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Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl. (Read 17594 times)
Equitist
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #135 - Apr 9th, 2011 at 4:43pm
 


Andrei.Hicks wrote on Apr 9th, 2011 at 11:01am:
I just flew a 2 year old and a 6 month old from San Diego to LAX to London Heathrow Thy. Not to mention a 2 hour car journey to Bristol after that.

All went fine and they loved it. Well no, they didn't love it, but it went fine.

Get out there and don't be afraid of that big old world.




Congrats - but I'd wager that you didn't make the trip without an adult to help you juggle the out-of-comfort-zone toddler and infant...

I'm sure you could imagine how much more fun the flight would have been if you'd been solely responsible for the same little souls and all of their necessary paraphernalia - and especially if one of them was feeling even a little off-colour...

Then, thinking back on our earlier discussion re welfare recipients reliant upon public transport: imagine if you had travelled to and from the respective airports only by a combination of foot, bus, tram and/or train (no private car, no taxi) - and in wet and cold weather...

Oh boy, what joy!?

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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #136 - Apr 9th, 2011 at 4:46pm
 
muso wrote on Apr 9th, 2011 at 4:12pm:
The only reason that it's bigger than Cernobyl is that they allowed Greenpeace in, and they will scare more people to death than the actual effects of any residual radiation.

The current levels in the Fukushima province are about on a par with Denver Colorado, except for a corridor running NW from the plant for about 40km, which is slightly elevated.

When the media stated that the levels are 100 times normal, or 100 times background, that's pretty meaningless because natural background radiation varies considerably with time and geographical location.

Meantime, we're forgetting about a massive Tsunami that killed about 27,000 people and totally destroyed entire settlements.

There needs to be some perspective.


Did I miss something, I'll have to re-read that article, I must have missed that bit, about being worse than Chernobyl?
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #137 - Apr 11th, 2011 at 7:24pm
 
Magnitude 7.1-quake jolts Japan coast

By the CNN Wire Staff
April 11, 2011 -- Updated 0858 GMT

(CNN) -- A magnitude 7.1 earthquake rattled the northeastern coast of Japan Monday evening, the U.S. Geological Survey reported.

Japan's Meteorological Agency issued a tsunami warning, predicting a potential wave of two-meters in Miyagi, Fukushima and Chiba and Ibaraki prefectures.


The quake was centered about 164 kilometers (101 miles) northeast of Tokyo, according to the USGS. Residents in Tokyo felt the jolts.

Workers at the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant were asked to evacuate.

Link -
http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/04/11/japan.quake/?hpt=T1
========================
Have all the bolts been tightened & the brittle metal been replaced?

Because, if these keep up, sooner or later, it's going to be one too many!
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #138 - Apr 11th, 2011 at 10:05pm
 


http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/04/11/3188065.htm

Quote:
Japan set to extend nuclear evacuation zone

By Hayden Cooper and wires

Updated 4 hours 18 minutes ago

The Japanese government is considering extending the evacuation zone around the Fukushima nuclear plant because of high radiation levels.

A 20-kilometre exclusion zone has been in place around the plant since a 9.0-magnitude earthquake and tsunami hit Japan one month ago today.

But Japan's chief cabinet secretary, Yukio Edano, says changes are being considered.

"From the perspective of cumulative radiation, we need to take measures to secure people's safety," he said.

No decision has been announced, but local media reports say the zone could be extended to 30km and authorities will stop anyone trying to return to their homes.

Engineers at the damaged plant north of Tokyo said on Sunday they were no closer to restoring the plant's cooling system, which is critical if overheated fuel rods are to be cooled and the six reactors brought under control.

They are hoping to stop pumping radioactive water into the ocean today, days later than planned.

The government has so far refused to widen the evacuation zone despite being urged by the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) to do so.

Both Australia and the United States recommend citizens stay 80km away from the plant.

Fukushima governor Yuhei Sato criticised the evacuation policy, saying residents in a 20- to 30km radius were initially told to stay indoors and then advised to evacuate voluntarily.

"Residents in the 20- to 30km radius were really confused about what to do," he told NHK television yesterday.

The earthquake and tsunami is the worst crisis in Japan since World War II, leaving nearly 28,000 dead or missing and rocking the world's third-largest economy.

At precisely 2:46pm (local time) Japan fell silent to remember the dead and missing.

In ruined villages along the north-east coast, survivors put their hands together in prayer and bowed their heads as once again an emergency siren sounded.

Japan's prime minister used the occasion to thank the world for offering help during the past month.

- ABC/Reuters




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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #139 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 10:27am
 



Latest reports are of another fire (in reactor building 4) - and that officials are finally ramping up to admit that Fukushima should be rated at the same level as Chernobyl...
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #140 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 10:37am
 


https://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=wrapup-4-fire-at-japans-crippl...

Quote:
TOKYO, April 12 (Reuters)

* Fire at Japan's crippled nuclear plant

* Major aftershock rocks Tokyo

* Crisis may be on par with Chernobyl

* High radiation forces extention of evacuations

Engineers were fighting a fire at Japan's crippled nuclear plant on Tuesday as another major aftershock rocked eastern Japan, swaying buildings in central Tokyo and closing Narita airport runways.

Japan is considering raising the severity level of its nuclear crisis to put it on a par with the Chernobyl accident 25 years ago, the worst atomic power disaster in history, Kyodo news agency reported on Tuesday.


Operator of the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, 240 km (150 miles) north of Tokyo, said on Tuesday that its workers were fighting a fire near damaged reactor No. 4.

It was unclear how serious the fire was.

"Flames and smoke are no longer visible but we are awaiting further details regarding whether the fire has been extinguished completely," said a spokesman for Tokyo Electric Power Co (TEPCO) .

News of the fire came only minutes after a 6.3 aftershock struck off the coast of Chiba, 77 km (48 miles) northwest of Tokyo. Kyodo said Japan's main international airport Narita closed runways for checks but later resumed flights.

An aftershock measuring 6.6 quake hit Fukushima prefecture on Monday evening temporarily cutting power and forcing workers to evacuate the nuclear plant.

Japan's Nuclear Industry and Safety Agency (NISA) said the Fukusihima aftershock, which killed one man and knocked out power to 220,000 households, did not damage the nuclear plant.

There have been hundreds of aftershocks since March 11 when a massive 9 magnitude earthquake and 15 metre tsunami hit northeast Japan, plunging the country into its worst crisis since World War Two.

Nearly 28,000 Japanese are dead or missing and the world's third-largest economy is reeling with power blackouts, factory c closures and cuts to supply lines.

The Kyodo reported on Tuesday that the high levels of radiation that have been released by the Fukushima Daiichi plant meant it could raise the severity level from 5 to the highest 7, the same as the 1986 Chernobyl accident. [ID:nL3E7FB35B]

Japan had previously assessed the accident at reactors operated by TEPCO at level 5, the same level as the Three Mile Island accident in the United States in 1979.

Kyodo said the government's Nuclear Safety Commission had estimated that at one stage the amount of radioactive material released from the reactors in northern Japan had reached 10,000 terabequerels per hour of radioactive iodine 131 for several hours, which would classify the incident as a major accident according to the INES scale.

The International Nuclear and Radiological Event Scale (INES), published by the International Atomic Energy Agency, ranks nuclear incidents by severity from 1 to a maximum of 7.

Kyodo did not say when the big increase in radiation had happened but quoted the commission as saying the release had since fallen to under 1 terabecquerel per hour.

The commission also released a preliminary calculation for the cumulative amount of external exposure to radiation, saying it exceeded the yearly limit of 1 millisieverts in areas extending more than 60 kms (36 miles) to the northwest of the plant and about 40 km to the south-southwest.


"It has been obvious all along this was a 7. There are three reactors that are not being cooled (No. 1, 2 &3) and four fuel pools too (No. 1, 2, 3, and especially 4)," said Arnie Gundersen, a 29-year veteran of the nuclear industry who worked on reactors similar to those at Daiichi and who is now chief engineer at Fairewinds Associates Inc of Burlington, Vermont.

He said that means there were at least seven cores or pools that had been in difficulty. He noted that at Chernobyl it was only one reactor that created the problem.

A spokesman for the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, Japan's nuclear safety watchdog, said he was unaware of any move by the government to raise the level.

RADIOACTIVE WATER

The March 11 tsunami, the largest recorded in quake-prone Japan, crippling the reactors' cooling systems.

Engineers at the plant north of Tokyo said they were no closer to restoring the plant's cooling system, which is critical to bring down the temperature of overheated fuel rods and to bringing the six reactors under control.

TEPCO said on Monday it had stopped the discharge of low-level radioactive water into the sea that have drawn complaints from neighbouring China and South Korea.

It has already pumped 10,400 tonnes of low-level radioactive water into the ocean to free up storage capacity for highly contaminated water from the reactors.

In a desperate move to cool the highly radioactive fuel rods, TEPCO has pumped water onto reactors, some of which have experienced partial meltdown.

But the strategy has hindered moves to restore the plant's internal cooling system as engineers have had to focus on how to store 60,000 tonnes of contaminated water.

Engineers are also pumping nitrogen into reactors to counter a build-up of hydrogen and prevent another explosion sending more radiation into the air, but they say the risk of such a dramatic event has lowered significantly since March 11.

EVACUATION ZONE WIDENS

Because of accumulated radiation...



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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #141 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 11:08am
 



BTW, how is it that Japan (or any other nation) has been in a position to do its own conservative rating of a nuke disaster in any event!?

So bizarre...
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #142 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:08pm
 
Closing Ranks: The NRC, the Nuclear Industry, and TEPCO are Limiting the Flow of Information
April 6th, 2011 - Embedded Video at below site


Arnie Gundersen discusses inconsistencies between what the NRC, TEPCo, and the Nuclear Industry are saying privately and publicly. Documents from the french nuclear firm, Areva, and the NRC reveal what the industry knows about the Fukushima disaster.

Nuclear Engineer Arnie Gundersen demonstrates How Fukushima's Fuel Rods Melted and Shattered
April 10th, 2011 - Embedded Video at below site
Fairewinds' Chief Nuclear Engineer, Arnie Gundersen, conducts a field demonstration simulating the impact of Fukushima's intense heat upon Zircaloy [zirconium alloy] fuel rods. Gundersen's demonstration shows that intense heat weakens and embrittles Zircaloy changing it from a sturdy metal to a brittle oxide that is easily shattered. Images from the post accident Three Mile Island nuclear core show embrittled and broken Zircaloy fuel rods in the nuclear reactor.

Link -
http://www.fairewinds.com/updates
================================
Further to Reply #296 - Apr 5th, 2011, 12:45pm, there are now 2 more video reports from Arnie Gundersen at Fairwinds & Associates.

The April 6th video refers to a number of inconsistencies involved in reports coming from TEPCO & others, which In my opinion has been apparent!

Arnie also talks about -
1) The Reliability of information being questionable.
2) The possibility of Recriticality ocurring.
3) The possibility of further Hydrogen explosions.
4) A report from the French Nuclear company Areva containing issues that the Public are not being made aware of, including -
a) That the Nuclear Fuel in reactors 1,2 & 3 reached 5000f, which is beyond the melting point of Zircalloy & Stainless Steel.
b) Reactor 2 RPV being breeched by a Hydrogen explosion.
c) Areva recommend control of crops & dairy products, out to 50 km, due to radiation levels.
d) Plutonium & other material is coming from reactor 4, due to a crack in the fuel pool resulting from the earthquake, which caused a "core melt in fresh air".

 

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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #143 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:09pm
 
Japan may raise nuke accident severity level to highest 7 from 5


The Nuclear Safety Commission of Japan released a preliminary calculation Monday saying that the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant had been releasing up to 10,000 terabecquerels of radioactive materials per hour at some point after a massive quake and tsunami hit northeastern Japan on March 11.

The disclosure prompted the government to consider raising the accident's severity level to 7, the worst on an international scale, from the current 5, government sources said. The level 7 on the International Nuclear Event Scale has only been applied to the 1986 Chernobyl catastrophe.


According to an evaluation by the INES, level 7 accidents correspond with a release into the external environment radioactive materials equal to more than tens of thousands terabecquerels of radioactive iodine 131. One terabecquerel equals 1 trillion becquerels.

Haruki Madarame, chairman of the commission, which is a government panel, said it has estimated that the release of 10,000 terabecquerels of radioactive materials per hour continued for several hours.

The commission says the release has since come down to under 1 terabecquerel per hour and said that it is still examining the total amount of radioactive materials released.

The commission also released a preliminary calculation for the cumulative amount of external exposure to radiation, saying it exceeded the yearly limit of 1 millisieverts in areas extending more than 60 kilometers to the northwest of the plant and about 40 km to the south-southwest of the plant.

Within a 20-km exclusion zone set by the government, the amount varied from under 1 millisieverts to 100 millisieverts or more, and in the 20-30 km radius ring where residents are asked to stay indoors, it came to under 50 millisieverts.

Link -
http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/04/84721.html
==========================================
I am reminded of a recent post, which addreses the approach of Politicians & no doubt other self-interest groups, such as those involved in this issue.

Does anyone believe that -
1) All Politicians, tell the truth, all the time?
2) All Politicians, have our interests at heart, not theirs?
3) Government Statistics, don't lie?
4) War is the only thing, where we are treated like mushrooms?

If there is anyone, let me introduce you to Alice and the looking glass, where things just aren't what they seem and much of the time that is self induced!


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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #144 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:10pm
 
WRAPUP 4-Fire at Japan's crippled nuclear plant, more aftershocks


TOKYO, April 12 (Reuters) - Engineers were fighting a fire at Japan's crippled nuclear plant on Tuesday as another major aftershock rocked eastern Japan, swaying buildings in central Tokyo and closing Narita airport runways.

Japan is considering raising the severity level of its nuclear crisis to put it on a par with the Chernobyl accident 25 years ago, the worst atomic power disaster in history, Kyodo news agency reported on Tuesday.

Operator of the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, 240 km (150 miles) north of Tokyo, said on Tuesday that its workers were fighting a fire near damaged reactor No. 4.

It was unclear how serious the fire was.


An aftershock measuring 6.6 quake hit Fukushima prefecture on Monday evening temporarily cutting power and forcing workers to evacuate the nuclear plant.

Nearly 28,000 Japanese are dead or missing and the world's third-largest economy is reeling with power blackouts, factory c closures and cuts to supply lines.

The Kyodo reported on Tuesday that the high levels of radiation that have been released by the Fukushima Daiichi plant meant it could raise the severity level from 5 to the highest 7, the same as the 1986 Chernobyl accident.

"It has been obvious all along this was a 7. There are three reactors that are not being cooled (No. 1, 2 &3) and four fuel pools too (No. 1, 2, 3, and especially 4)," said Arnie Gundersen, a 29-year veteran of the nuclear industry who worked on reactors similar to those at Daiichi and who is now chief engineer at Fairewinds Associates Inc of Burlington, Vermont.

He said that means there were at least seven cores or pools that had been in difficulty. He noted that at Chernobyl it was only one reactor that created the problem.

A spokesman for the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, Japan's nuclear safety watchdog, said he was unaware of any move by the government to raise the level.

EVACUATION ZONE WIDENS
Because of accumulated radiation contamination, the government is encouraging people to leave certain areas beyond its 20 km (12 mile) exclusion zone around the plant. Thousands of people could be affected by the move.

Link -
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/12/japan-idUSL3E7FB2TZ20110412?pageNumber...
======================================
At this point, even iF the TEPCO or government spokesperson was named FRANK CARE, I would have great difficulty in believing that he would be FRANK & Honest, in passing on all of the corect information!
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #145 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:31pm
 
"Earlier on Tuesday the nuclear power plant operator said workers discovered a small fire near a reactor building at the Fukushima Dai-ichi complex but it was extinguished quickly.

Tokyo Electric Power Company said the fire at a box that contains batteries in a building near the No. 4 reactor was discovered at about 6:38 am on Tuesday morning and was put out seven minutes later.

It wasn't clear whether the fire was related to a magnitude-6.3 earthquake that shook the Tokyo area on Tuesday morning. The cause of the fire is being investigated."

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/world/9179730/japan-to-raise-nuclear-severity-level/
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #146 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:50pm
 
Arnold Gundersen (Fairewinds) is an excellent source for how nuclear power plants work and the dangers of meltdown

Prof. Chris Busby is an excellent source for determining THE REAL dangers and long term health risks of the various types of radiation and radionucleotides that can be released from a nuclear power plant disaster.

Of course you can just rely on TEPCO lies and the back pedallng of the IAEA.


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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #147 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 1:19pm
 
<<Of course you can just rely on TEPCO lies and the back pedallng of the IAEA.>>
................................................................................
.

Of course we should listen carefully to what they are saying, then believe the exact opposite to get nearer to the truth.
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #148 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 1:25pm
 
perceptions_now wrote on Apr 12th, 2011 at 12:10pm:
WRAPUP 4-Fire at Japan's crippled nuclear plant, more aftershocks


TOKYO, April 12 (Reuters) - Engineers were fighting a fire at Japan's crippled nuclear plant on Tuesday as another major aftershock rocked eastern Japan, swaying buildings in central Tokyo and closing Narita airport runways.

Japan is considering raising the severity level of its nuclear crisis to put it on a par with the Chernobyl accident 25 years ago, the worst atomic power disaster in history, Kyodo news agency reported on Tuesday.

Operator of the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, 240 km (150 miles) north of Tokyo, said on Tuesday that its workers were fighting a fire near damaged reactor No. 4.

It was unclear how serious the fire was.


An aftershock measuring 6.6 quake hit Fukushima prefecture on Monday evening temporarily cutting power and forcing workers to evacuate the nuclear plant.

Nearly 28,000 Japanese are dead or missing and the world's third-largest economy is reeling with power blackouts, factory c closures and cuts to supply lines.

The Kyodo reported on Tuesday that the high levels of radiation that have been released by the Fukushima Daiichi plant meant it could raise the severity level from 5 to the highest 7, the same as the 1986 Chernobyl accident.

"It has been obvious all along this was a 7. There are three reactors that are not being cooled (No. 1, 2 &3) and four fuel pools too (No. 1, 2, 3, and especially 4)," said Arnie Gundersen, a 29-year veteran of the nuclear industry who worked on reactors similar to those at Daiichi and who is now chief engineer at Fairewinds Associates Inc of Burlington, Vermont.

He said that means there were at least seven cores or pools that had been in difficulty. He noted that at Chernobyl it was only one reactor that created the problem.

A spokesman for the Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, Japan's nuclear safety watchdog, said he was unaware of any move by the government to raise the level.

EVACUATION ZONE WIDENS
Because of accumulated radiation contamination, the government is encouraging people to leave certain areas beyond its 20 km (12 mile) exclusion zone around the plant. Thousands of people could be affected by the move.

Link -
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/12/japan-idUSL3E7FB2TZ20110412?pageNumber...
======================================
At this point, even iF the TEPCO or government spokesperson was named FRANK CARE, I would have great difficulty in believing that he would be FRANK & Honest, in passing on all of the corect information!


Japan Raises Nuclear Accident to Chernobyl Level on Radiation


April 12 (Bloomberg) -- Japan raised the severity rating of its nuclear crisis to the highest, matching the 1986 Chernobyl disaster, as increasing radiation prompts the government to widen the evacuation zone and aftershocks rocked the country.

Japan’s Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency raised the rating to 7, a spokesman said at a news conference in Tokyo today.

The government “is at last beginning to wake up to the reality of the scale of the disaster,” said Philip White, International Liaison Officer at the Citizens’ Nuclear Information Center, a Tokyo-based group opposed to atomic energy. “Its belated move to evacuate people from a larger area around the nuclear plant, likewise, is a recognition that the impact on public health is potentially much greater than it first acknowledged.”

Contaminated Water
Tepco is using emergency equipment to cool reactors damaged at the atomic station after backup generators were knocked out by the tsunami.

The utility is trying to remove highly contaminated water that’s holding up efforts to get the cooling pumps working and prevent further explosions after blasts damaged reactor containment vessels, releasing radiation into the air and sea and tainting food. Yesterday’s earthquake halted the pumping of contaminated water from the No. 2 reactor, Tepco said.

About 60,000 metric tons of contaminated water lies in the basements of turbine buildings and trenches around the No. 1, 2 and 3 reactors, the company said last week.

“If it doesn’t find a long term solution to the large quantities of highly radioactive water flowing out of the reactors, the scale of the disaster could end up exceeding Chernobyl,”
White, from the Citizens’ Nuclear Information Center, said by telephone today.

Link -
http://noir.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=at4GqCg0PphI
======================
A few observations -
1) It is intresting that the spokesman for Japan's Nuclear and Industrial Safety Agency, in the first article, didn't know that an upgrade to INES 7 was being considered, then a couple of hours later, it was upgraded. Timing perhaps, OR?

2) After steadfastly refusing, for a whole month, that this was/is a really large problem,
why move on the INES 7 admission NOW?
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Re: Japan Nuclear Disaster-Bigger Than Chernobyl.
Reply #149 - Apr 12th, 2011 at 2:43pm
 
Equitist wrote on Apr 12th, 2011 at 11:08am:
BTW, how is it that Japan (or any other nation) has been in a position to do its own conservative rating of a nuke disaster in any event!?

So bizarre...


This is a good point and desrcibes the rediculous international standards that exist (or dont exist) concerning nuclear power plants (waste dumps and weapons)

In fact the French leader Sarkozy was calling for international standards and regulation of nuclear power facilities after the Fukushima disaster.

Bit late dont you think?

Even the IAEA is really just a body that promotes nuclear power - notice how they are in hiding at the moment saying well we really cant do much.

LOL

My main fear from Nuclear power are the reacotrs in Pakistan and India (trerrorist targets waiting for an opening)

now long did the Japanese hold on to a rating 4? Even after the explosions?

...
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