Australian Politics Forum - Definition of Atheism

Yadda

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #60 - May 6^th, 2011 at 2:54pm

muso wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:05pm:

None of these are supernatural.

To me, 'supernatural' simply means beyond our ken.

e.g.
If we could go back 500 years in time, many common items, and phenomenon that are accepted [if not understood by the common man Tongue

] today, would have been regarded as 'supernatural', to people from that time, imo.

muso wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:05pm:

Have you ever used a Wii? Yadda.

Wii ???

What is a Wii ? Wink

The correct answer is no, never.

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"....And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead."
Luke 16:31

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Soren

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #61 - May 6^th, 2011 at 3:39pm

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:14pm:

Soren wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:06pm:

Postmodern Trendoid III wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 11:00am:

Soren wrote on May 5^th, 2011 at 10:24pm:

Neither time nor space are either objects (that you can measure or alter or in any way isolate), or qualities inherent in some other object that you can identify.

If that is so then all that exists is consciousness, nothing physical or material. So when you burn yourself or fall over and break an arm, you must think, 'oh, it's all in my head'. Of course this is rubbish. The physical/material world exists regardless of what idealist metaphysical bypaths one wants to play.

What I said does not mean that only consciousness exists. What it does mean is that you have absolutely no access to any kind of knowledge except via your mind. Simple, really.

Well, obviously. But that still in no way critiques space, time , and causality as things that can be empirically measured. You're yet to disprove this.

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This is what happens when you stop reading anything that doesn't confirm what you thought when you were 12.

Oooh, good comeback.
Attempted insults isn't going to get you out of the corner you've pinned yourself in.

What we measure is what the human mind can encompass. It can encompass physical objects only in time and space. You cannot think of no-time or no-space - yet neither time nor space are objects in themselves or qualities of particular objects.
This does not mean that objects are not real. It means that space and time inhere in the mind, not outside it, in objects. They are the mind's way of organising the relationship of objects.

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muso Gold Member Offline Posts: 13151 Gladstone, Queensland Gender:	Re: Definition of Atheism Reply #62 - May 6^th, 2011 at 8:35pm Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:54pm: To me, 'supernatural' simply means beyond our ken. So the results of this year's Melbourne Cup are supernatural, but once we know the results it will cease to be supernatural? You're trying hard to give a definition, but I doubt if that's possible.
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muso

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #63 - May 6^th, 2011 at 8:43pm

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:54pm:

Wii ???

What is a Wii ? Wink

The correct answer is no, never.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wii

It's like a computer game in which you actually exercise. In Wii Fitness Plus for example, you can fly from one target to another which standing on a pressure sensitive wireless board.

It's a kind of virtual sport but it has a built-in personal assistant who can help you develop strength in various muscle groups, balance and rhythm.

I use it almost every day. It's a kind of physical exercise that isn't boring.

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freediver

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #64 - May 6^th, 2011 at 8:50pm

Quote:

I've never called for government imposed utopian societies. I do wish you'd stop putting constructing 'Grey's according to your own prejudices.

I did try asking you for the list of things you would ban. Every time I askl for 'Grey's according to Grey' all I get is grey changing his mind.

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I am not generally in favour of banning things. Sometimes there's a case for baning things.

If you can't give a list, can you give a few examples of some new bans you want?

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Well I have a magic watch that disappears occasionally, so it must be supernatural. The strange thing is that it always consistently and repeatably tells the time.

Except when you can't see it.

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In order to say that supernatural phenomena are not repeatable and/or not consistent, you either need to have an encyclopedic and intimate knowledge of supernatural phenomena, or you are basing your assessment on one or two supernatural phenomena that you have experienced.

No. I am basing it on what type of thing people call supernatural. Most people have the same definition. They just enver bother putting words to it.

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yet neither time nor space are objects in themselves or qualities of particular objects

So if i said my dick is bigger than yours, it is all in my mind?

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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Soren Gold Member Offline Posts: 25654 Gender:	Re: Definition of Atheism Reply #65 - May 6^th, 2011 at 9:16pm freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 8:50pm: Quote: yet neither time nor space are objects in themselves or qualities of particular objects So if i said my dick is bigger than yours, it is all in my mind? Yes.
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Grey

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #66 - May 7^th, 2011 at 3:00am

Quote:

I did try asking you for the list of things you would ban. Every time I askl for 'Grey's according to Grey' all I get is grey changing his mind.

And I try to be as clear as possible and all I get is you being a dickhead and misrepresenting me.

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If you can't give a list, can you give a few examples of some new bans you want?

Why pick on me? You're more in favour of banning things than I am.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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freediver Gold Member Offline www.ozpolitic.com Posts: 53275 At my desk.	Re: Definition of Atheism Reply #67 - May 7^th, 2011 at 8:16am Quote: Why pick on me? You're more in favour of banning things than I am. Such as? I only pick on you because you keep talking about how nice it would be to ban things, and the more I ask the more you seem to want banned.
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longweekend58

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #68 - May 7^th, 2011 at 2:20pm

muso wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 8:35pm:

Yadda wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 2:54pm:

To me, 'supernatural' simply means beyond our ken.

So the results of this year's Melbourne Cup are supernatural, but once we know the results it will cease to be supernatural?

You're trying hard to give a definition, but I doubt if that's possible.

oh for goodness sake!!! 'super natural' means ABOVE THE NATURAL. it is an event that defies natural laws. not understanding is implicit in the definition but something you dont understand isnt necessarily supernatural. God is supernatural because he exists outside - ABOVE - our natural realm.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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NorthOfNorth Gold Member Offline OzPolitic Posts: 17258 Gender:	Re: Definition of Atheism Reply #69 - May 7^th, 2011 at 2:27pm A supernatural event is an act which is impossible by any natural means. The long-dead rising from their graves would be a supernatural event. A mind existing without a body/brain would be a supernatural event. Turning water into wine by vocal command alone is a supernatural event. etc... etc... etc...
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longweekend58

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #70 - May 7^th, 2011 at 2:29pm

NorthOfNorth wrote on May 7^th, 2011 at 2:27pm:

A supernatural event is an act which is impossible by any natural means.

The long-dead rising from their graves would be a supernatural event.

A mind existing without a body/brain would be a supernatural event.

Turning water into wine by vocal command alone is a supernatural event.

etc... etc... etc...

I to thought that was pretty obvious.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Lisa Jones Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 39047 Sydney Gender:	Re: Definition of Atheism Reply #71 - May 7^th, 2011 at 3:28pm Soren wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 9:16pm: freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 8:50pm: Quote: yet neither time nor space are objects in themselves or qualities of particular objects So if i said my dick is bigger than yours, it is all in my mind? Yes. You know .. some posts should be framed forever in a Hall of Fame lol
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longweekend58

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #72 - May 7^th, 2011 at 3:29pm

Lisa Jones wrote on May 7^th, 2011 at 3:28pm:

Soren wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 9:16pm:

freediver wrote on May 6^th, 2011 at 8:50pm:

Quote:

yet neither time nor space are objects in themselves or qualities of particular objects

So if i said my dick is bigger than yours, it is all in my mind?

Yes.

You know .. some posts should be framed forever in a Hall of Fame lol

yep... a bit of a classic!

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« Last Edit: May 7^th, 2011 at 3:35pm by longweekend58 »

AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Grey

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #73 - May 7^th, 2011 at 3:43pm

freediver wrote on May 7^th, 2011 at 8:16am:

Quote:

Why pick on me? You're more in favour of banning things than I am.

Such as?

I only pick on you because you keep talking about how nice it would be to ban things, and the more I ask the more you seem to want banned.

Such as a number of words you've banned from use on this forum. All I've said is that to ban the burqa would offend my sensibilities but if it were banned I wouldn't lose sleep. From that you continue to make out I'm king of the banners, it's bloody bullshit.

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"It is in the shelter of each other that the people live" - Irish Proverb

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freediver

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Re: Definition of Atheism
Reply #74 - May 7^th, 2011 at 4:49pm

Quote:

A supernatural event is an act which is impossible by any natural means.

Not a useful definition, because it requires people to know all that is possible by natural laws in order to identify something as supernatural, which is clearly not the case.

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Such as a number of words you've banned from use on this forum.

So you equate what i do with a private forum with you wanting the government to deny people fundamental human rights?

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All I've said is that to ban the burqa would offend my sensibilities but if it were banned I wouldn't lose sleep.

You have said lots of things Grey, many of them self contradictory.

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From that you continue to make out I'm king of the banners, it's bloody bullshit.

What I continue to make out is that every time I ask for clarification on what you would have banned you suddenly go all shy on me, or mumble off on tangents about 'practical difficulties'.

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People who can't distinguish between etymology and entomology bug me in ways I cannot put into words.

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