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Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo (Read 3600 times)
Andrei.Hicks
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #15 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 3:26pm
 
Dsmithy70 wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 3:22pm:
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 3:09pm:
I'm sorry but personal experience for us tells a different story.

We had a baby exactly same time as friends of ours (a month apart).

They went public, we were private.

The difference was massive. We had 4 days of care, my wife was relaxed, we had fantastic facilities etc.
The public system, I kid you not, they were sent home next day with a "here's your baby away you go" attitude.

It cost us next to nothing because the private insurer paid for it and we were able to pay for it because we had a 30% rebate.

Now I am sorry you throw up all the stats you want, you will not convince me that we didn't do well out of it in comparison to our friends.


yes that's all well & good Andrei, you paid, you booked & got a good result.
However as it has been proven if your wife was going to breech or some other difficult procedure was necessary you would have been duck shoved to a public hospitial.
BTW - My daughter was born in public, in a very comfortable birthing suite with private ensuite including large bath & my wife stayed 3 days after the birth & on that last night we were encouraged to go out for dinner before we took her home.



Fair enough smithy - I can only go by what I have been told. As is most of my experience with anything in the public sector (  Smiley )

But my friends were at the Royal Women's and he told me they had a shocker - mainly because of just sheer numbers.
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #16 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 3:38pm
 


Here's another pertinent article - complete with graph - which demonstrates the con that is the Private Health Insurance Rebate: -

http://www.melbourneinstitute.com/miaesr/news/opeds/JY_080719_health_insurance.h...

Quote:
Time to review health insurance policy

The Weekend Australian,
19-20 July 2008, p. 16 (Weekend Professional Health)

THAT there is much objection to raising the income thresholds under the Medicare levy surcharge is puzzling.

We should remind ourselves that the surcharge was introduced to "encourage" high-income earners to buy private health insurance. The old income thresholds of $50,000 for singles, and $100,000 for families, were put in place in 1997-98. Individuals and families earning these income figures could perhaps be considered well-off in 1997, but could hardly qualify as high-income earners nowadays, considering how much petrol prices, interest rates and house prices have increased.

Raising the income thresholds is not only being true to the spirit of the original intention of the surcharge, but also serves a more important purpose of removing an anomaly in the Australian health system: that consumers buy health insurance not because they need it, but on the advice of their accountants.

Many people, especially the young, buy private hospital insurance to avoid the surcharge but do not intend to use it due to high excesses; rather, they would elect to be admitted as public patients should they need hospital care.

While raising the income thresholds would prompt some people to drop their private hospital cover, it is not at all obvious that this lower coverage would lead to catastrophic outcomes for our public hospitals. The belief that fewer people covered by private health insurance is synonymous with greater pressure on public hospitals is misguided.

Let's take a closer look at hospital utilisation before and after the private health insurance policy reforms in the late 1990s. Immediately after the 1997-2000 policy reforms, national coverage of private health insurance went up from about 31 per cent to 44 per cent. The increase of 42 per cent took place between December 1999 and June 2000 and is massive by any measure.

Was there a drastic easing of pressure on public hospitals? Did the government spend less on public hospitals?

Let's compare hospital statistics three years before and after the massive jump in coverage using published AIHW data. We look at three different statistics on public acute hospitals: separations (number of discharges), patient days and government expenditure on public acute hospitals.

The first two are common measures of hospital output, which indicates utilisation. The last measure gives an indication of whether there is any break in government spending patterns on public hospitals.

The graph shows that separations (the middle curve) at public acute hospitals were growing at about the same rate before and after the jump in coverage, while patient days (the bottom curve) were declining (growth rates were negative) before the jump in coverage, but were increasing thereafter. Both measures show no discernible improvement in terms of public hospital utilisation.

In terms of government spending on public hospitals, spending continued to increase: the average annual growth rate was 8.1 per cent during 1996/97-1998/99, but was 8.9 per cent during 2001/02-2003/04. Thus, following a 42 per cent increase in private hospital coverage, we see no corresponding decline in public hospital utilisation, nor any change in government spending on public hospitals.

Now the puzzle: if a 42 per cent increase in private health insurance coverage did nothing to relieve the pressure on public hospitals, why would raising the income thresholds (which may lead to a decline in private health insurance membership, but surely not by 42 per cent) result in catastrophic outcomes for public hospitals?

In fact, I would submit that tinkering with the income thresholds is not enough. Given this budget's focus on containing inflation, it is time for the government to review the entire private health insurance policy, particularly the 30 per cent premium rebate.

The rebate has been costing the government well over $3 billion a year, but what does it buy for Australia? When it was introduced in 1998/99, it did help in raising the private health insurance coverage. But as the graph shows, this increase did nothing to ease the pressure on public hospitals.

Furthermore, research at the Melbourne Institute shows that between 35 to 55 per cent of the $3 billion-plus subsidy is a total waste of money in so far as inducing high-income earners to buy insurance. These people have already had, and will continue to have, insurance whether they get a 30 per cent rebate or not.

What is certain is that the subsidy improves the financial performance of health funds. Gross industry margins have been increasing steadily from around 10 per cent in 2001-02 to 15 per cent in 2006-07. Little wonder the health funds fought tooth and nail to keep membership at current levels.

Jongsay Yong is Senior Research Fellow at the Melbourne Institute of Applied Economic and Social Research



...

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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #17 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 4:44pm
 


Hey Bogey et al!

It was only a matter of time...


http://www.ozpolitic.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1297924677/0#0

salad in wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 4:37pm:
Quote:
Hospital shame as Tracey Lake miscarries baby in toilet

A PREGNANT woman was made to wait nearly two hours at a Melbourne hospital emergency department before she lost her baby in the toilet.

And it was more than four hours before Tracey Lake - who was 10 to 12 weeks pregnant - even saw a doctor at Frankston Hospital, her family says.

http://www.news.com.au/national/hospital-shame-as-mum-loses-baby-miscarries-baby...


Should Tracey change her name to Fatima Afrah in order to attract funding to meet her medical needs? Why is it that there is no limit to the money spent on asylum shoppers yet apparently the health budget has been snipped? Why is it that we can fly mourners from Christmas Island to attend a funeral yet at the same time we ask an Australian to deal with her miscarriage in a toilet?

If we have a compassionate government in power what are the limits if any of that compassion? Does that compassion extend to AUSTRALIANS in need of medical attention?




WTF!?


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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #18 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 4:55pm
 
not sure what this has to do with this young womans treatment...hasnt the govt put in heaps more money to stop this sort of thing... I mean the waiting I cant think of anything worse than sitting in a waiting room whilst you are losing a baby...its horrific..I too had a miss.. and it was horrible and painful. what is going on dont we care anymore?????..

looking at these posts its all about money..why would anyone miscarrying get in a queue for gods sakes.. if she was left there for 2 hours.!!!!!!!!!!!dont tell me no one entered triage as its now called in all that time?
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #19 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 5:08pm
 
cods wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 4:55pm:
not sure what this has to do with this young womans treatment...hasnt the govt put in heaps more money to stop this sort of thing... I mean the waiting I cant think of anything worse than sitting in a waiting room whilst you are losing a baby...its horrific..I too had a miss.. and it was horrible and painful. what is going on dont we care anymore?????..

looking at these posts its all about money..why would anyone miscarrying get in a queue for gods sakes.. if she was left there for 2 hours.!!!!!!!!!!!dont tell me no one entered triage as its now called in all that time?

Unfortunately Cods EVERYTHING today comes back to money Sad
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #20 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 6:54pm
 
A poor woman was sent to a hospital by her GP for emergency treatment, doest get it, has a miscarriage and still doesnt get treatment for another 2 hours and you bastards are arguing over smacking private health care rebates.

Sick, just sick that you want to use this poor womans tragety and twists it so far out to make it suit your agenda.

How Mellie of you thy.
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #21 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 7:42pm
 
Whatever your thoughts currently, on Healh Care, the system is set for some enormous prolems over the next 5-10-20-40 years, as Demand surges arising from an Aging population and Supply declines, arising from a large Decline in Health Care Professionals.

eg - Take Japan now & multiply by 50?
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #22 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:12pm
 
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 2:28pm:
Sorry I was just reading the other day what world class health facilities you have in Australia.

I mean that would why you pay over $15,000 more in tax than I do per year right??

I mean that's what you guys told me......

Only the other day a healthcare professional called Victoria's healthcare system (after a decade of state mis-management) described the system as "embarrassing".

So you pay way more in tax and both the main states have a shitehouse healthcare.

Goes to show who is right and who is wrong eh?





In the US, she wouldn't have MADE it to the toilet - until reception had verified her insurance details




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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #23 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:15pm
 


perceptions_now wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 7:42pm:
Whatever your thoughts currently, on Healh Care, the system is set for some enormous prolems over the next 5-10-20-40 years, as Demand surges arising from an Aging population and Supply declines, arising from a large Decline in Health Care Professionals.

eg - Take Japan now & multiply by 50?


Yup, there's big changes ahead - including massive costs increases associated with new discoveries and technology improvements...

That said, regardless of medicines and technology, health care is necessarily a labour intensive sector - and we will need to plan ahead to ensure that our medico's and nurses are well-educated and  well-resourced...

What we won't be able to afford, is to facilitate tight control over the health sector by parasitic multinational corporations - in particular, there needs to be limits on how much pharmaceutical and insurance companies can profit out of the vulnerability and misery of human beings...

We need to seriously reconsider the risks associated with over-privatisation of health care - including health insurance - and the nature and extent of public subsidies to pseudo-Private health services...

This must be considered across the world - but in a small population and vast land mass country like Australia, we must be mindful of waste and duplication - especially of surplus capacity in facilities and equipment (and under-utilisation of scarce trained medical and nursing staff) because economies of scale cannot be achieved...

Another issue that will potentially raise its ugly head more and more,  will be official age caps arbitrarily placed by bean counters and actuaries on a range of procedures - especially those that require costly prostheses and/or rehabilitation...

The other obvious issue that is yet to be properly debated is the balancing of the methods and high costs (and psycho-socio-economic impacts) of aged care and palliative care over a long period v's accelerated voluntary euthanasia (right now, it may be illegal but the demographic pressures alone will soon mean that religious-based restriction is not sustainable)...

Oh, and the Superannuation-cum-Pensions rorts will need to be addressed sooner rather than later - because both the nominal and opportunity costs will soon become too enormous to sweep into budget black holes...

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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #24 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:29pm
 


Verge wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 6:54pm:
A poor woman was sent to a hospital by her GP for emergency treatment, doest get it, has a miscarriage and still doesnt get treatment for another 2 hours and you bastards are arguing over smacking private health care rebates.

Sick, just sick that you want to use this poor womans tragety and twists it so far out to make it suit your agenda.

How Mellie of you thy.



C'mon, Verge, I'm sure that you recall a similar debate over that woman's miscarriage in a toilet at the run-down Royal North Shore Hospital in North Sydney - which was nauseatingly-politicised by Joe Jockstrap and other right whingers!?

You will no doubt recall that I have some knowledge and clinical experience in these matters - from studying Midwifery Nursing and working in Maternity Wards and that several of my own (potential) offspring were miscarried (including one 'failed miscarriage' that resulted in a curette - just as happened in this Victorian woman's case)...

At the time of that infamous NSW case, you will recall that I tried to urge people not to politicise it - and that I was disgusted that the grieving woman and her partner were being exploited by the media...

You will remember that I pointed out that North Sydney Private Hospital and Royal North Shore Hospital share the same campus - and that the couple would have been sent away altogether had they ventured into the opulent North Sydney Private (regardless of whether they were privately insured)...

Besides, ye and me both know that this thread would be huge by now - and filled with a barrage of anti-Lab vitriol - if my mischievious thread title had been accurate...



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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #25 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:37pm
 
All countries struggle with health policy and supporting the sick and infirmed.....Wars help to cull the population and direct revenue to select groups....Nothing is done without reason unless you are crazy!!!

Wink
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #26 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:38pm
 
<<North Sydney Private Hospital and Royal North Shore Hospital share the same campus>>


People that think they know everything amuse me.

Shows what you know thy. Bugger all.

There is no such hospital as North Sydney Private Hospital.

Try North Shore Private. Always has been.
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #27 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:50pm
 
Equitist wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:29pm:
Verge wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 6:54pm:
A poor woman was sent to a hospital by her GP for emergency treatment, doest get it, has a miscarriage and still doesnt get treatment for another 2 hours and you bastards are arguing over smacking private health care rebates.

Sick, just sick that you want to use this poor womans tragety and twists it so far out to make it suit your agenda.

How Mellie of you thy.



C'mon, Verge, I'm sure that you recall a similar debate over that woman's miscarriage in a toilet at the run-down Royal North Shore Hospital in North Sydney - which was nauseatingly-politicised by Joe Jockstrap and other right whingers!?

You will no doubt recall that I have some knowledge and clinical experience in these matters - from studying Midwifery Nursing and working in Maternity Wards and that several of my own (potential) offspring were miscarried (including one 'failed miscarriage' that resulted in a curette - just as happened in this Victorian woman's case)...

At the time of that infamous NSW case, you will recall that I tried to urge people not to politicise it - and that I was disgusted that the grieving woman and her partner were being exploited by the media...

You will remember that I pointed out that North Sydney Private Hospital and Royal North Shore Hospital share the same campus - and that the couple would have been sent away altogether had they ventured into the opulent North Sydney Private (regardless of whether they were privately insured)...

Besides, ye and me both know that this thread would be huge by now - and filled with a barrage of anti-Lab vitriol - if my mischievious thread title had been accurate...





And you yourself have tried to politicise this for your own benefit.

The woman, regardless of whether or not she was going to save her baby or not, was poorly treated by the hospital staff and in all honesty had that been my wife I would have been making a song and dance long before the 2 hour mark.    I also know I would have taken a swing at the Doctor when he finally decided to show up.

Dont give me the crap about hospitals under resourced or making it a political issue, it was lazy staff who failed to show due dilligence.
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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #28 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:52pm
 

buzzanddidj wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:12pm:
Andrei.Hicks wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 2:28pm:
Sorry I was just reading the other day what world class health facilities you have in Australia.

I mean that would why you pay over $15,000 more in tax than I do per year right??

I mean that's what you guys told me......

Only the other day a healthcare professional called Victoria's healthcare system (after a decade of state mis-management) described the system as "embarrassing".

So you pay way more in tax and both the main states have a shitehouse healthcare.

Goes to show who is right and who is wrong eh?



In the US, she wouldn't have MADE it to the toilet - until reception had verified her insurance details





True - and she would have had to have MADE it past the gun-toting security guards who would have subjected her to a pat-down for guns, knives and explosives (just like she would experience on a daily basis if she had a child in formal pre-school child handling)...

Roll Eyes

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Re: Neglected woman miscarries in NSW hospital loo
Reply #29 - Feb 17th, 2011 at 9:01pm
 


whatsforme wrote on Feb 17th, 2011 at 8:38pm:
<<North Sydney Private Hospital and Royal North Shore Hospital share the same campus>>


People that think they know everything amuse me.

Shows what you know thy. Bugger all.

There is no such hospital as North Sydney Private Hospital.

Try North Shore Private. Always has been.



Yup, you are correct, it is North Shore Private - my mistake!

Although I have never personally been a patient of North Shore Private, I am familiar with the place as: my father has undergone surgery there, and; my son has on several occasions attended upon a hand surgeon who operates out of there (he was actually booked in for surgery there back in 2006 but there was a last minute change of plans and the surgery was later done at Sydney Children's Hospital at Randwick)...

Over the years, at least four members of my family have undergone a range of surgical procedures at Royal North Shore Hospital - plus quite a few day-stay testing procedures and been treated as long-term outpatients...

The juxtaposition of decadent opulence and under-funded decay is obvious - thanks to Joe Jockstrap, Tony Abbott, John Howard & Co!


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