34pm  
Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World

Quote:
We don’t need nuclear power, coal, or biofuels. We can get 100 percent of our energy from wind, water, and solar (WWS) power. And we can do it today—efficiently, reliably, safely, sustainably, and economically.
We can get to this WWS world by simply building a lot of new systems for the production, transmission, and use of energy. One scenario that Stanford engineering professor Mark Jacobson and I developed, projecting to 2030, includes:
3.8 million wind turbines, 5 megawatts each, supplying 50 percent of the projected total global power demand
49 000 solar thermal power plants, 300 MW each, supplying 20 percent
40 000 solar photovoltaic (PV) power plants supplying 14 percent
1.7 billion rooftop PV systems, 3 kilowatts each, supplying 6 percent
5350 geothermal power plants, 100 MW each, supplying 4 percent
900 hydroelectric power plants, 1300 MW each, of which 70 percent are already in place, supplying 4 percent
720 000 ocean-wave devices, 0.75 MW each, supplying 1 percent
490 000 tidal turbines, 1 MW each, supplying 1 percent.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #1 - Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:43pm  
Kytro wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:34pm:
Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World

Quote:
We don’t need nuclear power, coal, or biofuels. We can get 100 percent of our energy from wind, water, and solar (WWS) power. And we can do it today—efficiently, reliably, safely, sustainably, and economically.We can get to this WWS world by simply building a lot of new systems for the production, transmission, and use of energy. One scenario that Stanford engineering professor Mark Jacobson and I developed, projecting to 2030, includes:
3.8 million wind turbines, 5 megawatts each, supplying 50 percent of the projected total global power demand
49 000 solar thermal power plants, 300 MW each, supplying 20 percent
40 000 solar photovoltaic (PV) power plants supplying 14 percent
1.7 billion rooftop PV systems, 3 kilowatts each, supplying 6 percent
5350 geothermal power plants, 100 MW each, supplying 4 percent
900 hydroelectric power plants, 1300 MW each, of which 70 percent are already in place, supplying 4 percent
720 000 ocean-wave devices, 0.75 MW each, supplying 1 percent
490 000 tidal turbines, 1 MW each, supplying 1 percent.



Pretty sure that lot won't come cheap...
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In the fullness of time...
 
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #2 - Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm  
Kytro wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:34pm:
Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World

Quote:
We don’t need nuclear power, coal, or biofuels. We can get 100 percent of our energy from wind, water, and solar (WWS) power. And we can do it today—efficiently, reliably, safely, sustainably, and economically.
We can get to this WWS world by simply building a lot of new systems for the production, transmission, and use of energy. One scenario that Stanford engineering professor Mark Jacobson and I developed, projecting to 2030, includes:
3.8 million wind turbines, 5 megawatts each, supplying 50 percent of the projected total global power demand
49 000 solar thermal power plants, 300 MW each, supplying 20 percent
40 000 solar photovoltaic (PV) power plants supplying 14 percent
1.7 billion rooftop PV systems, 3 kilowatts each, supplying 6 percent
5350 geothermal power plants, 100 MW each, supplying 4 percent
900 hydroelectric power plants, 1300 MW each, of which 70 percent are already in place, supplying 4 percent
720 000 ocean-wave devices, 0.75 MW each, supplying 1 percent
490 000 tidal turbines, 1 MW each, supplying 1 percent.


Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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Kytro
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #3 - Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #4 - Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am  
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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BatteriesNotIncluded
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #5 - Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:25am  
... wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:43pm:
Kytro wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:34pm:
Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World

Quote:
We don’t need nuclear power, coal, or biofuels. We can get 100 percent of our energy from wind, water, and solar (WWS) power. And we can do it today—efficiently, reliably, safely, sustainably, and economically.We can get to this WWS world by simply building a lot of new systems for the production, transmission, and use of energy. One scenario that Stanford engineering professor Mark Jacobson and I developed, projecting to 2030, includes:
3.8 million wind turbines, 5 megawatts each, supplying 50 percent of the projected total global power demand
49 000 solar thermal power plants, 300 MW each, supplying 20 percent
40 000 solar photovoltaic (PV) power plants supplying 14 percent
1.7 billion rooftop PV systems, 3 kilowatts each, supplying 6 percent
5350 geothermal power plants, 100 MW each, supplying 4 percent
900 hydroelectric power plants, 1300 MW each, of which 70 percent are already in place, supplying 4 percent
720 000 ocean-wave devices, 0.75 MW each, supplying 1 percent
490 000 tidal turbines, 1 MW each, supplying 1 percent.



Pretty sure that lot won't come cheap...

It's all scale: it's done!!!  Cheesy
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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BatteriesNotIncluded
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #6 - Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:26am  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Kytro wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 3:34pm:
Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World

Quote:
We don’t need nuclear power, coal, or biofuels. We can get 100 percent of our energy from wind, water, and solar (WWS) power. And we can do it today—efficiently, reliably, safely, sustainably, and economically.
We can get to this WWS world by simply building a lot of new systems for the production, transmission, and use of energy. One scenario that Stanford engineering professor Mark Jacobson and I developed, projecting to 2030, includes:
3.8 million wind turbines, 5 megawatts each, supplying 50 percent of the projected total global power demand
49 000 solar thermal power plants, 300 MW each, supplying 20 percent
40 000 solar photovoltaic (PV) power plants supplying 14 percent
1.7 billion rooftop PV systems, 3 kilowatts each, supplying 6 percent
5350 geothermal power plants, 100 MW each, supplying 4 percent
900 hydroelectric power plants, 1300 MW each, of which 70 percent are already in place, supplying 4 percent
720 000 ocean-wave devices, 0.75 MW each, supplying 1 percent
490 000 tidal turbines, 1 MW each, supplying 1 percent.


Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....

No, we don't!  Shocked Shocked Cool
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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BatteriesNotIncluded
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #7 - Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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gizmo_2655
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #8 - Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm  
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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qikvtec
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #9 - Oct 10th, 2011 at 9:27pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????


An elliptical orbit around the north pole?
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Politicians and Nappies need to be changed often and for the same reason.

One trouble with political jokes is that they often get elected.

Alan Joyce for PM
 
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Emma
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #10 - Oct 11th, 2011 at 12:41am  
now there's an idea.  Smiley  too bad no-one in power really gives a sh-t.

There ARE many ways to generate energy - and water power doesn't necessarily refer just to hydro-electric power generation.
I think it depends a lot on location.  The tidal forces generated in the world's oceans are there, now.  Places which have large tidal ranges between low and high tide, for example, have that power right at their door.  But no-one wants to seriously look at these types of things, because -  the PROFIT isn't there. Forget about the good of humanity.

As for solar power - another infinite resource - we are just STARTING !!  unbelievable as that may seem to rational beings.
I believe I've said it elsewhere, .. but anyway - I say - one size fits all - isn't the name of the game.

Nuclear???   You'd be an egotistical fool to think that humans can master such.  Of course, for those who don't think long-term, it presents an attractive power source that - generally- others will have to clean up at some time in the future.
BAD SHITE

Our cultural obsession with money and possessions and consumption does not suggest 'the common good' has any place in world politics today, and it should be the main goal of civilised cultures.

.......there's gonna be a hard rain ..thats gonna fall..




   
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live every day
 
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Kytro
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #11 - Oct 11th, 2011 at 9:51am  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....


Sure, my question was really in relation to the numbers they provided, which they seem to believe were readily available.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #12 - Oct 11th, 2011 at 2:19pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy ---->do your own homework!  Kiss
Back to top
 
*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #13 - Oct 11th, 2011 at 2:22pm  
Emma wrote on Oct 11th, 2011 at 12:41am:
now there's an idea.  Smiley  too bad no-one in power really gives a sh-t.

There ARE many ways to generate energy - and water power doesn't necessarily refer just to hydro-electric power generation.
I think it depends a lot on location.  The tidal forces generated in the world's oceans are there, now.  Places which have large tidal ranges between low and high tide, for example, have that power right at their door.  But no-one wants to seriously look at these types of things, because -  the PROFIT isn't there. Forget about the good of humanity.

As for solar power - another infinite resource - we are just STARTING !!  unbelievable as that may seem to rational beings.
I believe I've said it elsewhere, .. but anyway - I say - one size fits all - isn't the name of the game.

Nuclear???   You'd be an egotistical fool to think that humans can master such.  Of course, for those who don't think long-term, it presents an attractive power source that - generally- others will have to clean up at some time in the future.
BAD SHITE

Our cultural obsession with money and possessions and consumption does not suggest 'the common good' has any place in world politics today, and it should be the main goal of civilised cultures.

.......there's gonna be a hard rain ..thats gonna fall..




   

Necessity is the mother of invention! A carbon price changes everything as it breaks the blind growth cycle!  Cool
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Emma
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #14 - Oct 11th, 2011 at 3:04pm  
Necessity is the mother of invention! A carbon price changes everything as it breaks the blind growth cycle! - Death

hope so 'cos we've surely grown enough already.! Angry Cheesy
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #15 - Oct 11th, 2011 at 10:42pm  
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 11th, 2011 at 2:19pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy ---->do your own homework!  Kiss


Yep, that was the response I expected....You can't give the answers, because there aren't any....
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #16 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 1:01am  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 11th, 2011 at 10:42pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 11th, 2011 at 2:19pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy ---->do your own homework!  Kiss


Yep, that was the response I expected....You can't give the answers, because there aren't any....

hey gizmo, are you mr technology???? lol  Grin Grin Grin Kiss
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #17 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:31am  
lol

...
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #18 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:34am  
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 1:01am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 11th, 2011 at 10:42pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 11th, 2011 at 2:19pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 12:29am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 8:27am:
Kytro wrote on Oct 7th, 2011 at 7:31am:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 6th, 2011 at 9:51pm:
Well actually we DO need nuclear power...

If it's a choice between Co2 and nuclear...then Nuclear wins hands down,.....


I am not really opposed to nuclear, but what about the the provided list wouldn't work?


Water, in terms of Hydro-Electric power, does work, but there are limted numbers of rivers that can be used and most of the suitabe ones already have dams and hydro plants.

Solar and wind....well we all know the problems there.....the wind doesn't always blow, or it blows too hard, or not hard enough.....and the sun isn't always shining at an one spot on the world's surface....

24 hour solar power was done back in the 80s: it's done!

Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????

Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy ---->do your own homework!  Kiss


Yep, that was the response I expected....You can't give the answers, because there aren't any....

hey gizmo, are you mr technology???? lol  Grin Grin Grin Kiss


Obviously YES, compared to you......
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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BatteriesNotIncluded
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #19 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 9:40pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:34am:
Obviously YES, compared to you......

Gizmos got nada... i wonder if Gizmo is trying to chew up the whole of the internets address space!??!
  Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Cheesy Tongue
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #20 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:10pm  
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 9:40pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:34am:
Obviously YES, compared to you......

Gizmos got nada... i wonder if Gizmo is trying to chew up the whole of the internets address space!??!
 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Cheesy Tongue


Oh, I've got nada???
You're the one who won't provide the info to back up your statement...

YOU made the claim, so YOU back it up....
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
Bobbythebat
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #21 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:16pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:10pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 9:40pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:34am:
Obviously YES, compared to you......

Gizmos got nada... i wonder if Gizmo is trying to chew up the whole of the internets address space!??!
 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Cheesy Tongue


Oh, I've got nada???
You're the one who won't provide the info to back up your statement...

YOU made the claim, so YOU back it up....

...you telling me what to do pal?

...make me!!  Wink Wink

That's it, go push a lacky around to make yourself feel better!  Cheesy Grin Wink Wink
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #22 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:19pm  
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:16pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:10pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 9:40pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:34am:
Obviously YES, compared to you......

Gizmos got nada... i wonder if Gizmo is trying to chew up the whole of the internets address space!??!
 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Cheesy Tongue


Oh, I've got nada???
You're the one who won't provide the info to back up your statement...

YOU made the claim, so YOU back it up....

...you telling me what to do pal?

...make me!!  Wink Wink

That's it, go push a lacky around to make yourself feel better!  Cheesy Grin Wink Wink


Nah, don't have to 'make' you.......by not replying, you prove that solar is NOT 24 hour, and wasn't, even in the 80's.....

TTFN
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"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #23 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 11:01pm  
what happened to my reply to Cliff Richard???

You dirty dog - whoever you are - put my post up - what was wrong with it?

Don't tell me user error. Maybe it went somewhere else??
And - don't - whatever you do - tell me I'm paranoid. I sent a reply and I want to know where it is.
Was it moved?? mayhap?? Huh Maybe it's crossed in the mail - so to speak.!  Huh?

(Disclaimer: I accept no responsibility for any angst felt by any poster to this forum, whatever the topic, or whomever the Mod.).

Addendum: I apologise in advance .. should this disappearance prove to be my own doing. Grin Smiley Tongue

But it was about that utter moronic pig who mouthed off - the 'skrag' man, verbally abusing our Prime Minister. What a scumbag.  WHAT A SPECIMEN.!

Remind you of you????     PUKO.@!!@
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #24 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 11:04pm  
And
massive congrats  
Prime Minister Julia Gillard.  

Which was also part of the missing post.

Tongue Tongue Tongue Tongue
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #25 - Oct 12th, 2011 at 11:19pm  
Emma wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 11:01pm:
what happened to my reply to Cliff Richard???

You dirty dog - whoever you are - put my post up - what was wrong with it?

Don't tell me user error. Maybe it went somewhere else??
And - don't - whatever you do - tell me I'm paranoid. I sent a reply and I want to know where it is.
Was it moved?? mayhap?? Huh Maybe it's crossed in the mail - so to speak.!  Huh?

(Disclaimer: I accept no responsibility for any angst felt by any poster to this forum, whatever the topic, or whomever the Mod.).

Addendum: I apologise in advance .. should this disappearance prove to be my own doing. Grin Smiley Tongue

But it was about that utter moronic pig who mouthed off - the 'skrag' man, verbally abusing our Prime Minister. What a scumbag.  WHAT A SPECIMEN.!

Remind you of you????     PUKO.@!!@

ONE ANSWER= SHAM FORUM!  Roll Eyes
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #26 - Nov 19th, 2011 at 6:57pm  
Yes there are a lot ways to generate energy but I hope it does come cheap and environment friendly.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #27 - Nov 19th, 2011 at 9:07pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:19pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:16pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 10:10pm:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 9:40pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:34am:
Obviously YES, compared to you......

Gizmos got nada... i wonder if Gizmo is trying to chew up the whole of the internets address space!??!
 Shocked Shocked Shocked Shocked Cheesy Tongue


Oh, I've got nada???
You're the one who won't provide the info to back up your statement...

YOU made the claim, so YOU back it up....

...you telling me what to do pal?

...make me!!  Wink Wink

That's it, go push a lacky around to make yourself feel better!  Cheesy Grin Wink Wink


Nah, don't have to 'make' you.......by not replying, you prove that solar is NOT 24 hour, and wasn't, even in the 80's.....

TTFN

Abbott is sitting on a pile of cards and 20 million australians know it!

KNOCK KNOCK!

EVERY CRACK SMOKER IN THE LAND KNOWS HE HASN'T GOT  A PLAN FOR THE 21ST CENTURY!!

UNBRIDLED GREED died in the fires of 9-11 and the following unanswerable anthrax-in-the-mail attack!

The so called 'conservatives' have nothing to sell!!

BYE BYE abbott... the libs need a plan!!  Roll Eyes Wink Wink Wink Wink Wink Kiss
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #28 - Nov 19th, 2011 at 9:14pm  
Cliff Richard wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:31am:
lol

http://i.imgur.com/Jd3IO.png


true
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #29 - Nov 19th, 2011 at 9:25pm  
Sprintcyclist wrote on Nov 19th, 2011 at 9:14pm:
Cliff Richard wrote on Oct 12th, 2011 at 8:31am:
lol

http://i.imgur.com/Jd3IO.png


true

Unbridled greed died in the fires of 9-11 and the following unanswerable anthrax in the mail attacks!

How can the greedy hide behind Nuclear Weapons??

Lol, they know they can't! THEY DON'T HAVE THE ANSWERS AND THE VOTERS KNOW IT!!

IT'S ALL YIN-YANG AY!

BYE BYE GREEDY TRYHARDS!! YOU'RE ALL HATED FOR MAKING US TARGETS!!

  Cheesy Cheesy

BYE BYE SILVER SPOONERS TALKING ENDLESS SHITE WHILST HIGH ON CRACK: YOU'RE ALL HATED FOR MAKING US TARGETS!!

UNBRIDLED GREED is just a game unhappy people play!

Normal people just want to live!!

So, what have the so called 'conservatives' got to sell now?

  Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

Real conservatives aren't afraid of change and they will survive: the so  called 'conservatives' won't!

IT'S AS SIMPLE AS THAT!
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #30 - Nov 19th, 2011 at 10:01pm  
Lets hope so., it really should be the Death

Look forward to the back-end of Abbott.  Grin  Can't be long now.

Haven't been trying too hard to follow latest developments.   Unlike most of the serious posters  - I just cannot spend that same time.


Was rather excellent though... Smiley Smiley to see 'Bang Bang' losing face!!!!Hard as he tried not too.!!  Grin

A TOUGH COOKIE OUR PM!!!!

And where are all the whining  haters now? on this Board???
Staying pretty quiet, far as I can see.  Mind you - I might log on for long spans, but I can't spend too much time on this thing...so - if I've missed anything interesting - let  me know  Pls? Maybe there 's a topic of interest re Obama/Gillard/Bang Bang I've missed.
Im a bit mystified  - why is the focus around the Pacific Power all about economics, on this board? What have I missed./?
Economic policy is like politics......... a distraction, a buffer Zone , a riot barrier.

'take care of the pennies and the pounds take care of themselves'.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #31 - Nov 20th, 2011 at 12:09pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????



Of course you can't receive solar energy 24 hours  Grin However, you can store it, and various storage technologies have become routine overseas.

If (it's a big if) we could construct a world-wide HVDC grid, then 24 hour solar would be possible without even bothering about storage.

Now that's not too much of a pipe dream (don't take that wrong Jalane), because there are HVDC transmission lines 2000 km long. The longest so far is 2400km.

The advantage of HVDC is the low transmission losses and relatively low currents involved. (Think Ohms Law) A fairly thin conductor will work ok, but the switching circuits wear out very quickly.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #32 - Nov 20th, 2011 at 7:43pm  
'If (it's a big if) we could construct a world-wide HVDC grid, then 24 hour solar would be possible without even bothering about storage.

Now that's not too much of a pipe dream (don't take that wrong Jalane), because there are HVDC transmission lines 2000 km long. The longest so far is 2400km. ' - Muso

No probs... Smiley

Since I don't know what HVDC stands for.  Is it  High VoltageDC   ?? as opposed to AC/DC?

Huh

So we just need to develop better switching mechanisms?
Like those converters we use to change between diff volt.?
Shouldn't thing it will take long to solve that... given the exponential increase in tech these days.

But, after all, what do I know.??   SFA really. Smiley
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #33 - Nov 20th, 2011 at 10:36pm  
Oh yeah  
Been meaning to ask

I have not installed solar power -- I thought because I have no nth facing roof, and i have bulk tall trees around, that it wouldn't be efficient.

But I've been re-thinking.

This is real basic I know Embarrassed but if solar panels still collect on cloudy days,  .. just less efficiently, then surely  shading by trees is not proscriptive.  Is that so?

And my house gables face east and west, but the whole roof is in sun for much of the day.
Not a big roof mind you, galvanised - 15' ......

Would solar power suit my situation.  I've discussed it with a few people, but Smiley they weren't enthusiastic.

Why not?   Words of wisdom Muso??
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #34 - Nov 21st, 2011 at 8:03am  
Emma wrote on Nov 20th, 2011 at 10:36pm:
Oh yeah  
Been meaning to ask

I have not installed solar power -- I thought because I have no nth facing roof, and i have bulk tall trees around, that it wouldn't be efficient.

But I've been re-thinking.

This is real basic I know Embarrassed but if solar panels still collect on cloudy days,  .. just less efficiently, then surely  shading by trees is not proscriptive.  Is that so?

And my house gables face east and west, but the whole roof is in sun for much of the day.
Not a big roof mind you, galvanised - 15' ......

Would solar power suit my situation.  I've discussed it with a few people, but Smiley they weren't enthusiastic.

Why not?   Words of wisdom Muso??


It would probably work out as too expensive, but look into it yourself.  I think the government subsidy is going soon too.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #35 - Nov 21st, 2011 at 5:42pm  
muso wrote on Nov 20th, 2011 at 12:09pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????



Of course you can't receive solar energy 24 hours  Grin However, you can store it, and various storage technologies have become routine overseas.

If (it's a big if) we could construct a world-wide HVDC grid, then 24 hour solar would be possible without even bothering about storage.

Now that's not too much of a pipe dream (don't take that wrong Jalane), because there are HVDC transmission lines 2000 km long. The longest so far is 2400km.

The advantage of HVDC is the low transmission losses and relatively low currents involved. (Think Ohms Law) A fairly thin conductor will work ok, but the switching circuits wear out very quickly.

hvdc IS ALREADY IN aUSTRALIA!  Cheesy Grin Grin
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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is.  It wouldn't be there without the tax payer.  Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know....  (swaggy) *
 
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #36 - Nov 23rd, 2011 at 7:55am  
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 21st, 2011 at 5:42pm:
muso wrote on Nov 20th, 2011 at 12:09pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????



Of course you can't receive solar energy 24 hours  Grin However, you can store it, and various storage technologies have become routine overseas.

If (it's a big if) we could construct a world-wide HVDC grid, then 24 hour solar would be possible without even bothering about storage.

Now that's not too much of a pipe dream (don't take that wrong Jalane), because there are HVDC transmission lines 2000 km long. The longest so far is 2400km.

The advantage of HVDC is the low transmission losses and relatively low currents involved. (Think Ohms Law) A fairly thin conductor will work ok, but the switching circuits wear out very quickly.

hvdc IS ALREADY IN aUSTRALIA!  Cheesy Grin Grin


Yes it is. The link between Tasmania and Victoria is HVDC for example.  It's "only" 400kV.  A Global network would need to work on 1000kV.

It's not a limitation of technology. It's just a question of having the insight to construct a global network. It could be possible to justify it on the back of conventional energy generation, but there is minimal solar electricity to share at the moment. It's a small proportion.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #37 - Nov 23rd, 2011 at 10:31am  
muso wrote on Nov 23rd, 2011 at 7:55am:
BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on Nov 21st, 2011 at 5:42pm:
muso wrote on Nov 20th, 2011 at 12:09pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Oct 10th, 2011 at 8:57pm:
Riiiiight...
And of course you can tell us where it was done (the geographic location that receives sunlight for 24 hours a day, 365 days a year), what date or dates it happened, and who deigned and built it.....Can't you????



Of course you can't receive solar energy 24 hours  Grin However, you can store it, and various storage technologies have become routine overseas.

If (it's a big if) we could construct a world-wide HVDC grid, then 24 hour solar would be possible without even bothering about storage.

Now that's not too much of a pipe dream (don't take that wrong Jalane), because there are HVDC transmission lines 2000 km long. The longest so far is 2400km.

The advantage of HVDC is the low transmission losses and relatively low currents involved. (Think Ohms Law) A fairly thin conductor will work ok, but the switching circuits wear out very quickly.

hvdc IS ALREADY IN aUSTRALIA!  Cheesy Grin Grin


Yes it is. The link between Tasmania and Victoria is HVDC for example.  It's "only" 400kV.  A Global network would need to work on 1000kV.

It's not a limitation of technology. It's just a question of having the insight to construct a global network. It could be possible to justify it on the back of conventional energy generation, but there is minimal solar electricity to share at the moment. It's a small proportion.


It would also involve making agreements between countries to sell power to each other at a reasonable 'set' rate....
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It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #38 - Nov 23rd, 2011 at 3:02pm  
Emma wrote on Nov 20th, 2011 at 10:36pm:
Oh yeah  
Been meaning to ask

I have not installed solar power -- I thought because I have no nth facing roof, and i have bulk tall trees around, that it wouldn't be efficient.

But I've been re-thinking.

This is real basic I know Embarrassed but if solar panels still collect on cloudy days,  .. just less efficiently, then surely  shading by trees is not proscriptive.  Is that so?

And my house gables face east and west, but the whole roof is in sun for much of the day.
Not a big roof mind you, galvanised - 15' ......

Would solar power suit my situation.  I've discussed it with a few people, but Smiley they weren't enthusiastic.

Why not?   Words of wisdom Muso??

Your panels don't have to be on the roof, you could build a small structure just for your panels, I have a neighbour that did just that.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #39 - Nov 23rd, 2011 at 6:22pm  
I've thought about that too,  but having made some enquiries it seems east/west orientation is acceptable.  But no way for south.

I was actually hoping to get a system that can be 'switched' so that it can just be used to power my house. Everyone says that would require buying solar batteries.  V exp. 
Mainly because living in bush, should a fire take out power, and having no town water, there is no way to access my water supply if a fire came thru. 

Have to keep thinking about it for now, thanks anyway.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #40 - Nov 24th, 2011 at 7:22am  
Emma wrote on Nov 23rd, 2011 at 6:22pm:
I've thought about that too,  but having made some enquiries it seems east/west orientation is acceptable.  But no way for south.

I was actually hoping to get a system that can be 'switched' so that it can just be used to power my house. Everyone says that would require buying solar batteries.  V exp.  
Mainly because living in bush, should a fire take out power, and having no town water, there is no way to access my water supply if a fire came thru.  

Have to keep thinking about it for now, thanks anyway.

You can do that too, I have another neighbour that has sell back to the grid solar power as well as a battery bank for themselves should they get a power outage, which is very common here. I live in the bush too, I live on stand alone solar with just batteries,and yes the batteries can be expensive but if you spend some time looking around there are some bargains on E bay and the like, I ended up getting some ex Telstra batteries that had only ever been trickle charged and they cost a tenth of the price had they been brand new.
If you live in the bush,do you have water tanks or a dam?
I'd invest in a fire fighter pump if you do, or a  generator.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #41 - Nov 24th, 2011 at 3:07pm  
gizmo_2655 wrote on Nov 23rd, 2011 at 10:31am:
It would also involve making agreements between countries to sell power to each other at a reasonable 'set' rate....


Yes, but that's not exactly a sticking point. It already happens in Europe. With Solar, it could even be easier. All you'd need is some kind of power swap deal with opposite hemispheres.
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #42 - Nov 24th, 2011 at 3:19pm  
Emma wrote on Nov 23rd, 2011 at 6:22pm:
I've thought about that too,  but having made some enquiries it seems east/west orientation is acceptable.  But no way for south.

I was actually hoping to get a system that can be 'switched' so that it can just be used to power my house. Everyone says that would require buying solar batteries.  V exp.  
Mainly because living in bush, should a fire take out power, and having no town water, there is no way to access my water supply if a fire came thru.  

Have to keep thinking about it for now, thanks anyway.


As far as I know, you can go with either grid connected (you don't use any of the Solar Power) or Standalone (you use all the Solar power). I don't think that there is a switched option. If I'm wrong, I'd be delighted if somebody would correct me. The standalone systems are much more expensive in Urban areas, but not too bad in Rural areas, because the government still subsidises that. You can claim Renewable Energy Certificates (REC's) Of course you still have to buy batteries, regulators and an inverter or two.

The grid connect systems are cheap everywhere because of the government REC's.  It's funded by large users of electricity who have to pay a levy.  
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #43 - Nov 24th, 2011 at 5:29pm  
If you live in the bush,do you have water tanks or a dam?
I'd invest in a fire fighter pump if you do, or a  generator. 
Thanks Skip.

Yep have a dam, a creek and 2 5000Gallon water tanks. Have thought about the water pump/ generator options - can't decide, and don't know enough at the mo.

I think I'd prefer ALL THREE.  Smiley Wink
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Re: Wind, Water, and Solar Power for the World
Reply #44 - Nov 24th, 2011 at 11:16pm  
muso wrote on Nov 24th, 2011 at 3:07pm:
gizmo_2655 wrote on Nov 23rd, 2011 at 10:31am:
It would also involve making agreements between countries to sell power to each other at a reasonable 'set' rate....


Yes, but that's not exactly a sticking point. It already happens in Europe. With Solar, it could even be easier. All you'd need is some kind of power swap deal with opposite hemispheres.


Yes, but the countries in Europe are under a common government ( the EU) and the distances involved are much smaller..
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It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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