Australian Politics Forum - Greens caught out over Israel

gizmo_2655

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Re: Greens caught out over Israel
Reply #90 - Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:43pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:38pm:

Liberals Caught Out in Jewish Slur

May 12, 2008

THE Victorian Liberal campaign director who sent an anti-Semitic email to a colleague has quit her job and apologised for her remark.
State president David Kemp said Susan Chandler was given the option of quitting or being sacked.

Chandler had described a candidate in an email as a

"greedy f***ing jew"

In the latest shot fired in an internal party war that has the Liberals reeling, an email, forwarded from campaign officer John Osborn, shows Ms Chandler making the reference to Liberal Party candidate Adam Held.

The anti-Semitic remark follows a request from Mr Held for more election campaign pamphlets in October last year.

Mr Osborn, was fired after a secret investigation found he and fellow staffer Simon Morgan posted damaging comments on Liberal website blog, called on the State President to sack Ms Chandler immediately.

“I am comprehensively appalled at the clearly anti-Semitic nature of Ms. Chandler’s email,” Mr Osborn said in an email to 3AW.

“Ms Chandler’s involvement as an investigator has tainted the process irrevocably and her involvement in the Federal by-election campaign for Gippsland is a concern.”

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/anti-jew-claim-latest-in-anti-baillieu-campaign...

Yes, fairly similar....other than the fact that Ms Chandler wasn't a 'sitting' member of the Party ( in council, state or federal politics)....and was only basically an office worker/clerk.....Nice deflection though...

Of course you 'could' have just admitted that a Greens pollie (or group of Greens pollies) said something offensive and that you don't agree with it and are upset by the saying it.....

After all pollies ARE still human...we don't need to agree with, or defend, everything they say......

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« Last Edit: Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:50pm by gizmo_2655 »

"I just get sick of people who place a label on someone else with their own definition.

It's similar to a strawman fallacy"
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sir prince duke alevine

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Re: Greens caught out over Israel
Reply #91 - Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:47pm

gizmo_2655 wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:43pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:38pm:

Liberals Caught Out in Jewish Slur

May 12, 2008

THE Victorian Liberal campaign director who sent an anti-Semitic email to a colleague has quit her job and apologised for her remark.
State president David Kemp said Susan Chandler was given the option of quitting or being sacked.

Chandler had described a candidate in an email as a

"greedy f***ing jew"

In the latest shot fired in an internal party war that has the Liberals reeling, an email, forwarded from campaign officer John Osborn, shows Ms Chandler making the reference to Liberal Party candidate Adam Held.

The anti-Semitic remark follows a request from Mr Held for more election campaign pamphlets in October last year.

Mr Osborn, was fired after a secret investigation found he and fellow staffer Simon Morgan posted damaging comments on Liberal website blog, called on the State President to sack Ms Chandler immediately.

“I am comprehensively appalled at the clearly anti-Semitic nature of Ms. Chandler’s email,” Mr Osborn said in an email to 3AW.

“Ms Chandler’s involvement as an investigator has tainted the process irrevocably and her involvement in the Federal by-election campaign for Gippsland is a concern.”

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/anti-jew-claim-latest-in-anti-baillieu-campaign...

Yes, fairly similar....other than the fact that Ms Chandler wasn't a 'sitting' member of the Party ( in council, state or federal politics)....and was only basically an office worker/clerk.....Nice deflection though...

or the fact that the greens are not calling jewish people "greedy bugger* jew," but exercising their right to protest a democratic state acting against international law.

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Disclaimer for Mothra per POST so it is forever acknowledged: Saying 'Islam' or 'Muslims' doesn't mean ALL muslims. This does not target individual muslims who's opinion I am not aware of.

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longweekend58

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Re: Greens caught out over Israel
Reply #92 - Apr 8^th, 2011 at 6:18pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 1:45pm:

do you specialise in well-written faslehoods? Israel letter-dropped areas and literally PHONED them residents to let them know and anti-hamas attack was coming. that is a duty of care. and they also targetted military groups who positioned themselves in groups of civilians. and what does hamas do? they intentilly target school buses and civilian groups and areas.

if you want to talk abotu duty-of-care where is your condemnation of civilian-based primary attacks?

as usual, the argument for people like you is only ever one way. and then you wonder why israel takes no notice of internatinal opinion when it is so hopelessly one-sided.

Actually no - I denounce Hamas just as much as I do Israel, especially since the party actually has a denouncement of Israel and a mission of destroying Israel in their party manifesto.

However, international law and duty of care in war clearly states that in this case, even though Israel did go about making a phone call to advise of the planned attacks, if they still found there were too many civilians in the area, it was their responsibility to put ground troops on the ground to do the necessary removal. Or drop the attack.

and then you'd have complained about an 'invasion' by using groundtroops. and to use human shields is an abhorrent action and it only works on one side of the wall. Hamas dont give acrap about the killing of civilians which is why they target them and then use them as shields. so what exactly is your solution besides just 'giving up'. There is one solution and that is to target the miltary WHEREVER THEY ARE. if the civilians dont get out of the place then they are stupid and deserve what is coming. if they stay by choice then that choice makes them part of the military and therefore a legitimate target.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Greens caught out over Israel
Reply #93 - Apr 8^th, 2011 at 6:25pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 2:28pm:

chicken_lipsforme wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 2:22pm:

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 1:49pm:

longweekend58 wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 1:45pm:

do you specialise in well-written faslehoods? Israel letter-dropped areas and literally PHONED them residents to let them know and anti-hamas attack was coming. that is a duty of care. and they also targetted military groups who positioned themselves in groups of civilians. and what does hamas do? they intentilly target school buses and civilian groups and areas.

if you want to talk abotu duty-of-care where is your condemnation of civilian-based primary attacks?

as usual, the argument for people like you is only ever one way. and then you wonder why israel takes no notice of internatinal opinion when it is so hopelessly one-sided.

However, international law and duty of care in war clearly states that in this case, even though Israel did go about making a phone call to advise of the planned attacks, if they still found there were too many civilians in the area, it was their responsibility to put ground troops on the ground to do the necessary removal. Or drop the attack.

And in which war has this EVER occurred in before.
What army EVER on the planet EVER went into a suburban combat situation and removed the civilians BEFORE launching the ground assault?
Sorry, it's never happened and will never happen.

Hence why rockets are not fired at civilian locations, and at military locations.

But I'm afraid international law still stands, and we can argue this all into the night. The point is that your attempts to judge by using other excuses doesn't negate Israel's responsibilities during this attack. And being that the result ended up being 1400 vs 13, it's quite clear that Israel's responsibilities were not met.

what LUNACY makes you think a head count of the dead is the definition of 'proportionate response'. hamas makes the count 1400 so you can virtually discount 50% of that from the start and since they alreayd admit that 700 were combatants and therefore need to be removed from the count it is quite possible that the number of innocent civilians is a handful - possibly less than 13.

but the point is NOT about numbers. when you START a massacre of inoocents you cant then complain about the storm that comes back at you. There is a simple soltion to much of this strife. STOP FIRING MISSILES AT CIVILIANS! and then your enemy wil lstop firing back at you. but no one has ever accused a palestinian of being intelligent.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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longweekend58

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Re: Greens caught out over Israel
Reply #94 - Apr 8^th, 2011 at 6:32pm

sir prince duke alevine wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:47pm:

gizmo_2655 wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:43pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Apr 8^th, 2011 at 3:38pm:

Liberals Caught Out in Jewish Slur

May 12, 2008

THE Victorian Liberal campaign director who sent an anti-Semitic email to a colleague has quit her job and apologised for her remark.
State president David Kemp said Susan Chandler was given the option of quitting or being sacked.

Chandler had described a candidate in an email as a

"greedy f***ing jew"

In the latest shot fired in an internal party war that has the Liberals reeling, an email, forwarded from campaign officer John Osborn, shows Ms Chandler making the reference to Liberal Party candidate Adam Held.

The anti-Semitic remark follows a request from Mr Held for more election campaign pamphlets in October last year.

Mr Osborn, was fired after a secret investigation found he and fellow staffer Simon Morgan posted damaging comments on Liberal website blog, called on the State President to sack Ms Chandler immediately.

“I am comprehensively appalled at the clearly anti-Semitic nature of Ms. Chandler’s email,” Mr Osborn said in an email to 3AW.

“Ms Chandler’s involvement as an investigator has tainted the process irrevocably and her involvement in the Federal by-election campaign for Gippsland is a concern.”

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/anti-jew-claim-latest-in-anti-baillieu-campaign...

Yes, fairly similar....other than the fact that Ms Chandler wasn't a 'sitting' member of the Party ( in council, state or federal politics)....and was only basically an office worker/clerk.....Nice deflection though...

or the fact that the greens are not calling jewish people "greedy bugger* jew," but exercising their right to protest a democratic state acting against international law.

while saying absolutely nothing about the murderous dictatorships that surround them. sorry, but there are no plaudits for one-dided exercising of rights. Rights are either for everyone or no one. you cant choose to criticise one side in a conflict while excusing massive violations of human rights on the other. That merely compounds the paucity of their integrity and adds fuel to the calim that they are racists or in this case, anti-semitics.

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AUSSIE: "Speaking for myself, I could not care less about 298 human beings having their life snuffed out in a nano-second, or what impact that loss has on Members of their family, their parents..."

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Soren

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Re: Greens caught out over Israel
Reply #95 - Apr 8^th, 2011 at 6:40pm

Two things:

The palestinians need to be beaten until they know they are beaten. This was the trick with the Germans and the Japanese and is the rule for winning a war - th enemy must know it's beaten. We have a Middle Eastern problem because Israel stopped too soon in 1948 or in any case in 1967. Or 1973 Or 1982. The Western powers exert an enormous amount on pressure on Israel to tread softly-softly. In this sense the western alliance is a hindrance for Israel. As is its humane, democratic and compassionate people. The jews are too nice, even when in mortal danger.

Secondly, the motion by Marrickville Council to boycott Israel was brought by Green councillors and supported by Labor ones and that is how it could be passed. Gillard and Brown are both lying, she by distancing herself from the Greens, he by saying that Marrickville Greens were not acting in accordance with the Greens' policies.

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