You've gone awfully quiet, Uncle Meat. I understand that there are numerous people on both sides of the debate that have taken a faith based position. I've spent hundreds of hours researching the issues so I've done what I can to subvert my own subconscious tendencies. You've made your position clear, but I've yet to get anything from you to suggest it's based on rational thought. If you choose to debate this you'll find I'm a very open minded person.

The Vostok CO2 record shows the present-day levels of CO2 are unprecedented during the past 420,000 years. Pre-industrial Holocene levels (~280 ppmv) are found during all interglacials, with the highest values (~300 ppmv) found approximately 323,000 years ago. Good agreement is found with other ice core data which goes back 30,000 to 40,000 years, all show low CO2 values [~260-280 parts per million] during the pre-industrial Holocene.

http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/co2/vostok.html

Over the last 400,000 years atmospheric CO2 has oscillated somewhere between 180ppm and 280ppm. Today, atmospheric CO2 stands at just under 400ppm.  http://co2now.org/) Not surprisingly this recent dramatic rise in CO2 has tracked our industrial development since the industrial revolution. 

The odds of nature dropping out of a well worn 400,000 year groove just as we start releasing billions of tons of CO2 into the atmosphere would have to be infinitesimally small, but not impossible. There may be a natural emitter of CO2. Besides humans the next most likely suspect is the largest natural reservoir, our oceans. We know, however, that the CO2 increase is not coming from our oceans, because of ocean acidification. A decrease in ocean pH indicates they are absorbing more carbon not releasing it.

http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/co2/story/What+is+Ocean+Acidification%3F

http://ocean.nationalgeographic.com/ocean/critical-issues-ocean-acidification/

We can also look at the isotopic signature of our atmosphere to provide clues to it's source. Fossil fuels have a carbon-13 to 12 ratio about 2% lower than that of the atmosphere. As CO2 from burning fossil fuel is released into, and mixes with, the atmosphere, the average carbon-13 to 12 ratio of the atmosphere decreases. Reconstructions of atmospheric carbon isotope ratios from various proxy sources show us that at no time in the last 10,000 years are the carbon-13 to 12 ratios in the atmosphere as low as they are today. And guess when the carbon-13 to 12 ratios began to decline  — around 1850 AD.

As the planet warms natural stores of CO2 will be released into the atmosphere creating positive feed back effects that will accelerate the warming process. For now, the overwhelming scientific evidence tells us the increase in our atmospheric CO2 is anthropogenic in nature.

Uncle Meat, what are the natural causes that you believe have helped to take our atmospheric CO2 from ~280ppm to ~400ppm. Do you accept that it is human activity that is overwhelmingly driving the recent dramatic increase in CO2.

MOTR wrote on May 10^th, 2012 at 5:42am:



It suggests. 

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:14pm:



Of course it's a combination.

Are you really suggesting that the only thing creating CO2 is human activity?

Surely you can't be serious.

BatteriesNotIncluded wrote on May 11^th, 2012 at 3:30pm:



I understood the question, and I answered it.

Furthermore, you've just confirmed that my answer is correct (which everyone knew anyway).

MOTR wrote on May 10^th, 2012 at 5:42am:


Merely a guesstimate.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-05-11/anu-releases-abusive-emails-sent-to-climat...

FOI emails reveal threats to climate scientists

By Clarissa Thorpe and Ben Atherton
Updated May 11, 2012 10:59:02

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MAP: ACT
The Australian National University has released a series of abusive and threatening emails which were sent to its climate change scientists.

The 11 emails to members of the university's Climate Change Institute have been made public after a Freedom of Information request.

ANU management initially turned down the FOI request to release them, fearing it would lead to increased harassment.

But they have now been released with the names and email addresses removed after an intervention by the privacy commissioner.

One email, dated June 2, 2010, describes a threat to use a gun against an academic because a conference participant reportedly disagreed with the climate change research.

"Looks like we've had our first serious threat of physical violence," it says.

"It has come from a participant in [DELETED] deliberative democracy project last weekend. One of the participants left early after he too [sic] exception to my talk about climate science. [DELETED] exact words were: 'Moreover, before he left, he came to the Fri dinner and showed other participants his gun licence and explained to them how good a sniper he is'."

The email notes that "I will be notifying security in case he turns up and causes a problem" and says the university's head of security will be asked to determine whether the case should be referred to the Australian Federal Police.

It concludes: "But in the meantime, we should be careful about anyone we don't know who approaches our offices."

Another email, dated May 24, 2011, says: "How do you people sleep at night, you and that old idiot . They pay you thousands to feed us ordinary hard working normal folk bullshit. You come from well to do families who have never earned or done an honest days work in your life. You overpaid over educated parasite. Get a real job and pay your dues you leech."

In a statement, the ANU said: "ANU has a duty of care to its staff and students and we note the finding of the Privacy Commissioner: 'In my view there is a risk that the release of the documents could lead to further insulting or offensive communication being directed at ANU personnel...'

"However we have chosen not to appeal the decision of the Commissioner and are releasing the documents with information removed that would identify those sending or receiving the emails, as per the Commissioner’s decision."

ANU vice-chancellor Ian Young said the Climate Change Institute scientists were moved to more secure offices on campus in the wake of the threats.

"The individual people were concerned about their safety, and the university as an employer decided we needed to respond to that," he said.

"My view is the more we discuss these things in public - these are emotive issues - the more you tend to beat the whole issue up.

"We had issues, we dealt with them we believe in an appropriate way, and we don't want to make more of it than that."

Topics: university-and-further-education, climate-change, act, canberra-2600

First posted May 11, 2012 09:06:07