Australian Politics Forum - Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #30 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:26pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:16pm:

The United States should also be kept to a % level of their 2000 levels.

Even George W Bush admitted the USA were prepared to accept that if a level playing field of China and India were capped to their 2000 levels as well.

Fair is fair.

So Bush was willing to limit the USA's emissions to an incredibly high number, provided China and India remained peasant societies.

How generous of him.

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buzzanddidj

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #31 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:42pm

perceptions_now wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:15pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 12:40pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 12:22pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:50am:

Please delete wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:44am:

If western nations reduce emmisions overall by 20 units, and China & India increase theirs by ONLY 20 units, we slow the effects. Is that so wrong to you?

Do you really not see the problem in that statement??

Why are we handing out Get out of Jail Free cards to two of three worst polluters on the planet?

Only an accountant could skew figures in that manner
China has over

SIXTY THREE TIMES

the population of Australia
India, almost,

FIFTY SEVEN TIMES

To suggest that Australia's emissions should be compared to EITHER is

LAUGHABLE

Of COURSE they are larger, as a combined total
Proportionally, they are MUCH lower

The world doesn't work in proportional terms.
It works in total terms.

We need them to remain third world for our sake.

Andrei,
You do realise just how laughable that is, don't you?

Perhaps we, in "the west", should cut our carbon footprints down to meet those of the average Chinese or Indian ?

Impossible ?

PROBABLY

Maybe we should meet them half-way - in a manner of

COMPROMISE

?

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Andrei.Hicks

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #32 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:47pm

Let's not divert away from the issue here.

A SIGNIFICANT CEO of an AUSTRALIAN company which employs thousands of workers has criticised the way in which this has been handled and HIGHLIGHTED in numerous ways how this is bad for Australia and does NOTHING about emissions in his field.

How is that not concerning to you?

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Please delete Gold Member Offline Please delete this smacking PROFILE Posts: 2936	Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax Reply #33 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:48pm Hicks is just putting up something impossible (like Bush did) as a way of doing nothing. How that helps the world is beyond me. Do you believe in the rapture hicks?
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perceptions_now

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #34 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:50pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:16pm:

perceptions_now wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:15pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 12:40pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 12:22pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:50am:

Please delete wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:44am:

If western nations reduce emmisions overall by 20 units, and China & India increase theirs by ONLY 20 units, we slow the effects. Is that so wrong to you?

Do you really not see the problem in that statement??

Why are we handing out Get out of Jail Free cards to two of three worst polluters on the planet?

Only an accountant could skew figures in that manner
China has over

SIXTY THREE TIMES

the population of Australia
India, almost,

FIFTY SEVEN TIMES

To suggest that Australia's emissions should be compared to EITHER is

LAUGHABLE

Of COURSE they are larger, as a combined total
Proportionally, they are MUCH lower

The world doesn't work in proportional terms.
It works in total terms.

We need them to remain third world for our sake.

Andrei,
You do realise just how laughable that is, don't you?

I don't find trying to keep emissions down laughable PN.

No, I had a Suspicion that it may not have ocurred to you, but don't you think the Chinese, Indians and a few others, may think what you said, was laughable!

In essence, what you said is, it's ok for somebody else to pay the price, "so long as we are ok, Jack"!

You said earlier somewhere, "the world just doesn't work that way"!

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cods

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #35 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:51pm

buzzanddidj wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:06am:

THE world's biggest mining company, BHP Billiton, is urging the Gillard government to impose a tax on carbon before any international agreement.

This is in order to protect Australia's long-term economic interests.

Mr Kloppers's call for a carbon tax undermines the passionate objections of Tony Abbott to setting a price on carbon before there is a global consensus.

"We do believe that such a global initiative will eventually come and, when it does, Australia will need to have acted ahead of it to maintain its competitiveness,"

Mr Kloppers told a packed Australian British Chamber of Commerce lunch in Sydney.

"Carbon emissions need to have a cost impact in order to cause the consumer and companies to change behaviour and favour low-carbon alternatives.

"We all recognise this is a politically charged subject. No government relishes telling people that things need to cost more

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/bhp-boss-marius-kloppers-its-time-for-carbon-tax...

wouldnt this make our prices higher than anyone elses????

being first seems to me to send a lot of our customers elsewhere..

have you noticed its now" consumers "that are getting the blame for all this smog/carbon/emmissions/dirt...lol.. why not..

stop the consumer consuming and it will make the world go round...yeah right..

we get blamed for the plastic bags

no one says we had the foisted on us.. suddenly there wasnt anything else to use.. its the consumers fault.

then there the govt subs for the car industry get out and buy a brand new car and we will pay you $2000 for you clunker..but then wait for it... its your fault you are a consumer..

so we will put petrol out of your reach unless you are a rich consumer who can afford 8 cars and is therefore keeping the car industry going....????????????????????????

its a crazy mixed up world..

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perceptions_now

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #36 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:56pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:47pm:

Let's not divert away from the issue here.

A SIGNIFICANT CEO of an AUSTRALIAN company which employs thousands of workers has criticised the way in which this has been handled and HIGHLIGHTED in numerous ways how this is bad for Australia and does NOTHING about emissions in his field.

How is that not concerning to you?

I'm afraid my opinion of most CEO's, in the current circumstances, is that they are of no more use -
than the "proverbial drovers dog"!
OR "tits on a bull"!
OR 99% of Politicians?

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buzzanddidj

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #37 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 2:04pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:47pm:

Let's not divert away from the issue here.

A SIGNIFICANT CEO of an AUSTRALIAN company which employs thousands of workers has criticised the way in which this has been handled and HIGHLIGHTED in numerous ways how this is bad for Australia and does NOTHING about emissions in his field.

How is that not concerning to you?

And another

"SIGNIFICANT CEO of an AUSTRALIAN company which employs thousands of workers"

has said a carbon tax is pressing and vital

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'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.
Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

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philperth2010 Gold Member Offline Australian Politics Posts: 21097 Perth Gender:	Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax Reply #38 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:30pm BlueScope Steel do not care about Australia or Australians......They buy companies......force them to buy there product.....then drive them into the ground......BlueScope Steel do not care about jobs they only care about profits.....Paul O'Malley can get stuffed!!!
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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #39 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:50pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:30am:

But to make steel - you cannot make steel through the blast furnace technology without emitting carbon, whether it's made in Australia, whether it's made in Korea, Taiwan, China or Japan. Those producers send steel to Australia and compete with us. They are emitting carbon, and on average we're more efficient in producing steel with less carbon than those companies that import into Australia. So if you shut us down, you don't actually reduce the amount of carbon because steel will still come into Australia. That's the bit that doesn't make sense

++++++++++++++++++

I think THIS more than anything underlines the nonsensical folly of it all.

It remind me of what we do in accounting to report a profit. We move items to other areas.
I know it made a loss, the CFO knows it made a loss, deep down the analysts know it made a loss but we all talk about a profit.

It's the same here, we'd allow carbon emitters to import into Australia and yet curtail Australian businesses from doing the same process?

What do we achieve?

Well we push it offshore. How is that affecting world emissions??

It's not.

Madness and it reeks of well, any dealing I have ever had with a Government or public sector.

Smoke and mirrors.

And they call us Accountants bad?

Geez you are one dodgy little loser! Wink

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #40 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:53pm

cods wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:51pm:

buzzanddidj wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:06am:

THE world's biggest mining company, BHP Billiton, is urging the Gillard government to impose a tax on carbon before any international agreement.

This is in order to protect Australia's long-term economic interests.

Mr Kloppers's call for a carbon tax undermines the passionate objections of Tony Abbott to setting a price on carbon before there is a global consensus.

"We do believe that such a global initiative will eventually come and, when it does, Australia will need to have acted ahead of it to maintain its competitiveness,"

Mr Kloppers told a packed Australian British Chamber of Commerce lunch in Sydney.

"Carbon emissions need to have a cost impact in order to cause the consumer and companies to change behaviour and favour low-carbon alternatives.

"We all recognise this is a politically charged subject. No government relishes telling people that things need to cost more

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/bhp-boss-marius-kloppers-its-time-for-carbon-tax...

wouldnt this make our prices higher than anyone elses????

being first seems to me to send a lot of our customers elsewhere..

have you noticed its now" consumers "that are getting the blame for all this smog/carbon/emmissions/dirt...lol.. why not..

stop the consumer consuming and it will make the world go round...yeah right..

we get blamed for the plastic bags

no one says we had the foisted on us.. suddenly there wasnt anything else to use.. its the consumers fault.

then there the govt subs for the car industry get out and buy a brand new car and we will pay you $2000 for you clunker..but then wait for it... its your fault you are a consumer..

so we will put petrol out of your reach unless you are a rich consumer who can afford 8 cars and is therefore keeping the car industry going....????????????????????????

its a crazy mixed up world..

We should call you Mr Bamboozler.... or was that Mrs Bamboozler ?!?

Grin

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #41 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:56pm

perceptions_now wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:50pm:

No, I had a Suspicion that it may not have ocurred to you, but don't you think the Chinese, Indians and a few others, may think what you said, was laughable!

In essence, what you said is, it's ok for somebody else to pay the price, "so long as we are ok, Jack"!

You said earlier somewhere, "the world just doesn't work that way"!

Andrei is the Mr Bamboozler to the Mrs identified above! Cry

YUCK!

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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philperth2010

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #42 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:58pm

perceptions_now wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:56pm:

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 1:47pm:

Let's not divert away from the issue here.

A SIGNIFICANT CEO of an AUSTRALIAN company which employs thousands of workers has criticised the way in which this has been handled and HIGHLIGHTED in numerous ways how this is bad for Australia and does NOTHING about emissions in his field.

How is that not concerning to you?

I'm afraid my opinion of most CEO's, in the current circumstances, is that they are of no more use -
than the "proverbial drovers dog"!
OR "tits on a bull"!
OR 99% of Politicians?

Agreed!!!

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If knowledge can create problems, it is not through ignorance that we can solve them.
Isaac Asimov (1920 - 1992)

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #43 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 4:58pm

Andrei.Hicks wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:33am:

In fairness and interests of related party views and all that I will declare I am a shareholder in both BHP Billiton and Bluescope Steel.

(Yep as well as Monstanto too Buzz

)

NO ONE CARES: A TOSSER IS A TOSSER!

NO ONE CARES: A TOSSER IS A TOSSER!

NO ONE CARES: A TOSSER IS A TOSSER!

NO ONE CARES: A TOSSER IS A TOSSER! Cool

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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BatteriesNotIncluded

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Re: Bluescope Steel CEO on Carbon Tax
Reply #44 - Mar 1^st, 2011 at 5:02pm

Please delete wrote on Mar 1^st, 2011 at 11:39am:

"It remind me of what we do in accounting to report a profit. We move items to other areas.
I know it made a loss, the CFO knows it made a loss, deep down the analysts know it made a loss but we all talk about a profit."

What an interesting comment. Reminds me of another argument I read, about government debt.

You argue about carbon emmisions as if you believe that they are a problem hicks, isn't that sort of contradictory?

THEY ARE SO SPLIT: TONY HAS TO GO AS HE CANNOT MAINTAIN A CLEAR ARGUMENT, THAT IS WHY TURNBULL IS ALWAYS SEEN OF LATE TRYING TO SPELL THINGS OUT!

THIS SITUATION IS UNSUSTAINABLE, HENCE TONY IS GONE.

I CAN'T SEE JULIE BISHOP MAINTAINING HER POST AS SHE IS OBVIOUSLY OF VERY LITTLE SUPPORT! Wink

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*Sure....they're anti competitive as any subsidised job is. It wouldn't be there without the tax payer. Very damned difficult for a brainwashed collectivist to understand that I know.... (swaggy) *

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